The 1 & Only Nintendo E3 2005 Discussion Thread
05-13-05 | 09:21 AM
#51
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Originally Posted by darkside
Nintendo has already hinted that their next console would not appeal to third parties, so maybe they are going for less horsepower and more innovation. I'll wait till the thing actually gets announced before I piss all over them though.
05-13-05 | 09:24 AM
#52
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From: Blu-Ray: We Don't Need No Stinkin' Petition
Originally Posted by PixyJunket
You've firmly verified where you're pulling your comments from after your "tried-and-true" Sega remark. I don't remember anybody ever saying the Gamecube was more powerful than the Xbox. You're reading (and writing) things that aren't there to fit your agenda. Thinking that the Gamecube is less powerful than the Xbox simply because it's smaller, that's awesome. Thinking that putting a powerful system in a small case is impossible, that's awesome. With all your sales pitches on the PSP surely you have to see what's possible in small sizes.
Realize that my comment that the GameCube is less powerful is not generated by size, but by listed specs by both companies. GameCube could have easily had as much raw power as Xbox, but it wouldn't have fit in that small case. You sacrifice power for less size. This is easily seen in all portable anything.
The PSP has the same potential power (it is currently being limited because of battery constraints) of 5 year old technology found in the PS2. Sony had to go back 5 years in technology progression to make it work in the portable scene. If size had nothing to do with it (assuming batteries were infinite), then the PSP should be slightly less powerful than the Xbox360 as it came out a year before it. The fact is, size restrains power. The system will be powerful, just not as powerful as the Xbox360 or PS3... that is all I said.
05-13-05 | 09:29 AM
#53
DVD Talk Legend
Originally Posted by PixyJunket
Speaking of, hasn't Nintendo has been saying their system WILL appeal to third parties or did you make a typo?
05-13-05 | 09:35 AM
#54
DVD Talk Godfather
Originally Posted by joshd2012
Realize that my comment that the GameCube is less powerful is not generated by size, but by listed specs by both companies. GameCube could have easily had as much raw power as Xbox, but it wouldn't have fit in that small case.
05-13-05 | 10:03 AM
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From: Blu-Ray: We Don't Need No Stinkin' Petition
Originally Posted by Michael Corvin
I know what you are saying and agree to an extent, but it isn't just about specs. It is about HOW the 1s and 0s are processed. There are many games on GCN with killer graphics that look just as good if not better than all but a handfull of Xbox games. The programmers just need to know how to push the envelope of the system.
05-13-05 | 10:05 AM
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Originally Posted by Michael Corvin
I know what you are saying and agree to an extent, but it isn't just about specs. It is about HOW the 1s and 0s are processed. There are many games on GCN with killer graphics that look just as good if not better than all but a handfull of Xbox games. The programmers just need to know how to push the envelope of the system.
but have learned its largly a waste hear on this forum. What Josh says is true to an extent when comparing certain types of technology. However there are exceptions to this "rule" that he overlooks for the sake of his arguement.For example, one exception is decreasing the die size on a chip will actually allow for a more powerful and cooler running processor, so you can get both. This ability to make things smaller at a cost effective rate of course is a function of time. Will the extra 6-12 months of time before release be enough to for them really to capitalize on something like this? I doubt it.
Anyway, what I really wanted to say, of the current generation, I still put Metroid Prime and RE4 above anything on Xbox of this generation. I have a feeling the new Zelda might make that list too.
05-13-05 | 10:10 AM
#57
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Originally Posted by joshd2012
Definitely. There is a wall that programmers are trying to hit, and the better ones get closer than others. But once that wall is hit, there is no more to gain. I'm not arguing that you couldn't produce a better looking/playing game on the GC than on the Xbox - because different programmers will put in different amounts of effort to maximize. But I am saying that if you had the same programmer working on both machines for the same amount of time, maximizing the same amount of code, then the Xbox version would run better because of the raw power inside.
Surly time and power are related, but there is a far greater linear relationship between tools and time then power and time.
05-13-05 | 10:24 AM
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From: Blu-Ray: We Don't Need No Stinkin' Petition
Originally Posted by jeffdsmith
Not sure what "better" is implying but I'm going to say: Nope, not correct at all. Common fallacy. What you describe is a function of the developer tools available to the programmer, these are why you can't argue that time being the same the game on the more powerful system would be "better".
Surly time and power are related, but there is a far greater linear relationship between tools and time then power and time.
Surly time and power are related, but there is a far greater linear relationship between tools and time then power and time.
Better is subjective, because everyone has their preferences. If a game on the NES meets all your preferences on the perfect game, then there is no reason to need the power. But me, I like advancing technology - the next big thing. If one game can take Super Mario Brothers and improve on it using current technology, then that makes it a better game in my definition. You may think that ruins the game.
05-13-05 | 10:39 AM
#59
DVD Talk Legend
I think the power differences will end up the same way as this generation with games looking slightly better on one than the other, but overall playing the same. Having the worst looking games didn't hurt Sony at all this generation so I see no reason for Nintendo to worry about it.
It will come down to exclusive software and how much fun the games are to play. The polygon counts are not going to decide the winners this generation the gameplay will. Sony rode GTA3 and good third party support to a win last time out. Nintendo and Microsoft will have to find a killer app or two and get the third parties on their side if they want to have Sony's success. Granted Nintendo is going to go about things entirely different from Sony and MS so we will just have to wait and see.
It will come down to exclusive software and how much fun the games are to play. The polygon counts are not going to decide the winners this generation the gameplay will. Sony rode GTA3 and good third party support to a win last time out. Nintendo and Microsoft will have to find a killer app or two and get the third parties on their side if they want to have Sony's success. Granted Nintendo is going to go about things entirely different from Sony and MS so we will just have to wait and see.
05-13-05 | 10:46 AM
#60
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Originally Posted by darkside
I can guarantee that the horsepower of the PS3, Xbox360 and Revolution will have zero impact on my decision to buy one. The Xbox360 has some amazing hardware specs and games that look only slightly better than Xbox games to this point.
Exactly. We're not going to see much of a jump in graphics this gen, certainly nothing like coming from the crap ass graphics on the PS1 and N64 until this gen.
Graphics aren't going to sell consoles to anyone other than hardcore graphic whores who cream their pants over a few more polygons and higher res textures.
Full HD support will make games look better as well, but most gamers don't have HD TV's yet so that's not going to be a gigantic factor after launch.
Originally Posted by darkside
Nintendo has already hinted that their next console would not appeal to third parties, so maybe they are going for less horsepower and more innovation. .
05-13-05 | 12:30 PM
#61
Damnit if the new Animal Crossing can't process the "jiggle" physics I want then it's just not worth buying.
05-13-05 | 03:36 PM
#62
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I noticed that Nintendo has a countdown timer for E3 on their web page. Never seen them do anything like that before E3. Interesting.
Last edited by jeffdsmith; 05-13-05 at 03:56 PM.
05-13-05 | 04:17 PM
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From: Satantonio, Tx
I hope Sony and MS have found a way to speed up load times next-gen because right now they suck. Nintendo is making load times on the Revolution quick. It's the main reason I never repurchased a PS2, over a minute worth of loading for games is ridiculous. It's a factor for me. I really like the way GCN operates and is able to seemlessly go into progressive scan (no changing settings, just a button press). And it's loaded, done.
05-13-05 | 04:20 PM
#65
DVD Talk Legend
I think the load times are more the developer's fault than the hardware's. Each system is capable of handling seamless loading but many developers choose not to take advantage of it. Kingdom Hearts, for example, had load times as seamless as Nintendo's first party stuff.
05-13-05 | 07:11 PM
#66
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Last edited by Flay; 05-13-05 at 07:43 PM.
05-13-05 | 07:27 PM
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From: Blu-Ray: We Don't Need No Stinkin' Petition
Ok, thoughts:
1) Virtual Reality visor looks cool. Wonder how it will be implemented by 3rd party developers?
2) I believe that thing just ripped a DVD in 30 seconds!
3) Play and create your own games! Pimp!
4) No controller - use of sensors in the visor
5) Looks like current generation graphics... maybe they are just giving it a little boost and putting all the funding in that visor?
6) Holy Shit!
1) Virtual Reality visor looks cool. Wonder how it will be implemented by 3rd party developers?
2) I believe that thing just ripped a DVD in 30 seconds!
3) Play and create your own games! Pimp!
4) No controller - use of sensors in the visor
5) Looks like current generation graphics... maybe they are just giving it a little boost and putting all the funding in that visor?
6) Holy Shit!
05-13-05 | 07:32 PM
#70
DVD Talk Legend
That video looks very real and I'm buying one of those bad boys. Damn if Nintendo didn't pull off something amazing after all.
Last edited by darkside; 05-13-05 at 07:38 PM.
05-13-05 | 07:37 PM
#71
DVD Talk Legend
Originally Posted by joshd2012
Ok, thoughts:
1) Virtual Reality visor looks cool. Wonder how it will be implemented by 3rd party developers?
2) I believe that thing just ripped a DVD in 30 seconds!
3) Play and create your own games! Pimp!
4) No controller - use of sensors in the visor
5) Looks like current generation graphics... maybe they are just giving it a little boost and putting all the funding in that visor?
6) Holy Shit!
1) Virtual Reality visor looks cool. Wonder how it will be implemented by 3rd party developers?
2) I believe that thing just ripped a DVD in 30 seconds!
3) Play and create your own games! Pimp!
4) No controller - use of sensors in the visor
5) Looks like current generation graphics... maybe they are just giving it a little boost and putting all the funding in that visor?
6) Holy Shit!
2) I think it was just demonstrating load times. I don't see how it could hold an entire DVD in memory.
3) Not sure how this is going to work ?!?
4) I'm betting there will be a controller option also. I don't think all games will use the moving around feature (Gamecube for instance) but it will be nice to really tackle people while playing Madden on this.
5) It looks better than Cube graphics, but yeah it won't as good as everyone else. However, it is probably 3D like graphics so its going to be a different experience.
6) Yeah, Holy Shit! I give them credit they know they needed to do something very different and they did.
I'm wondering if you can also hook this up to a TV and of course if it will have a regular controller. I'm betting it will if for nothing else playing Cube games.
05-13-05 | 07:38 PM
#72
DVD Talk Legend
W..t..f???
I'd buy that in a heartbeat if they can pull it off. Can't believe after all the comments about the gamecube looking like a purse, that they'd create the revolution to look like a toaster, though!
I'd buy that in a heartbeat if they can pull it off. Can't believe after all the comments about the gamecube looking like a purse, that they'd create the revolution to look like a toaster, though!
05-13-05 | 07:43 PM
#74
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That video is a well produced fake. The Nintendo website says the revolution is 3 DVD cases thick, which disqualifies that toaster.
Link
Link
Nintendo, the world leader in video game innovation, stated loud and clear that they are not to be overlooked in the next generation home console race with the revelation of several unique features of the company's next console system, code name Revolution, to key media outlets. According to the early information, Revolution will combine powerful technology and gaming-focused features in Nintendo's smallest home game console yet.
In its final form, Revolution will be about the thickness of three standard DVD cases and only slightly longer. The versatile Revolution will play either horizontally or vertically, allowing the user total flexibility in setting up a gaming session wherever they have a television.
Thanks to Nintendo's hardware development partners IBM and ATI, the small system will be packed with power that will enable it to wow players with its graphics. Nintendo's legions of loyal fans will be happy to learn that Revolution will be backward compatible, playing both Nintendo GameCube 8cm disks along with its own 12cm optical disks in the same self-loading media drive.
In the next generation, the addition of the Internet will be important to all consoles and particularly important to Nintendo. Revolution will be wireless Internet ready out of the box.
There's much more to Revolution that will be revealed over the coming months, but the combination of its compact size, wireless Internet, backward compatibility, quick start-up time and quiet, low-power operation add up to the start of a great game system. Get ready for the Nintendo Revolution in 2006!
In its final form, Revolution will be about the thickness of three standard DVD cases and only slightly longer. The versatile Revolution will play either horizontally or vertically, allowing the user total flexibility in setting up a gaming session wherever they have a television.
Thanks to Nintendo's hardware development partners IBM and ATI, the small system will be packed with power that will enable it to wow players with its graphics. Nintendo's legions of loyal fans will be happy to learn that Revolution will be backward compatible, playing both Nintendo GameCube 8cm disks along with its own 12cm optical disks in the same self-loading media drive.
In the next generation, the addition of the Internet will be important to all consoles and particularly important to Nintendo. Revolution will be wireless Internet ready out of the box.
There's much more to Revolution that will be revealed over the coming months, but the combination of its compact size, wireless Internet, backward compatibility, quick start-up time and quiet, low-power operation add up to the start of a great game system. Get ready for the Nintendo Revolution in 2006!
Last edited by Flay; 05-13-05 at 07:45 PM.
05-13-05 | 07:45 PM
#75
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Originally Posted by Flay
That video is a well produced fake. The Nintendo website says the revolution is 3 DVD cases thick, which disqualifies that toaster.
.