Red Hood

So the press refers to them in the correct/preferred gender.

Eric F

Right, it's been so long since I've read it I didn't remember.

Giantrobo

Of course the many Broken Toxic DC Fans in the DC Groups all over are losing their shit over the changes, specifically of course the changes with Death not being a hot goth white girl they can Fap too. None of them remember that before Neil's Sandman both in comics and in world mythology Death was a Man or Skeleton, and none of them bitched about "woke changes" when Neil made Death a hot white girl.. Anyway, we remind them that Niel Gaiman said there would be changes like this and it seems he approves of them so they can just deal with it or go watch something else.

Josh-da-man

I have a really bad feeling about this.

It's no secret that Neil Gaiman stories have been difficult to successfully adapt to live action... Stardust, American Gods, and How to Talk to Girls at Parties are all, to put it generously, underwhelming. How to Talk to Girls at Parties was just fucking awful. Good Omens probably fared the best out of everything, but even that was kind of slog and would have worked better as a two hour movie and not a six part miniseries. And his first Doctor Who story was decent enough, but the second one with the Cybermen was a hot mess.

I think that, like William Gibson, his sensibilities just don't translate well to the screen.

And the more I learn about Netflix's Sandman, the more off-model it looks, and I fear it just isn't going to work at all, and it will be a colossal misfire like The Dark Tower.

Red Hood

Coraline was good though, but at the same time easier to translate from book to film.

Much like Gabriel Garcia Marquez, I always felt that Neil Gaiman’s books are almost impossible to translate into film or TV due to the themes and how impactful they are in the book. Sandman can still pull this off though due to the source being comic books, but the audience and Netflix have to be patient with the story arcs in the same way DC was when the comic series came out 30 years ago. That book took a while to find its voice and once it did, it solidified the masterpiece it became. Not saying that the early issues aren’t good, but the book was a slow burn before it hit its peak

Neitzl

I do agree that Gaiman's books are hard to translate into film/tv, but I have high hopes for this.
I hope they do Issue 6 "24 Hours" justice, as I think it was incredible.
The art was just perfect for the writing, and the writing really was great horror.
When I listened to that chapter in the audiobook, it sent chills up my spine.
Here's to hoping!

Eric F

Stardust is his best translation to film by far.

Neil is a cool guy. When Books of Magic first came out I used to send him questions about it via DC and he would respond to me directly from London by postcard. I wish I saved them.

Giantrobo

Yeah Stardust was great. I still watch it when it's on.

GoldenJCJ

Red Hood got it but it’s preferred pronouns. It’s becoming pretty popular to list your preferred pronouns for others. I’m guessing in this particular case it’s in support of Mason Alexander Park since they are the only one to use a different pronoun.

Josh-da-man

I had no idea so many people liked the Stardust movie. I like the book (I have it in hardcover, both the signed/slipcased gift edition of the novel, and the DC Comics hardcover with illustrations by Charles Vess), but thought the movie came off kind of silly.

It's probably kind of hard to capture stuff like this in live action...




BTW, Charles Vess would have been my first choice to handle the art in those illustrated Harry Potter novels they're releasing.

Eric F

I wanted HBO Max to do a Books of Magic series, but of course they’re doing a Harry Potter one instead.

Giantrobo

I guess Neil is tired of DC Fanboy shit.

Twitter

Josh-da-man

The appearance of the Endless in the Sandman series is complicated. Their default appearance is that, except for the missing brother and possibly Destiny (hard to tell since he wears a robe that covers most of his body including his face), they present themselves as pale, ghostly figures with black hair and black clothing. (Though Delirium's appearance seems to change a lot; sometimes she's bone white like the others, sometimes she looks caucasian; and her hair is in constant flux.)

Their appearance sometimes changes depending on the audience.

When Dream interacts with someone from ancient Africa, he looks like this:




When he went to the Justice League headquarters (really!) and met the Martian Manhunter, he took on the appearance of a Martian deity.




And when he hangs out with cats, he takes on the appearance of... a cat.




I really don't know how they're going to handle any potential race-bending in the series. In the current climate, you can't really darken/lighten anyone's skin tone without having people lose their minds. Cloud Atlas sort of got away with it, but very few people actually watched the movie, so there wasn't much of an outrage. How will they handle Dream interacting with Nada? Will he just be a pasty white Tom Sturridge? Will they hire an African-American actor to portray him? Will the backstory with Nada be eliminated entirely? (It's kind of important for the motivation of the character.)

I suspect that a lot of people -- who aren't redpillers or social injustice warriors -- are nervous about the casting choice for Death because it will represent a departure of the way the character appears in the source material.

It goes beyond race; the Endless appear as otherworldly and not necessarily any particular race. And it's also things like will Dream have eyes? We never actually see his eyes, they're just indistinct black pools with bright stars in place of pupils.

A lot of people weren't happy with Keanu Reeves being cast a black-haired, American John Constantine without the tan trench coat. I was one of them. And, though I do sort of like the movie on its own terms, it wasn't the proper adaption of Hellblazer that I, and others, wanted.

I really don't know how the Endless will appear in the series. If it's comics accurate, then they're going to be white (I mean WHITE, not caucasian) with black hair and black stuff around their eyes. Which could, potentially, make them look a black metal band in corpsepaint.




(Not disparaging the cosplay, but seeing people painted up in black and white like that could look odd in a live-action adaption, whereas you just accept on a comic book page. Like a superhero costume. At any rate, I think Sandman will be tricky to pull off in live action.)

And it's just being an asshole to complain about casting a non-binary actor in the role of Desire; the character was presented as genderfluid/non-binary/genderqueer three decades ago, long before those terms were even in regular use. (I would also add that Sandman was the first time I ever encountered a story that presented a trans person as a sympathetic character, and not a villain or the butt of jokes. I'm referring to Wanda, and not Desire here, btw. )

I do have a concern that Sandman is going to be "updated" a lot, and I really hope it doesn't get updated to the point of being unrecognizable. Sometimes it works, like when The Boys was updated from a post-9/11 satire to a satire of our current bonkers political climate. And sometimes it doesn't like when Preacher was turned into an unrecognizable mess; some of the new ideas were interesting, but it really morphed into something that bore little resemblance to the source material.

Josh-da-man

A new behind the scenes featurette:


The art direction looks really good here. Those familiar with the source material we recognize a lot things, in both the props and the production art... The ruby! The helmet! The bag of sand! The Magdalene Grimoire! Goldie! Matthew! The Cereal Convention!

My main concern is still with the casting. They absolutely have to nail this.

This is the first time I think I've seen Tom Sturridge; he's thirty-five, but seems like could pass for a teenager. He looks the part, but I really hope he has the gravitas to pull off such an imperious and taciturn character like Dream.

Eric F

The Endless make an occasional appearance in DC proper- I haven't kept up on recent DC but apparently they still do.

Josh-da-man

A civilian snapped some photos of a location shoot with Kirby Howell-Baptise and Tom Sturridge. They're probably filming "The Sound of Her Wings."



Wonder if they're going to do something with Dream's eyes in post?

ben12

This is bringing back memories. I need to reread this series again. Last time I read it was in college, I think. I'd probably get very different things out of it as an adult.

cultshock

"The Sound of Her Wings" is the vibe I'm getting from this. Hard to tell from the photo, but it almost looks like Death is wearing a coffin necklace instead of an ankh. Geez, I hope not, that's a little too on the nose.

Man, I sure hope so, that's an important part of Dream's look, it would be stupid to do away with that aspect of his appearance.

DJariya

cultshock

Whoa, looks like it's ripped right from the pages of the first issue, I'm officially excited.

Neitzl

I got goosebumps watching that!!!

Josh-da-man

cultshock

Man, they nailed the look of Dream's helm.

I always thought that its look was such a cool echo of Wesley Dodds' Sandman gas mask.

story

The side by side is insane.

I think... and I don't want to set expectations too high, but I think they got it.

Josh-da-man

Gwendoline Christie as Lucifer...