Tracer,

I can't address your issues regarding prior Fallouts directly, as I have not played them, but I didn't think there was any lack of depth in F3, and there certainly wasn't a lack of sardonic humor. But I do agree that the main story is pretty much on rails.

I agree that the player is unlimited (and ultimately overpowered), but I'd argue that the WORLD (and therefore the play experience) is very limited. If I set off the nuke, I fundamentally change the way I can interact with the world.

I agree that VATS isn't a substitute for turn-based combat. If anything, it's likely a concession that their engine doesn't work as a shooter. Still, I thought it was different enough to be interesting.

I took all of the quirky bonuses (some of which were really cool BTW), so I only had 2-3 maxed at the end. You can probably chalk that up to my lack of experience in the genre.

I'm not sure how much party variation I could have (or would want) in this setting. I am a "lone wanderer" after all. I guess you could employ a sniper and a heavy, but I'm also not sure how well that would work with the real-time setting. If I don't have turn based battles, having a party doesn't make sense because you can't manage them.

chess I don't think there can really be a communication between people like you and me, who have never played F1 and F2 and pretty much don't like RPGs and people like Tracer that adore those games and are hardcore RPG gamers. I don't think there's any hardcore RPG gamer that loved F1 and F2 that really likes F3, they may have played it for nostalgic reasons and maybe have enjoyed a little bit of it but in the end they hate it.

I think it's the same as if in 10 years someone releases a new Halo game but it plays more like KillZone 2, people would hate how "slow" it is, you can't jump, you see MC face! wtf?!, etc. You get the idea...

And I'm sure Tracer would die reading this, but sometimes I see the old games in Target, Fallout 1 and Fallout 2, in trilogy with another game, Tactics?, and I'm kinda interested on buying the pack, but then I think that they may RUIN my Fallout 3 experience...

Oh I remembered why I was here. I finished exploring all of Point Lookout, got the achievement for discovering all the places, even finished two side quests. And last night finally started the main mission, and man the tribal guys are though, I even died a couple of times, the first time without saving a lost like 20 minutes...
Now I'm in the second mission and I'm really interested on how the puzzle will be formed, since I already saw some things from exploring the whole place.
Right now this is my favorite DLC of all the ones released.

I really don't care. Play what you like playing. I just wish that people like me that enjoy CRPGs actually got some CRPGs to play.

Fallout 3 is a diverting game, but it's not really a CRPG.

I don't even know what a CRPG is!

I know (and like) SRPGs though!

Seriously though, as much as I'm stoked at what Bethesda did with Fallout 3, I'm genuinely bummed for you if F3 is that much of a departure from what you were hoping for.

Of course the main story is on rails. It's a game. You start out with a mystery to solve and you follow where it leads you. LIFE is on rails. Get up, work/school/eat/socialize/entertainment/sleep, start over. It's the sidequests that flesh it out (life and Fallout 3).

I played F3 on 360, so I wasn't really looking for a CRPG. The last CRPG I played, I think, was Wizardry 8, or Betrayal at Krondor. (They were on rails as much as F3 was, IIRC). Many CRPGs that I've tried just seem so big and long and focused on minutiae and stat maxing/management that they ceased being fun (to me) before too long.
If we're labeling things, I'll acknowedge Fallout isn't really a "CRPG".

Roleplaying - I felt like I was involved in a role, and that the decisions I made (limited as they were) affected that world.
VATS - I loved the VATS system. I don't really enjoy twitchy FPSes, especially a game as 'big' as F3; it's so fast I can't appreciate the game. And traditional turn based party combat has grown a little stale. I thought VATS was a great, novel compromise.
Levelling - perfect? No. Almost completely broken? No. I guess I suck, I don't think I maxed out anything. I guess if someone wants to play a min/max game they certainly could. I experimented with different perks based on how I was playing the game, and what sounded cool.
Party system? OK, there wasn't one. I didn't miss it. Playing only one character increased the immersion of the game.

I like JRPGs and SRPGS, I like Fallout, it doesn't hurt my feelings or sense of elitism that many "newbies" really enjoy Fallout 3. Fallout 3 reignited my interest in RPGs, that had faded for a while. Maybe it's just JRPGs that I'm a little tired of, I too am looking for a good SRPG.

I'm really not trying to sound like a fanboy, any more than you're trying to sound like a hater (I hate even using those words), and I hope I'm not coming across like that. I'm sure that while I was playing the game I had more things to complain/constructively criticize about it, but there must have been enough good about the game to outweigh the negatives in my mind, especially in hindsight. Many of the negative comments you've made are based on the argument "it's not like F1/F2" which again, since I have never finished those and haven't played them recently, I can't argue (nor do I really want to, I'll stipulate the games are different). But the other changes I think were, maybe not "for the better" in comparison to F1/F2, but definitely good when viewed against the current landscape of RPGs.

I love all RPG games. I think the first Fallout, Baldur's Gate 1 and 2 and the first Neverwinter Nights are some of the greatest games of all time. I also hold Planescape Torment and the second Fallout game close in quality. I also love the more straight line games like Icewind Dale 1 and 2. On top of that the Elder Scroll games are amazing, and I love the first 6 Final Fantasy games. I love just about every kind of RPG game.

I think Fallout 3 might be the best of the bunch.

I was with you until you included Neverwinter Nights among the greatest games of all time. Also when you called the Final Fantasy games RPGs.

Sold my copy yesterday for $30...and was kind of sad to see it go. But I'm looking forward to starting a fresh game this fall when the GOTY edition comes out.

There were so many people in this game that I wanted to kill but didn't, and I'm looking forward to doing their quests and then shooting them in the face. I think the only time I did that in my last game was with the slavers. I captured their VIPs and got the kids out...then I just killed EVERYBODY. Next time, I think I'll do that with The Family and with Tenpenny towers, I think I'll set off the nuke, let the ghouls in, and then kill all the ghouls. I'm also thinking that I'll kill the overseer of 101 and definitely Dave. Karma be damned!

NEVERWINTER NIGHTS RULED!!!

Trust me, it was hard when I first started playing final fantasy 1, after years of paper D&D games, and spending HOURS working on stats, to be put in a game that does all of that for you. Still, the opera scene in Final Fantasy 3 might be the greatest moment in video game history. But my younger brother never felt Final Fantasy, or any Jrpg, could call themselves RPG games. When Final Fantasy 7 came out, it just added fuel to his "interactive story book" theory.

Yeah final fantasy series are really more like flight sims than rpgs.

After spending like 6 hours exploring the place I finally started the main mission and when I started this part wow! One of my favorite parts of the game so far!

I got Dave to lose the election, and then he took off. Now he just sits around in Old Olney sulking (I keep expecting the Deathclaws to get him, but every time I check there he is).

wow! That's why I love this game.

Of course I just killed him.

I was finally able to find and dust off the last behemoth. That son of a bitch was hard to get to. I didn't realize that they're quite easy to take down if you use a fatman and mini nuke. I killed my first behemoth by using a flamer and it took like a minute of constant flames for him to go down. Does anyone else feel uneasy the entire time they're playing this game? I really like the game but feel on the edge the entire time. I've killed tons of super mutants but I still get this creepy feeling each time that I turn the corner in a new place and especially when I enter a new metro tunnel.

Yeah, I kill raiders with one shot, but I still get excited every time I encounter them.

Election??
Behemoth??
I need to play this game again

i just started this game a couple of days ago. after i leave the vault, i wander around springdale (?)for a bit and do not realize i should go up the road to megaton. i head east over the hills, end up in grayditch in the middle of the night, run into raiders, talon company merchants, as level 2 with 10 rounds of 10mm pistol ammo. i could not figure out why i was getting killed so often ...

I'm not sure that you get anything specific in Megaton that would solve your problem, other than possibly a direction to go in.

The best thing I found for fireants was mines, since they come straight at you.

The shishkebab sword thing worked well too if you get it really early (the first quest I did got me that the first time I played), since it doesn't use ammo and it does a good amount of damage.

i agree - megaton did not have any answers (other than to not go that way right off the bat). after i figured out megaton was the way to go, i ended up at the big box store (and was able to pillage it completely). by that time, i had enough ammo and supplies to be able to deal with and proceed to the mission.

As I recall, I think I ended up finding the elementary school before I found Megaton, and as I recall, raiders almost always give you more ammo than it takes to kill them, so I was pretty well armed by the time I left the school. The school was also good because I didn't run into more than 1 or 2 of the raiders at once. I didn't get sent to the mega mart until quite a bit later in the game for some reason.

I also left the vault with a fair amount of ammo...enough to get me started anyway.

It's remarkable how many little differences we have in our collective experience with this game.

apparently, there were 120 rounds of 10mm ammo that i did not find in the vault

Any tips before I head to the Deathclaw Sanctuary besides carrying a shitload of stimpaks? I think that they are the scariest creatures in the game but I've only faced a few of them.