Plot developments=concept changes?

Aside from having Jim in Stanford, what has changed?

I agree with Tracer.

If by concept changes you mean "story arcs" then yes.

Concept changes = more (and "goofier") Michael & Dwight, less of everyone else. So far this season, the secondary characters have all but disappeared.

Also, more 'conventional' sit-com types in the persona of the other Stamford characters - ie, the new hottie to add some romantic tension to the Jim/Pam storyline, and the (not-so-funny) guy who's supposed to be Jim's foil in the Stamford office. Gads, I hope those characters don't get added to the regular cast.

Ok, that's just flat-out incorrect. People have given numerous examples of the secondary characters getting as much (or more) airtime than last season.

Should Jim have transferred to an office where he was the only employee? I'm not sure how they could have grown at all if they didn't add a few new characters. And I disagree with you on your assessment of them. I like the new Stamford characters just fine.

I really don't see this at all. We're talking about a show that had episodes like "The Injury," "The Alliance," "Drug Testing," "The Fight," "The Dundies," and "Diversity Day." Michael and Dwight have always been "goofy," and have had a lot of screen time.

The only ones to have disappeared are Oscar, who had one ep heavily focused on him, and Merideth, who has never had that much screen time. I've mentioned others who've had substantial roles in S3 eps, but I feel I should also point out that Ryan appeared heavily in this last ep, probably the most he's been in an ep since "The Fire."

The show had added a "new hottie" for Jim to the show as far back as the first season, so it's not a concept change for them to do it again. Also, the introduction of the new co-worker is very similar to something that happened in the 2nd season of the UK The Office.

Well, it's a matter of opinion whether or not the character played by Ed Helms is funny; a number of posts on this thread seem to think that he is. However, funny or not, I don't see how he's a "'conventional' sit-com type."

Well, to your first point, if you go back episode by episode and look at the first five shows of the season, you would see that the secondary characters have had a lot less screen time than in just about any episode of the previous season. New characters and plots in Stamford have eaten up a portion of it; more Michael and Dwight shenanigans and one entire episode outside of the office have eaten up more. Obviously, one can't tell if that will continue as a trend throughout the rest of the season, but I personally hope not. And it's not only Oscar and Meredith, but Stanley, Phyllis, Kevin and Daryll (haven't even seen him yet) that have had a lot less to do so far this year. True, Kelly and Ryan have appeared a bit more than the others, but still there has definitely been a lot less screen time for the other characters (so far) for whatever reason.

As for your second point, well there's no point in arguing opinions. I don't find the new Stamford characters at all interesting or funny, and they look and act much more like "TV characters" to me than the original Scranton group. I think the show has been notably less funny this season, aside from the first episode which while having some slightly over the top moments, mostly seemed reasonably close to the standards/style of season two.

I just hope the show gets back on track as the season goes on, because it has been my favorite sit-com almost since it debuted.

Most of the secondary characters aren't really funny enough to be able to support more screen time. Do you really want to see an entire episode based around Phillys or Darrell? I personally don't think Ryan is really funny and would like to see less of him.

Um, guys, we're only what, 5 episodes in? I think we should just all enjoy the fun instead of condemning the show already since the season barely started.

the day before they are both relocated to Scranton. (just speculation)

I'm sorry, I still don't see a drastic change. I've been watching the Season 2 DVDs recently too, so I have a pretty good basis of comparison. The show has always focused on the four main characters of Michael, Dwight, Jim, and Pam, with secondary characters getting less screen time. Some secondary characters get more focus per an individual episode, like Oscar did in the premeire, or Ryan did this ep, but it's never been consistently more of the secondary characters. For example, Kelly was a non-entity until about halfway through last season.

Now, I agree with this. By having to focus on Jim outside the Scranton branch with new co-workers, some time is taken away from Scranton. But that they spend time on the new co-workers shows that the show is still interested in secondary characters, just not only the ones you're used to.

Don't see this at all. I've listed eps from previous seasons that are just as heavy on Michael and Dwight "shenanigans."

You mean, outside the office like in "The Dundies", "The Fire," "The Client," "Valentine's Day", and "Booze Cruise"?

Seriously, I do see that one could view "The Convention" as having focused on the outside the office activities Of Micheal, Dwight, and Jim. However, Pam had a significant subplot in that ep of going on her first date, which garnered memorable bits from nearly everyone in the office, including a near heartbreaking subplot of Toby trying to ask Pam out.

Even if that stuff wasn't enough, that's just one episode, and hardly indicative of a trend.

Again, I don't see those characters as having significantly less time than in previous seasons. Stanley just had some notable moments in this past ep. Daryll only shows up once every 6 episodes or so. I think Kevin's only been heavily featured once, in "Michael's Birthday."

How are they more like "TV characters" though?

I really don't agree at all. The show has always had "over the top" moments, and season 3 hasn't exceeded anything that has come before. Also, I've found the show consistently funny this season. However, the season so far is notably "different," than last, most notably with the move of Jim to another office, which has shifted the show's dynamic. However, so far it's been a good thing, shaking up what could've become a stale formula, especially in terms of the Jim/Pam relationship. This season is not Season 2, but there's absolutely nothing wrong with that.

I got all of that "spirit quest" stuff. I guess maybe it wasn't any more "dwighty" than normal, so I just didn't find the situation all that funny and that's why I didn't care for it? I'm not sure. The episode title didn't have any effect on me.

The put out bit was great, but so far most of her lines have just been to move things along in the episode. There is still a lot of time left in the season so I'm sure she'll get some action, but she had some great one off lines in s1 and s2, and I'm just waiting for her time to shine.

I still didn't like this episode, but to be the only one out of 30+ episodes isn't that bad. I'm still digging the hell out of this season (watched each ep at least twice so far) and I'm nowhere near writing the show off as a whole. Just this ep.

100% agree on the Dwight comment. Please tone it down a little....Dwight is becoming a little too obnoxious.

I look at it this way: For a show with such a relatively tiny premise, they have done a great job of bringing the series along while still leaving room to move and grow the characters. You (the viewer) still want to see and know more about these people.

My biggest concern for the show when going into full length American TV seasons was that it would run out of places to go within the confines of the office world, that it would cheaply start abandoning the entire premise - a small and entirely unremarkable paper company office - and begin relying on all too typical plot gadgets, thus becoming an entirely unremarkable television show.

Dwight was no more over the top that usual in this episode. It just seemed that way because the beet farm stuff wasn't that funny. They don't need to tone him down, they just need to make sure his material is funny.

Good lord, I don't know how people can think the beet farm wasn't exactly what it should have been. From "I'm going to put my seed in you" to "of course he would leave me in a beet field" to "wrestle FEAR to the ground!" to "What is Michael Scott's greatest fear?" to "get in the coffin" to "he seemed nice" I think it was pretty damn funny and very VERY Dwight.

I dont think Michael is more "goofier" at all, hes about the same, Dwight isnt that much different, and the secondary characters havent disappeared. We only have had 5 episodes, what do you expect, second and first seasons took a while to get everyone in. This season theres been lots of good creed stuff, toby wanting to ask pam out, oscar stuff, phillis stuff. I dont see why you think they disappeared. I dont think they are going the conventional sitcom stuff, all that stuff is plot development, what do you want them to do?

This is what I agree with. Dwight hasn't changed, the material just wasn't very funny last week. I still think that Dwight is funniest when he has Michael around to kiss ass or Jim/Pam to torment. He's just not as funny when having to carry a scene on his own with no other funny people around.

Maybe that's the issue. When Dwight (or Michael for that matter) doesn't have funny material, he just seems TOO over the top (or wacky just for the sake of being wacky might be another way to put it). In either case, the comedic aspect of those characters has just seemed to me very forced lately, in kind of the same way that Kramer came off in the later seasons of Seinfeld (for another example).

I will concede that perhaps the problem has been more in the writing this season than the actual changes in the show. I can certainly imagine a situation where introducing new characters and the whole Stamford office angle COULD be funny. I just haven't found all that much of the last four episodes has been particularly funny.

Bill, I think your statement sums up the concerns I have been feeling about this season so far. Now that the show is something of an established success(as opposed to the "cult" show it was previously), I do worry that there might be some tweaking to broaden its appeal. I think there are subtle aspects of the show this season that may or may not harken that possibility, which is the point I've been making throughout this thread. Some people obviously don't see it the same way, and the indicators I have noted may or may not amount to anything other than a slight dip in the quality of the show over a few episode period. I suppose only time will tell for sure.

Sex Fiend and others have talked about how now the show is a hit or "an established success," but I really don't get that at all. Not that I don't love the show, but it is getting stomped in the ratings. This last episode was fourth in its time period, behind Survivor and Ugly Betty (tied for first) and the World Series, and that's not an anomaly. I don't think it's finished above third this season. I know it's frequently a top download at iTunes, but even so, I would hardly consider the show to be a hit or an established success.

For what it is and where NBC is, MNIE and The Office are working perfectly well. Yes, they're the third option in the time period. That's not bad given the importance of that night for all networks and the options people have that night. It would be swell to improve that performance, but this is so low on the triage list for NBC that they're in no immediate danger. That's my read, at least.

It's generally been a modest success in the 18-40 demographic that advertisers covet, although this week it was a bit down in that regard. But still, almost 80% of its audience was in that demo which is a pretty high percentage. Plus I think the World Series competition affected this show a lot more than Ugly Betty and Survivor.

^^^ But regardless of the World Series, it's still always killed by two other shows. I'm not saying this show is in any trouble of cancellation, especially considering the poor state NBC is in right now, but I still don't agree that the show can be called an established success or a hit. I just don't think the ratings justify that, especially when DRG describes it as a "modest success."

People are saying that now that the show is a hit, it's beginning to change. I've already said before that I don't think the show has changed that much, but I guess my point is that if the show has changed, it's not because it's now a big hit because it's still pretty ratings-deprived.

I'm not trying to attack the quality of the show because it has low ratings; I'm just trying to point out that it's not as big as many people here seem to act like it is.

I saw a news report a few weeks back about the ratings being calculated with people who time-shifted to watch being accounted for. The Office got the biggest bump with an additional 11%.

In the days of DVR and what not they need to reinvent how they calculate ratings.