They're no longer necessary, per the directions in the first post.

I'd rather see this happen than someone fire thirty bullets out of a ten bullet clip, or something like that. Running out of bullets happens.
Yes, the NinaGlare was a little campy, but the evilness of the NinaGlare pulled it off. And as far as the security cams go... I thought that EvilNina and Tony had turned them off so that Gaines couldn't see them interrogate Jamie, so I didn't even think there would be logs to check.
Because a headshot is a lot more graphic than throwing some red-colored water on the stomach of a person's shirt? It's a network television show, so it might have been a concern. Also, AFAIK, gut wounds are a lot more painful and slower, but just as lethal, as head wounds. I figured it was one last middle finger to Teri... "You're going to die slowly and painfully."

Originally posted by Static Cling
I'd rather see this happen than someone fire thirty bullets out of a ten bullet clip, or something like that. Running out of bullets happens.

Running out of bullets is fine. Running out of bullets right at the second he's about to kill him ... that's cheese.

Yes, the NinaGlare was a little campy, but the evilness of the NinaGlare pulled it off. And as far as the security cams go... I thought that EvilNina and Tony had turned them off so that Gaines couldn't see them interrogate Jamie, so I didn't even think there would be logs to check.

NinaGlare was cool looking, but stupid for her to do. Why look into the security cam like that? Again, good thing Jack didn't think to check the security logs hours ago ... that would make too much sense.

Because a headshot is a lot more graphic than throwing some red-colored water on the stomach of a person's shirt? It's a network television show, so it might have been a concern.

Exactly. That's the problem I have. Actually I think they did it so we could see Terri's face at the end. The whole final scenes were contrived around the final shot with Jack and Terri. Not only should Nina have shot Terri when she first saw her, she should have shot her in the head (or heart), but again, that would make too much sense. For me it ruins Terri's death to know that she was kept alive only to manipulate the viewer into feeling bad at the end.

das

Actually, the reason for not having Nina shoot Teri in the head is to keep the audience on the edge of their seats when Jack finally finds Teri, but as the camera panned from Teri's head/face (giving the audience hope), it shows the blood from the gunshot, which is a more effective way to reel in the audience one more time before dashing the audience's hope for a happy ending by doing away with the Teri character.

Nina was one cold-hearted sociopath of an agent. I liked her ruthlessness.

I do account for the possibility that Nina kept Teri alive for the time being in case she needed to use Teri as a hostage to get to the extraction point. But once she thought she had enough time to make it through without "aggressive negotiations" she popped Nina in the stomach, not only to kill her, but her unborn baby as well in a Hallmark card to Jack that she must have really hated having to fake an affair with him.

I was glad to see Jack finish the job on Victor Drazen (though it's such a cliche to have the hero saved by the baddie run out of bullets at the most inopportune time).

Tony was distraught in knowing that the help he gave Nina hurt Jack and his family, Palmer and CTU, plus he probably have the hots for her too. Tony's a wrecked agent, and will have a hard time trusting his instincts in his line of work.

So glad Lady MacPalmer got the boot from Palmer. She was just as evil as Nina in some respects.

I see Palmer giving Jack enough inside clout to cut through lots of red tape in the next season/day of 24.

Good wrap-up to a show whose last 8 of 12 hours/shows were mostly filler. Hopefully the producers will insist on an entirely thought out 24 hours game plan, and not the 12 first hours we got and the patchwork effort afterwards.

I would hope so. I think this finale could have worked much better had the build-up not been so lame. Unfortunately, from all the interviews with producers, they blame the good story-telling of early episodes on the loss of any audience (American audience can't handle a plot from week to week), and they stated that while the format will stay the same, it will be more episodic in nature. I hope that's not the case, as the first 12 hours were very strong, but I fear the show will get dumbed down even further for its second season.

das

About Nina not shooting Teri in the head:

Didn't Nina know about Teri being pregnant? Maybe she wasn't out to really kill Teri but rather to hurt Teri and Jack by perhaps killing her baby.
I thought this was a great episode! Cliched? Yup, but it turned into a cliche after the 2nd half of the show, so I was used to it and rather enjoyed it! I am completely jealous of Mason...he's marrying NINA!!!! NOOOO!! She's MINE!
ahem...
great show!

Neitzl

And here I was thinking there was no way they could do a cliffhanger if next season was an entirely new day.

Skillful manipulation of action/spy/serial cliches is the major genius of the entire series.

I thought Tony might be another mole as well. I was waiting for him to say "I'll take Nina in. You guys go on ahead." and then take off her handcuffs.

And I think even Nina knew it was dumb to look at the camera which is why she destroyed the backup tape. But of course there had to be a backup backup tape. Why not? It's TV.

Watching Palmer go ballistic on that jagoff wife of his was awesome. But I couldn't believe that with all the times she had betrayed him that day he didn't have Secret Service keep an eye on her to keep her from talking to the press. I have to give Penny Johnson credit as an actress because, man, I HATED her. Nice work!

As I said earlier in the thread, it's being rerun at 10:00pm EDT, Thursday, May 23 on FX.

You may have missed it, but Jack's been sort of busy during the past 24 hours. Besides, Nina and Tony told him Jamie killed herself... why, until Jack found out Nina was EvilNina, would he have reason to doubt them?
Neitzl and Patman bring up good points. Teri could've been a VERY effective hostage... the Drazens were taking Jack's family hostage all series so that they could manipulate Jack and CTU. In addition, Nina didn't only shoot Teri, she shot Teri & Jack's baby... I didn't even think about that.

Ah..I see I wasn't the only one who thought about the baby thing. I didn't even read Patman's post or I would have not posted mine due to repeating the same thought...but at least I'm not alone!

Neitzl

I'm no doctor (of medicine), but that fetus was what ... a few weeks old? I think a bullet to the head would have taken care of the baby as effectively as a gut shot. Nina would have to be quite the marksman to put a bullet through the baby itself.

Anyway, we can rationalize things away all we want. In the end, Nina's actions weren't plot related, but motivated by getting the audience into a certain frame of mind. Some people don't mind and in fact enjoy that sort of thing. I frown upon it. Apparently cliche is equivalent to genius for some people, but to me, it's just cliche.

das

P.S. Anyone, from Mason on down could have checked those logs. If they were all so concerned about a second mole in the department (hell, the first mole should be enough), someone (um ... Tony?) should have checked.

Yes, it would've. Either way, Teri's heart would've stopped, which would've stopped blood flow to the baby. But the guy shot was more of a direct/symbolic shot... shooting at the womb as well as killing Teri.

Knowing it's a network show, we could only expect so much as far as gore goes, so it doesn't bother me that Nina didn't give Teri a head shot. A gut shot is just as lethal, anyways.
Do you mean her actions, or how her actions were portrayed? Keeping Teri alive until she left makes sense to me... Teri was a potential hostage until Neener got the message that she was to eliminate all her ties to Germany. "I'm just going to lock you in, Teri," she says... and then readies her pistol. [off camera] *pop* [/off camera]

Now, about how her actions were portrayed... not showing us that Teri had been shot until the very end... yes, that was manipulative. But what are movies and television shows if not manipulative? They're about trying to get us to care for people who don't even exist. The whole show was "cliche," as in the various plot points have been done to one degree or another in a different show/movie... but the difference between a good show and a bad show is how well it executes the cliches. I think 24 did a great job.
Are you sure about that? Seems like you needed extra security clearance. Nina probably couldn't have done it, otherwise she would've done it. At least Kiefer had the clearance, so Kiefer on up probably had clearance. I can't remember, but how concerned were they about the second mole? They were probably more concerned about Jack & Kim being in enemy hands.

Good.

There are plenty of shows that don't rely on such manipulations to achieve emotional response.

As for the security logs, perhaps Tony didn't have clearance. But, I'm going to assume Mason or Alberta or Chapelle or any of the others brought in to lock CTU down after the problems would have checked. Like I said, we can rationalize anything away by making excuses for people's actions, but in the end their actions were motivated by where the story was supposed to go, not what the characters would likely do. Again, some people don't mind that sort of thing. I do.

das

Truly, how fleshed out can any of these characters be in a 24 hour period? There's no inkling of long term growth to hang a hat on. It was one long ass day, and people did a lot of stupid things to prop up the compelling bits for 24 episodes.

I think that may be a problem with the format in combination with an American audience of no attention span. 24's fault was in trying to make EVERY episode the most intense hour of television ever created. In that attempt, it became a cheese-fest. Unfortunately, had they attempted a more realistic portrayal of these characters and the way they may actually react to situations, some hours may not be as intense and involve every single character in danger, and the American audience wouldn't have tuned in. Double edged sword I guess. Still, it makes for weak television. Damn_Americans. We have no tolerance for quality.

das

Well, I still have to give the producers/writers/directors kudos for a good wrap-up episode of this newfangled TV/format show. It delivered for the majority watchers of this show a satisfying ending and planted the seeds for the next season.

Regarding character development, I would have been pissed if Nina had not shot Teri just simply from all of the incessant whining from Teri that Nina had to put up with while undercover.

Yeah. I was quite angry when she tied her up like she did. I kept yelling, "SHOOT HER" at my TV. At least the deed was finally done. If only the show could have been called 25 and included an extra hour of Nina torturing Teri, now that would be great television.

das

Perhaps a "Nina and das" show is in the making?

Well, I think the most interesting thing (and what makes it a little less manipulative) is that Nina was not this evil cold-blooded assassin. She did kill guards seeminly with no heart, but she was a highly trained (most likely) operative and well, I hope you don't think that the good special foreces people don't kill...Indeed I am sure Kiefer killed plenty of innocent people. He blew up a building to kill Drazen! Wheater or not he knew his wife and daughter was in there is inconsequential, because he must have know that lots of other peole were in there like the innocent bellboy, etc.

If Nina was a killing machine, she wouldn't have even attmepted to let Teri leave. She did because she actually, in some way cared about her...or at least didn't want her to die. Reasons? Well, She was going to let Teri live (that is why she tied her up) until the person on the phone told her she had to sever all ties to Germany...Then she had no choice or she was comprimised.

The other reason is the end she says she is just doing her job and when she asks Jack how many people he is responsible for killing? Meaning she is justifing her actions at least to herself. A cold-blooded killer doesn't need to justify killing.

Now this is 1000 fold more interested than good guys=good, bad guys=evil. I think the next season we are going to learn more about Jacks past and hopefully the lines between what is right and wrong (collatoral damage weighed against completeing a mission) will be called into question. They already have when the government decides to sacrafice Jack.

Now what would really be interesting is if Nina turns out to be working for the good guys!! But...I doubt that and don't think I want that....

Of couse I am probably wrong and it was all just audience manipulation...

I don't think Jack blew up a "building" to kill Drazen, it was his house from what I recall

I agree. In fact, I was just about to respond with every single thing you just said.

I figured that Nina was keeping her alive as a hostage in case people surrounded the room.

Of course I was wondering why she'd leave her alive when she left the room, but they answered that question when they showed her dead.

Last time I checked, a house is a building.