Rick has become Shane, but that doesn't mean he's wrong. What Glen said to that one dude really applies to everyone there. Those people aren't equipped to live in that world. I'm guessing Rick will be exiled, but a massive walker attack or similar emergency will occur before he gets far and they'll need him.

This was probably the first time in the entire series where I felt the show did a better job than the comic and it's because of one little change.....Pete is the one that started the physical altercation. Completely changes the view that Rick is crazy and sets up next week's episode nicely.

It's a pretty fast read. I suggest waiting for the third compendium. Most of next season should be contained in the second compendium. They may hit some third compendium issues if they speed up the pace a bit.

Michonne in those tight leather pants

I straight up laughed when she knocked out Rick at the end of the episode. His crazed rambling was embarrassing (yet understandable).

Thought the most interesting parts of the episode were Aaron and Daryl finding the tortured remains.

That's how I feel as well; Rick's not the only one who's been through shit, and while I have no problems with Rick going a little nuts they seem to push him more then others which is hard for me to see when he's the leader of the group. Like I said, he needs to be redeemed for the good for him to swing back over to the crazy efficiently and I don't think the show has done that. That's just me though.

Didn't Pete swing at Rick first on the show?

Yes. That's what I said. Pete started the altercation.

I kept wondering if it was actually tuna or cat food that she made for them? I mean it was all a big smoke screen, fuck you anyway.

I'm assuming whoever that torturing and marking guy is, he'll figure into the cliffhanger final next week.

Rick has made a lot of sacrifices, but I don't think he'd allow anyone in his group to be harmed, much less repeatedly.

Go ahead and exile Rick.. he's already told you that the walls aren't made to keep people out. He can just come back and stay with his group. To exile Rick would mean to exile all of Rick's group.

Would it? It seems like there are cracks in the foundation. Michonne, Glenn (and I assume Maggie) and possibly Daryl seem like they might stay. Carol and Sasha seem like they might be more comfortable elsewhere.

As an Alexandrian, if you can't trust one, you can't trust them all. Thick as thieves, I tell ya!

Sorry, I misread it. I thought you were saying Pete started it in the comics and Rick did on the show.

Yes I expect Rick to get exiled. Yes I expect him back when trouble hits the little town. Hopefully Morgan gets worked back in for the finale.

The funny thing is that it wasn't that long ago that we were saying it didn't really matter whether you read the comics since the show had taken its own path (unlike, say, Game of Thrones), but now they appear to be somewhat converging again.

Yeah, that's my guess two...Season 5 will end with Rick being sent out on his own (probably without Carl), but before the credits roll, Morgan will meet up with Rick and they'll say something about how he's going back to Alexandria to get his son, daughter...and future wife.

Forgive me for stating the obvious, but we're all under the assumption that the torture (and "W" carving) are done on live people, not walkers, right?


You are my future wife, Lisa

Deanna was going by the philosophy "the needs of the many outway the needs of the few, or the one". Rick wanted to stop the abuse, but more so wanted the girl as he said he wouldn't be doing this for someone else.

But the doctor DID get the upper hand on Rick. Until Jessie stepped in and distracted Pete, it was pretty much over for Rick.

The place does have some issues, however it has been there this entire time without falling apart......yet.

Wondering how hard Rick was trying at first.

A lot has been said already, but I'll add my own two pesos in a self-contained reply regardless.

First: As someone said, the fact the town/Deanna knew... makes them entirely complicit. I find it interesting - laughable, almost - that the "average" view is Rick snapped/darkens his character more. No, the only one darkened in such a world? All of Alexandria. It wholly justifies everything Rick's caral (cabal with Carol, of course!) was doing. Exile all of *them.*

A surgeon's skills? In that world? Of *course* it is without equal. Of course he saves countless literal lives. That and letting -allowing- him to beat his wife? Doesn't compute. What's he gonna do with an ordered separation, one enforced? Nothing. So the only reason it continues -well, yeah... that, and the writing staff needed it to+dreamt it up- falls on the heads of all of Alexandria aware of and unbothered by it.

Rick snapping isn't the villain here - the town is the villain. One might even argue that the town is what made Rick into Psycho Rick last night - in other words, his discovery and awareness of Deanna (and others) knowing full well what was going on? That pushed him over the edge. That shattered whatever faith and optimism he yet had in Alexandria being something -anything- different. Instead, it turns out to be yet more selfish, unconscionably cowardly people who put self interests above and beyond the interests of others and doing what was right -whether before Zombie apocalypse or afterwards.

One also has to believe that Michonne doesn't donkey punch Rick's lights out had she herself been aware of such knowledge. I don't believe she was, however, not that particular fact, so one can understand seeing Rick's psychosis far less favorably in such a light. Bottom dollar there - aka the tl;dr version? Everyone and anyone being all, "Rick really lost it! He's deserving of whatever he gets, and his character is now and forever irredeemable!" totally miss the point, shifting the blame from where it should rest. The citizenry of Alexandria are the ones who fell from grace in last night's episode, something compounded with the cowardly murdering of Noah by another one of "their own" just last week.

So that's examining TWD as anything but fiction written up by writers. Now, returning to reality: Am I the only one astounded by the similarities -downright cloning- Deanna's position and that of Dawn, the lady-cop leader of Atlanta Hope's Anatomy: ER? Jesus, it took place in the same freaking season as this just now!!! Writers, a bit of variation and dramatic diversification, if you please?!

Let us recap for those playing at home:

Continuing to live their lives in something resembling pre-Z days? Check.
Holdout communities sheltered from the Z-pocalypse? Check.
Led by a female leader? Check. One who did not appear in the funny books, no less? Double check!
Is that female leader somewhat weak, her position held due more to her weaknesses and moral deferrals over her actual strengths? You betcha.
Does that leader allow/overlook glaring horrors committed by those they supposedly lead? You betchaČ.
Is that leader/community gonna face being put in their places/put down by one Rick Grimes and Co.? Uhh... yeah. Methinks so.
Is said leader gonna regret the instant their paths intersected that of Rick Grimes and Co.? Ab-so-friggin-lutely.

Bottom buck? Two thumbs down for returning to a well you'd just near abouts drained dry months prior. For shame taking the Atlanta self-contained story, then basically copying and pasting many (all?) the major dramatic plot points to Alexandria, to the bloody point of transforming the leader of Alexandria in the comics so fantastically, all of which head squarely in the direction of Dawn in Atlanta - even changing his gender to a her on the show!

If you felt like Atlanta didn't get explored properly, then you shouldn't have wrapped that up so quickly, much less in a bid to get back on track with the comics. Why even need it be Alexandria? They could've done just as well transforming the Atlanta hospital situation slightly, pulling it back from the brink of being unacceptable, to have it take the place of Alexandria in the comics.

The only major difference, at least as I see it? Rather than the law being the problem in Atlanta, now, in Alexandria, Rick Grimes *is* the law.

Edit to Add: Ooh! I just thought of something else! The surgeon wife-beater in Alexandria? In Atlanta, Beth's "bud" Dr. Edwards? Has Beth kill his former colleague, realizing his skills as a physician/surgeon become expendable if he's no longer the only one. In other words, twice in one season has TWD Writer's Room utilized medical professionals for drama: In Alexandria, the rarity of a surgeon's skills justifying allowing/overlooking crimes and abuses. In Atlanta, the population of skilled doctors in the world of Z used to cause a horrific crime (Diagnosis? Murder! Yeah, well, such things wouldn't happen in my House, over M.D.s!)

Yeah it really is fast. if people think watching week to week is bad, think about reading a comic in 5-10 minutes, and then having to wait on a cliffhanger for 4 weeks.

But through that long haul I've gotten to know/reflect on the characters for over 10 years, which in a way is more personal than with the show.

Well Rick and the group had no problems having the doctor take care of Tara, or living at Alexandria or getting food, etc. if he was so concerned about the lack of readiness by the people of Alexandria maybe he should have tried to spend his time training them or teaching them how to shoot or patrol instead of stalking Jessie. Rick had no problems banishing Carol for trying to protect the prison from the flu infection and basically justified it because of the violence that Tyresse would have cause. Maybe he should have banished Tyresse since Rick was concerned he would attack Carol. He nearly condemned Michonne to certain death by almost agreeing to trade her to the governor and he turned away Andrea when she refused to help him attack the governor causing her to get tourtured and killed. Rick is a terrible leader and death and destruction lay in his wake.

ETA: also Rick basically admitted that he was only getting involved because it was Jessie and he appears to have feelings for her after meeting her for a minute. Maybe if it was the old couple or the mayor or the gay couple, he wouldn't have gotten involved.

Maggie has lost her father, stepmother, stepbrother, half sister, and cousin. Her father was actually decapitated right in front of her! She has no blood family left and has gone through all the crazy shit that Rick has gone through and she is doing much better.