Blockbuster backs Blu-Ray
06-19-07 | 10:24 PM
#102
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What many do not realize is that by Blockbuster's decision to carry only Blu-ray has nothing to with whether you like/dislike Blockbuster or even if rent/do not rent from Blockbuster.
This decision creates the impression among the public that Blu-ray is winning the format war over HD-DVD. So for many who have been sitting on the fence to see who "wins" the format war, the Blockbuster decision is just a major factor for many to go with Blu-ray.
It has nothing to do with which format is "better."
This decision creates the impression among the public that Blu-ray is winning the format war over HD-DVD. So for many who have been sitting on the fence to see who "wins" the format war, the Blockbuster decision is just a major factor for many to go with Blu-ray.
It has nothing to do with which format is "better."
06-20-07 | 07:47 AM
#103
DVD Talk Legend
Here's another perspective on this, and Microsoft's non-response response....
Linky: http://blog.seattlepi.nwsource.com/m...ves/116828.asp
Linky: http://blog.seattlepi.nwsource.com/m...ves/116828.asp
Blockbuster, Blu-ray and the console market (Updated)
Video rental giant Blockbuster walks a fine line in today's news release announcing plans to focus on the Blu-ray format over rival HD-DVD. Matthew Smith, the company's senior vice president of merchandising, says it's "still too early to say which high-definition format will become the industry standard" and Blockbuster "will continue to closely monitor customer rental patterns both at our stores and online, so we can adjust our inventory mix accordingly."
Not everyone is buying it.
"It's pretty clear they just declared Blu-ray the winner," said Michael Pachter, a Wedbush Morgan Securities analyst, via phone this morning. They can always change their minds, Pachter acknowledged, but Blockbuster plans to expand Blu-ray to 1,700 stores, and it will require a lot of capital to build up that inventory.
Of course, Blockbuster alone won't determine the outcome of the format wars. In this Associated Press story, the North American HD DVD Promotional Group calls the company's move shortsighted, saying that it should have waited longer to assess consumer preferences.
But if Blockbuster's decision shifts the balance toward Blu-ray, it could benefit Sony in the video-game console market. That's because Sony has bet big on Blu-ray by putting one of the drives into every PlayStation 3. It's hoping consumers will be willing to pay a higher price for the console -- $500 and $600 for the PlayStation 3, compared with $300 and $400 for the Xbox 360 and $250 for the Nintendo Wii. Microsoft offers an HD DVD peripheral for the Xbox 360 for $200.
If Blu-ray does emerge as the clear winner of the format wars, it will be easier for Sony to make the case for the PlayStation 3's premium price. Conversely, the effective value of the Blu-ray drive will diminish significantly if HD DVD becomes the standard. In that way, Blockbuster's move could help matters for Sony by reinforcing the viability of Blu-ray in the minds of consumers.
However, one analyst cautioned against reading too much into the Blockbuster news, from the perspective of the game console market.
"It's certainly an important win for the Blu-ray folks over HD DVD, but it's not likely to impact the console wars at this particular point," said Michael Gartenberg of Jupiter Research, via phone. "For the most part, people buying consoles are still buying them primarily as game machines," not to play high-definition movies.
Update, 5:25 p.m.: Microsoft issued this statement this afternoon in response to my inquiry about its position on Blockbuster's decision.
"The HD DVD format continues to lead in both sales of standalone players as well as the attach rate of movies to owners of high definition movie players. This is important, since over time, high definition DVDs will be an owner's market, not a rental market -- just like they were for DVDs. To date HD DVD leads the market with over 60% of high definition standalone players sold as well as a 4 to 1 advantage over Blu-ray for sales of high definition movies per household. Simply put, there is a key difference between performance in a rental test market and the actual movie sales at retail, an area that HD DVD continues to lead in. Finally, HD DVD delivers the best value in high definition movie experiences with over 300 HD DVD releases in the market and standalone players starting at $299 or as low as $199 for the Xbox 360 HD DVD player accessory."
Video rental giant Blockbuster walks a fine line in today's news release announcing plans to focus on the Blu-ray format over rival HD-DVD. Matthew Smith, the company's senior vice president of merchandising, says it's "still too early to say which high-definition format will become the industry standard" and Blockbuster "will continue to closely monitor customer rental patterns both at our stores and online, so we can adjust our inventory mix accordingly."
Not everyone is buying it.
"It's pretty clear they just declared Blu-ray the winner," said Michael Pachter, a Wedbush Morgan Securities analyst, via phone this morning. They can always change their minds, Pachter acknowledged, but Blockbuster plans to expand Blu-ray to 1,700 stores, and it will require a lot of capital to build up that inventory.
Of course, Blockbuster alone won't determine the outcome of the format wars. In this Associated Press story, the North American HD DVD Promotional Group calls the company's move shortsighted, saying that it should have waited longer to assess consumer preferences.
But if Blockbuster's decision shifts the balance toward Blu-ray, it could benefit Sony in the video-game console market. That's because Sony has bet big on Blu-ray by putting one of the drives into every PlayStation 3. It's hoping consumers will be willing to pay a higher price for the console -- $500 and $600 for the PlayStation 3, compared with $300 and $400 for the Xbox 360 and $250 for the Nintendo Wii. Microsoft offers an HD DVD peripheral for the Xbox 360 for $200.
If Blu-ray does emerge as the clear winner of the format wars, it will be easier for Sony to make the case for the PlayStation 3's premium price. Conversely, the effective value of the Blu-ray drive will diminish significantly if HD DVD becomes the standard. In that way, Blockbuster's move could help matters for Sony by reinforcing the viability of Blu-ray in the minds of consumers.
However, one analyst cautioned against reading too much into the Blockbuster news, from the perspective of the game console market.
"It's certainly an important win for the Blu-ray folks over HD DVD, but it's not likely to impact the console wars at this particular point," said Michael Gartenberg of Jupiter Research, via phone. "For the most part, people buying consoles are still buying them primarily as game machines," not to play high-definition movies.
Update, 5:25 p.m.: Microsoft issued this statement this afternoon in response to my inquiry about its position on Blockbuster's decision.
"The HD DVD format continues to lead in both sales of standalone players as well as the attach rate of movies to owners of high definition movie players. This is important, since over time, high definition DVDs will be an owner's market, not a rental market -- just like they were for DVDs. To date HD DVD leads the market with over 60% of high definition standalone players sold as well as a 4 to 1 advantage over Blu-ray for sales of high definition movies per household. Simply put, there is a key difference between performance in a rental test market and the actual movie sales at retail, an area that HD DVD continues to lead in. Finally, HD DVD delivers the best value in high definition movie experiences with over 300 HD DVD releases in the market and standalone players starting at $299 or as low as $199 for the Xbox 360 HD DVD player accessory."
06-20-07 | 08:36 AM
#105
DVD Talk Legend
Originally Posted by Geist
Quote:
Blockbuster's Blu-ray Endorsement Having Major Impact on HD DVD Player Sales
Blockbuster's decision to support Blu-ray in all of its 1,450 stores is having a bigger impact than it seems. A tipster at an unnamed retailer tells us they've had more HD DVD player orders canceled over the last few days than they've seen over the entire life cycle. The kicker? All of them were canceled because of the Blockbuster announcement.
Not only that, new sales of HD DVD players are nonexistent, with Blu-ray being the only things moving now.
The more tech savvy of us rent our stuff on Netflix or Blockbuster Online (which is still supporting both formats for now), but this announcement—covered in many mainstream media sources—had a big impact on people who actually rent at Blockbuster.
Blockbuster's Blu-ray Endorsement Having Major Impact on HD DVD Player Sales
Blockbuster's decision to support Blu-ray in all of its 1,450 stores is having a bigger impact than it seems. A tipster at an unnamed retailer tells us they've had more HD DVD player orders canceled over the last few days than they've seen over the entire life cycle. The kicker? All of them were canceled because of the Blockbuster announcement.
Not only that, new sales of HD DVD players are nonexistent, with Blu-ray being the only things moving now.
The more tech savvy of us rent our stuff on Netflix or Blockbuster Online (which is still supporting both formats for now), but this announcement—covered in many mainstream media sources—had a big impact on people who actually rent at Blockbuster.
06-20-07 | 08:43 AM
#106
Retired
Originally Posted by dvdirv
What many do not realize is that by Blockbuster's decision to carry only Blu-ray has nothing to with whether you like/dislike Blockbuster or even if rent/do not rent from Blockbuster.
This decision creates the impression among the public that Blu-ray is winning the format war over HD-DVD. So for many who have been sitting on the fence to see who "wins" the format war, the Blockbuster decision is just a major factor for many to go with Blu-ray.
It has nothing to do with which format is "better."
This decision creates the impression among the public that Blu-ray is winning the format war over HD-DVD. So for many who have been sitting on the fence to see who "wins" the format war, the Blockbuster decision is just a major factor for many to go with Blu-ray.
It has nothing to do with which format is "better."
I'm on the fence, and this doesn't affect me at all. I just can't believe enough of the carbon blogs renting at Blockbuster actually give enough of a shit about the HD formats to even be on the fence right now.
It may has some impact down the road, if the formats ever get more mainstream and Joe Six Pack may then decide to get a BR player just because they see those discs at Blockbuster. But I honestly don't expect the HD players to ever get to the point that J6P will want one, just like Laserdisc never got to that point, nor DVD Audio, or Super CDs etc.
06-20-07 | 09:39 AM
#107
DVD Talk Legend
Originally Posted by Fake "Insider Tip"
Blockbuster's Blu-ray Endorsement Having Major Impact on HD DVD Player Sales
Blockbuster's decision to support Blu-ray in all of its 1,450 stores is having a bigger impact than it seems. A tipster at an unnamed retailer tells us they've had more HD DVD player orders canceled over the last few days than they've seen over the entire life cycle. The kicker? All of them were canceled because of the Blockbuster announcement.
Not only that, new sales of HD DVD players are nonexistent, with Blu-ray being the only things moving now.
The more tech savvy of us rent our stuff on Netflix or Blockbuster Online (which is still supporting both formats for now), but this announcement—covered in many mainstream media sources—had a big impact on people who actually rent at Blockbuster.
Blockbuster's decision to support Blu-ray in all of its 1,450 stores is having a bigger impact than it seems. A tipster at an unnamed retailer tells us they've had more HD DVD player orders canceled over the last few days than they've seen over the entire life cycle. The kicker? All of them were canceled because of the Blockbuster announcement.
Not only that, new sales of HD DVD players are nonexistent, with Blu-ray being the only things moving now.
The more tech savvy of us rent our stuff on Netflix or Blockbuster Online (which is still supporting both formats for now), but this announcement—covered in many mainstream media sources—had a big impact on people who actually rent at Blockbuster.
How would this retailer know why someone was cancelling the order? Do they have a checkbox on their order form that says, "Are you cancelling this order due to the recent Blockbuster announcement?"
This story is a shameless, obvious lie.
06-20-07 | 10:42 AM
#108
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I agree with Josh. Additionally, in the Microsoft "rebuttal" they say that these formats will be an "own" format and not a "rent" one, and I couldn't agree more.
If WalMart said that they were backing BD over HD DVD, or maybe even Best Buy, then that would be cause for concern.
If WalMart said that they were backing BD over HD DVD, or maybe even Best Buy, then that would be cause for concern.
06-20-07 | 10:44 AM
#109
Retired
Originally Posted by Qui Gon Jim
Additionally, in the Microsoft "rebuttal" they say that these formats will be an "own" format and not a "rent" one, and I couldn't agree more.
And these people tend to just buy everything they want to see rather than renting.
06-20-07 | 01:11 PM
#111
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From: Blu-ray.com
Originally Posted by Qui Gon Jim
I agree with Josh. Additionally, in the Microsoft "rebuttal" they say that these formats will be an "own" format and not a "rent" one, and I couldn't agree more.
...and precisely for that reason (which the new update does not effectively take into account) it is more important how many machines capable of playing HD content (be it HD or BR) and not how many standalone players are being sold.
Seems like a rational way of reading between the lines...to me!
With this in mind BR clearly has the advantage!
Pro-B
Last edited by pro-bassoonist; 06-20-07 at 01:13 PM.
06-20-07 | 01:13 PM
#112
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Originally Posted by Josh H
Totally, the market for these things will always largely be the hometheater enthusiasts, just like it was for Laserdiscs.
And these people tend to just buy everything they want to see rather than renting.
And these people tend to just buy everything they want to see rather than renting.
06-20-07 | 02:07 PM
#113
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Originally Posted by pro-bassoonist
...and precisely for that reason (which the new update does not effectively take into account) it is more important how many machines capable of playing HD content (be it HD or BR) and not how many standalone players are being sold.
Seems like a rational way of reading between the lines...to me!
With this in mind BR clearly has the advantage!
Pro-B
Seems like a rational way of reading between the lines...to me!
With this in mind BR clearly has the advantage!
Pro-B
06-20-07 | 02:12 PM
#114
Retired
Originally Posted by Qui Gon Jim
I'll split hairs. HD DVD has a better attach rate, so while there may be a gazillion BD players in homes, the owners are buying far fewer titles than HD DVD owners are. Maybe that needs to be taken ito consideration when analyzing BB's decision. Maybe the average HD DVD owner is a buyer and the average BD owner is a renter.
06-20-07 | 02:20 PM
#115
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I'm sure Blockbuster is getting kickbacks from Sony regarding Blu Ray deals. The only reason Blockbuster does deals anymore is to get a sweeter deal from the studios.
It has nothing to do with market forces. Weinstein Bros. exclusives!! Hip Hip Hooray. I'm sure thats what the customer wants!!!!! Hannibal Rising Exclusives!! Come to Blockbuster!!!! YEAH!
Blockbuster can make up any quote it wants regarding whats its customers wants.
It has nothing to do with market forces. Weinstein Bros. exclusives!! Hip Hip Hooray. I'm sure thats what the customer wants!!!!! Hannibal Rising Exclusives!! Come to Blockbuster!!!! YEAH!
Blockbuster can make up any quote it wants regarding whats its customers wants.
Last edited by chanster; 06-20-07 at 02:24 PM.
06-20-07 | 03:26 PM
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From: Blu-ray.com
Originally Posted by Qui Gon Jim
I'll split hairs. HD DVD has a better attach rate, so while there may be a gazillion BD players in homes, the owners are buying far fewer titles than HD DVD owners are.
In fact, you should look into the bigger picture as all things considered it appears that this time around the war will not even be partially decided on US soil. Toshiba's recent statement (which I posted in another thread proves precisely that) regarding utterly disapointing sales in the US, a factor Toshiba was betting on in gaining advantage over BR, prompted a loss price cut. Such concerns were not at the time present in the BR camp.
Also, what owners are you citing? Again, the statement Toshiba made reflects quite a different trend! Are you taking into considertation only the US market? If, yes, then your logic does not stand a whim - sales, prior to the price cut have been disappointing and I don't see a reversal sign given the strong performance of BR in Europe (ratio is 3:1).
I urge you to also consider the HD code-cracking which has led to rampant piracy on the Russian market (could this be the reason why HD has seen fewer and fewer blockbusters under its flag this summer?)
I don't know what the US ratio is but I will be curious to see how many PS3 owners in the US do not own high-end sets. Whatever the ratio is...cut that in half as widescreen TVs have been growing in sales and become a major factor amongst European consumers. So, I don't think that Josh's assumption has much ground to build upon.
Sure, Blockbuster is getting kickbacks in this deal, otherwise thy will not be part of it. But...consider this (and I will use your logic here): IF the HD format is a own-format then JoeSix Pack really does not come into play here, nor savvy internet-readers such as yourself. Take these two groups aside, which I sense you believe will side with HD for two reasons: low price and owning and...at this stage of the game you have a group of people that are precisely the ones that might want to jump in this so called war and make a crucial decision! These are the suburban soccer moms that still go to Blockbuster and the uninformed, I don't care yet-type of people who have enough funds to afford a player.
Considering all of the above what SONY and Blockbuster have done ins't that asinine at all! And with overseas sales numbers, the only aspect of this war the studios care about, coming in in favor of BR you have a heavy swing away from HD.
This is the way I see what unfolds at the moment! The future will show whetehr or not my logic was faulty but at this stage of the game with the recent announcements I tend to believe that indeed BR is here to stay!
Pro-B
Last edited by pro-bassoonist; 06-20-07 at 03:31 PM.
06-20-07 | 03:30 PM
#118
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Originally Posted by Geist
I just like how people take it personally, like HD-DVD is their Momma and Blu-Ray called her a Whore.
I'd just prefer one to die off and the other show signs of being a viable long term format before I jump in.
I couldn't give a rat's ass which one it is that sticks around though.
06-20-07 | 03:44 PM
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From: Blu-ray.com
Originally Posted by Josh H
With far to much interest in one side of a niche movie format IMO. 
You probably know me well so...I truly don't care about the latest blockbuster being on HD or BD. My interest(s) is/are in foreign and classic cinema so to side with BR just...because I liked the color of their cases is...foolish. In fact, I have every reason to support HD as I tend to import a lot and as you well know there isn't region-coding on their discs (unlike BR). At this point the only reason why I backed BR is because they released Almodovar's latest and I sense they will have more foreign titles in the long-run. That is it! I really am after titles not formats...and seeing what HD has here and in Europe really does not interest me at this point.
But...as I said, I commented on what I have seen and read.
Gotta go.
Pro-B
06-20-07 | 03:49 PM
#122
Retired
Which ever format wins (if either does) will get full support from all studios at the time the other one dies (or in the months/years there after).
So which has more foreign cinema right now is moot in that regard. That's just relevant to decisions of which format to buy right now if you can only afford to get into one or the other.
So which has more foreign cinema right now is moot in that regard. That's just relevant to decisions of which format to buy right now if you can only afford to get into one or the other.
06-20-07 | 04:53 PM
#124
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Originally Posted by pro-bassoonist
My interest(s) is/are in foreign and classic cinema so to side with BR just...because I liked the color of their cases is...foolish.
Catalog titles have been selling poorly on HD DVD, but they've been doing even worse on Blu-ray, not leaving much incentive for the studios to continue to explore their back catalogs.
06-20-07 | 05:22 PM
#125
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Originally Posted by Adam Tyner
...although BD's support of both foreign and classic cinema is anemic at best, and with a video game console as the bedrock of the format -- a demographic more interested in action and sci-fi -- I'm not sure how likely that is to change anytime soon.
Catalog titles have been selling poorly on HD DVD, but they've been doing even worse on Blu-ray, not leaving much incentive for the studios to continue to explore their back catalogs.
Catalog titles have been selling poorly on HD DVD, but they've been doing even worse on Blu-ray, not leaving much incentive for the studios to continue to explore their back catalogs.
My gut reaction is that this has more to do with the type of people that are early adopters, and if any studio takes this as what the interest is going to be down the road, they're being incredibly foolish.