Recent Amazon Price Error: You'll be charged unless you return!!
01-29-07 | 01:12 PM
#901
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maybe they thought you were an honest customer who wanted the items in for christmas or new years...for presents and they thought you were actually willing to pay what you knew you should be paying?
01-29-07 | 01:42 PM
#902
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Originally Posted by Jah-Wren Ryel
Not that we haven't been over these exact points a billion times already...
(a) Amazon chooses to use an automated system, taking people out of the loop has inherent benefits and inherent risks, just as having people in the loop has a different set of benefits and risks. By implementing the system they did, they signed up for the risks that come with it. There are well understood means to mitigate the risks such that errors like this almost never slip through. As the largest web-retailer, Amazon is certainly aware of such methods.
(b) The glitch was fixed before noon of the first day. Thus demonstrating that Amazon was aware of the problem very early on. Many orders did not ship for 3-5 days afterwards, giving Amazon plenty of time to cancel orders. Over the past few years Amazon has regularly demonstrated the capability of canceling opportunistic orders within 24-48 hours. For whatever reason, they chose not to exercise that same capability in this case.
(a) Amazon chooses to use an automated system, taking people out of the loop has inherent benefits and inherent risks, just as having people in the loop has a different set of benefits and risks. By implementing the system they did, they signed up for the risks that come with it. There are well understood means to mitigate the risks such that errors like this almost never slip through. As the largest web-retailer, Amazon is certainly aware of such methods.
(b) The glitch was fixed before noon of the first day. Thus demonstrating that Amazon was aware of the problem very early on. Many orders did not ship for 3-5 days afterwards, giving Amazon plenty of time to cancel orders. Over the past few years Amazon has regularly demonstrated the capability of canceling opportunistic orders within 24-48 hours. For whatever reason, they chose not to exercise that same capability in this case.
It is one thing to take advantage of this 'deal' - but now to complain that Amazon wants there stuff back... truely sad. The only facts of the situation are Amazon made a mistake and you took advantage of the mistake. Amazon catches the mistake and wants their merchandise back - and you say no because you want to keep their merchandise you didn't pay for.
I have no idea how someone can keep the DVDs in this situation, and not feel like a dirtbag. Are 'free' DVDs worth it?
01-29-07 | 02:05 PM
#903
Originally Posted by tdubel
I have summarily contacted my credit card company 3 times now about this issue and have received the same advice. I have a order confirmation via email, a shipping confirmation and a packing slip all stating the same prices and the completion of the order. My card company (Amazon Visa) said that all I do is request the chargeback, they will immediately do it and then send in copies of the paperwork. They agree that a merchant cannot subsequently raise their prices even thru their own error. SO, point is, just ignore the emails, only response I have sent is that "You do not have my permission nor authorization to charge my card for these past orders, and I added that I have already notified my card company of pending unauthorized charges, etc." Anyhow, Amazon is just threatening and if you capitulate, you will pay, if you fight it, you will win.
My opinion.
My opinion.
Originally Posted by tdubel
Not to be argumentative, but have you ever done a chargeback? It is a one sided deal b/c the credit card company is working on your behalf with your story. As long as you are honest with the story, you will win. See, the big overwhelming fact here is that Amazon's records/charges/invoices and shipping receipts all show the correct total charged plus have the words: "This completes your order". This is a very cut and dry case. They screwed up.
If not, who is to stop someone from doing a chargeback on a legitimate transaction?
Has anyone told their CC company, "Amazon had a glitch that i knowingly took advantage of, now they are trying to get the money back that would have origianally been charged to me if the glitch were not in place. But the receipt said $x.xx so they should not be able to charge me more."?
I would recommend they hear the facts from you instead of from amazon...
01-29-07 | 02:16 PM
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From: Wildomar, CA
I've been sitting on the sidelines watching this whole debate, and I must say that I am getting tired of the pontificating. Perhaps, some did take advantage of the glitch. HOWEVER, what Amazon is trying to do is illegal. If they get away with this, it opens a giant sized slippery slope for the next company to do something worse. As it stands already, Amazon does not honor misprices, yet if you walk into a store, they are legally bound to honor them. I have also witnessed Amazon raise prices for an item while I was in the process of purchasing it. Mind you, I am not condoning intentionally taking advantage of a company, but Amazon does not exactly play fairly and should not be allowed to charge a card again after a completed transaction. It's as simple as that.
Last edited by BeatlePaul; 01-29-07 at 02:19 PM.
01-29-07 | 02:22 PM
#906
Originally Posted by BeatlePaul
I've been sitting on the sidelines watching this whole debate, and I must say that I am getting tired of the pontificating. Perhaps, some did take advantage of the glitch. HOWEVER, what Amazon is trying to do is illegal. If they get away with this, it opens a giant sized slippery slope for the next company to do something worse. As it stands already, Amazon does not honor misprices, yet if you walk into a store, they are legally bound to honor them. I have also witnessed Amazon raise prices for an item while I was in the process of purchasing it. Mind you, I am not condoning intentionally taking advantage of a company, but Amazon does not exactly play fairly and should not be allowed to charge a card again after a completed transaction. It's as simple as that.
01-29-07 | 02:26 PM
#907
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Originally Posted by Jah-Wren Ryel
Can't say this more plainly - you are wrong. Your card is not a credit card....
I agree with Goldblum you've got some sort of special circumstances that are creating this problem for you - maybe something to do with your misunderstanding of credit cards vs debit cards or maybe something else. The only time I have ever been declined at the pump is when I refused to enter my zip code at one particularly intrusive station and I buy gas out of state at least 2-3 times a month.
Go ahead and rationalize away your legal protections, the banks love customers who do that for them. Meanwhile, anyone who applies a bit of critical thinking will understand that spending other people's money gives one a lot more leverage than spending one's own.
01-29-07 | 02:29 PM
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From: Wildomar, CA
I am not saying it is a misprice. Rather, I am pointing out that Amazon does not follow rules that B&M must comply with (for example, misprices)
Even so, we are talking about "completed transactions." What they are trying to goes against their own terms of service. They could have EASILY cancelled the orders before they shipped, since many have commented that their orders shipped well AFTER the glitch was caught. Amazon allowed the orders to ship anyway. So, Amazon should at least share SOME of the blame.
Even so, we are talking about "completed transactions." What they are trying to goes against their own terms of service. They could have EASILY cancelled the orders before they shipped, since many have commented that their orders shipped well AFTER the glitch was caught. Amazon allowed the orders to ship anyway. So, Amazon should at least share SOME of the blame.
01-29-07 | 02:37 PM
#909
Originally Posted by BeatlePaul
Even so, we are talking about "completed transactions." What they are trying to goes against their own terms of service. They could have EASILY cancelled the orders before they shipped, since many have commented that their orders shipped well AFTER the glitch was caught. Amazon allowed the orders to ship anyway. So, Amazon should at least share SOME of the blame.
I can see Amazon saying "We ARE taking some of the blame, we are paying for them to send the items back."
and also saying "They took atvantage of the glitch, they 'should at least share SOME of the blame' "
Last edited by the Chief; 01-29-07 at 02:56 PM.
01-29-07 | 02:44 PM
#910
DVD Talk Limited Edition
Originally Posted by BeatlePaul
I've been sitting on the sidelines watching this whole debate, and I must say that I am getting tired of the pontificating. Perhaps, some did take advantage of the glitch. HOWEVER, what Amazon is trying to do is illegal. If they get away with this, it opens a giant sized slippery slope for the next company to do something worse. As it stands already, Amazon does not honor misprices, yet if you walk into a store, they are legally bound to honor them. I have also witnessed Amazon raise prices for an item while I was in the process of purchasing it. Mind you, I am not condoning intentionally taking advantage of a company, but Amazon does not exactly play fairly and should not be allowed to charge a card again after a completed transaction. It's as simple as that.
Also, this is not the first time Amazon has done this, or is Amazon the only company who has done this, so there goes the slipperly slope argument...
And lastly, a store is not legally required to honor a pricing MISTAKE. If some employee at Best Buy puts a 1 cent sticker on a computer, BB will not be required to sell it for a penny.
01-29-07 | 02:59 PM
#911
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Originally Posted by cpgator
And lastly, a store is not legally required to honor a pricing MISTAKE. If some employee at Best Buy puts a 1 cent sticker on a computer, BB will not be required to sell it for a penny.
Every state I've lived in has had consumer protection laws that do require just that. Here's the first one that came up in google:
Pay Attention at the Checkout.
To prevent overcharges, make sure the items you purchase have price tags on them and that those tags match the price you are charged. If you are charged more than the tag price, notify the seller right away. Michigan law provides the seller must refund the difference plus a bonus of 10 times the difference up to $5.00, or be subject to a consumer lawsuit.
To prevent overcharges, make sure the items you purchase have price tags on them and that those tags match the price you are charged. If you are charged more than the tag price, notify the seller right away. Michigan law provides the seller must refund the difference plus a bonus of 10 times the difference up to $5.00, or be subject to a consumer lawsuit.
01-29-07 | 03:06 PM
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From: Wildomar, CA
Originally Posted by cpgator
Probably should have stayed on the slidelines a little longer... Do you actually know that what Amazon is doing is illegal, or do you just think it is? If you actually have proof that it is illegal, please provide the proof.
Also, this is not the first time Amazon has done this, or is Amazon the only company who has done this, so there goes the slipperly slope argument...
And lastly, a store is not legally required to honor a pricing MISTAKE. If some employee at Best Buy puts a 1 cent sticker on a computer, BB will not be required to sell it for a penny.
Also, this is not the first time Amazon has done this, or is Amazon the only company who has done this, so there goes the slipperly slope argument...
And lastly, a store is not legally required to honor a pricing MISTAKE. If some employee at Best Buy puts a 1 cent sticker on a computer, BB will not be required to sell it for a penny.
2) I do not believe it is an accepted business practice to charge a card again after a completed transaction.
3) Perhaps not in your state, but in New York I believe it is.
Next time, a little less attitude please. I was simply trying to make a point, not have an argument.
01-29-07 | 03:06 PM
#913
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From: Phoenix, AZ
Originally Posted by cpgator
And lastly, a store is not legally required to honor a pricing MISTAKE. If some employee at Best Buy puts a 1 cent sticker on a computer, BB will not be required to sell it for a penny.
This is only a valid argument if the mistake is caught before the transaction is completed and the transfer of goods has been made. If for some stupid reason the cashier at Best Buy were to ring up the computer for a penny and you paid for it and walked out the door with said computer there is nothing they can do about it.
01-29-07 | 03:07 PM
#914
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Originally Posted by cpgator
And lastly, a store is not legally required to honor a pricing MISTAKE. If some employee at Best Buy puts a 1 cent sticker on a computer, BB will not be required to sell it for a penny.
Edit: Nevermind... 5 people beat me to telling you that you were wrong.
01-29-07 | 03:08 PM
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Originally Posted by ChefWinduAZ
This is only a valid argument if the mistake is caught before the transaction is completed and the transfer of goods has been made. If for some stupid reason the cashier at Best Buy were to ring up the computer for a penny and you paid for it and walked out the door with said computer there is nothing they can do about it.
01-29-07 | 03:11 PM
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Originally Posted by cpgator
And lastly, a store is not legally required to honor a pricing MISTAKE. If some employee at Best Buy puts a 1 cent sticker on a computer, BB will not be required to sell it for a penny.
01-29-07 | 03:14 PM
#917
As far as I know, if it rings up a penny, they can correct the problem right then, but once a reciept is given, then they cannot. I may be wrong though.
I equate this issue moreso in the...
"I bought this box (for arguments sake) and it rang up for $x.xx, but upon inspection later, and the company finds out that another item was placed inside this box that the customer KNEW was in the box."
I equate this issue moreso in the...
"I bought this box (for arguments sake) and it rang up for $x.xx, but upon inspection later, and the company finds out that another item was placed inside this box that the customer KNEW was in the box."
01-29-07 | 03:17 PM
#918
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Originally Posted by Jah-Wren Ryel
Perhaps you should have stayed on the sidelines yourself... Do you actually know what you are claiming is true, or do you just think it? If you actually have proof that it is true, please provide the proof.
Every state I've lived in has had consumer protection laws that do require just that. Here's the first one that came up in google:
PS - notice there is nothing in this law about coming back a week later and getting your money back.
Every state I've lived in has had consumer protection laws that do require just that. Here's the first one that came up in google:
PS - notice there is nothing in this law about coming back a week later and getting your money back.
Your link is about scanner accuracy, so I am not sure why you linked it. Scanner accuracy is the source of a lot of complaints and scams, therefore there are specific laws regarding it.
What were are talking about here is mispriced items - either on a advertisement, on a store shelf, or on an website. If the printer doing your ads screws up and puts the wrong price on an item, you are not required to sell it for that price, as long as you make a correction.
I am sure there are many links, here is the first on I found -
http://www.competitionbureau.gc.ca/i...=522&lg=e#sale
Section 74.05 of the Competition Act, which is a civil provision, prohibits the sale or rent of a product at a price higher than its advertised price. The provision does not apply if the advertised price was a mistake and the error was immediately corrected.
01-29-07 | 03:22 PM
#919
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From: Phoenix, AZ
Originally Posted by cpgator
Section 74.05 of the Competition Act, which is a civil provision, prohibits the sale or rent of a product at a price higher than its advertised price. The provision does not apply if the advertised price was a mistake and the error was immediately corrected.
01-29-07 | 03:26 PM
#920
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Originally Posted by excom101
Edit: Nevermind... 5 people beat me to telling you that you were wrong.
Perhaps you can explain a bit more about how I am wrong.
01-29-07 | 03:39 PM
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Originally Posted by cpgator
Since you put forth such a compelling argument, please allow me to respond. The quote I was speaking to was, "As it stands already, Amazon does not honor misprices, yet if you walk into a store, they are legally bound to honor them." I answered, and later provided a link, explaining that a store is not required to honor a price mistake.
Perhaps you can explain a bit more about how I am wrong.
Perhaps you can explain a bit more about how I am wrong.
Your link/quote says that if an advertisement is misprinted, it need not be honored if an appropriate correction notice is posted immediately. That is a different situation and does not apply to the "$0.01" price tag on a computer that you were speaking of before.
Thus, you were wrong. Now that you are talking about something different, you are not.
01-29-07 | 03:43 PM
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Originally Posted by the Chief
This is different than a mispriced item. Which is why amazon MIGHT have a legal leg to stand on. Again(and toilet dcuk will call me on this again i'm sure) if the prices were marked $0.00 (or the like) on the items, amazon wouldnt be doing this.
Not if it's become predictable, I won't! Eh, at least I know someone's paying attention to me.
My CSR response in regards to this latest barrage of e-mails? Something along the lines of "Yes, we are still going to charge you for the DVDs, but contact us regarding the charge and we will make an exception and refund your money."
Sounds convoluted as hell (then again, it is coming from Amazon customer service), but seeing as how I still haven't authorized the charge and they are fully aware that I am willing to dispute it, I may just give them a chance and see if they follow through on the refund.
Oh, they also helpfully informed me that they will not in fact be charging me for my cancelled order (that, after second thoughts, I cancelled, not Amazon). Phew!
-Toilet Dcuk
01-29-07 | 03:55 PM
#925
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California law states otherwise:
The key being exercise of reasonable care.
17500. It is unlawful for any person, firm, corporation or
association, or any employee thereof with intent directly or
indirectly to dispose of real or personal property or to perform
services, professional or otherwise, or anything of any nature
whatsoever or to induce the public to enter into any obligation
relating thereto, to make or disseminate or cause to be made or
disseminated before the public in this state, or to make or
disseminate or cause to be made or disseminated from this state
before the public in any state, in any newspaper or other
publication, or any advertising device, or by public outcry or
proclamation, or in any other manner or means whatever, including
over the Internet, any statement, concerning that real or personal
property or those services, professional or otherwise, or concerning
any circumstance or matter of fact connected with the proposed
performance or disposition thereof, which is untrue or misleading,
and which is known, or which by the exercise of reasonable care
should be known, to be untrue or misleading, or for any person, firm,
or corporation to so make or disseminate or cause to be so made or
disseminated any such statement as part of a plan or scheme with the
intent not to sell that personal property or those services,
professional or otherwise, so advertised at the price stated therein,
or as so advertised. Any violation of the provisions of this
section is a misdemeanor punishable by imprisonment in the county
jail not exceeding six months, or by a fine not exceeding two
thousand five hundred dollars ($2,500), or by both that imprisonment
and fine.
association, or any employee thereof with intent directly or
indirectly to dispose of real or personal property or to perform
services, professional or otherwise, or anything of any nature
whatsoever or to induce the public to enter into any obligation
relating thereto, to make or disseminate or cause to be made or
disseminated before the public in this state, or to make or
disseminate or cause to be made or disseminated from this state
before the public in any state, in any newspaper or other
publication, or any advertising device, or by public outcry or
proclamation, or in any other manner or means whatever, including
over the Internet, any statement, concerning that real or personal
property or those services, professional or otherwise, or concerning
any circumstance or matter of fact connected with the proposed
performance or disposition thereof, which is untrue or misleading,
and which is known, or which by the exercise of reasonable care
should be known, to be untrue or misleading, or for any person, firm,
or corporation to so make or disseminate or cause to be so made or
disseminated any such statement as part of a plan or scheme with the
intent not to sell that personal property or those services,
professional or otherwise, so advertised at the price stated therein,
or as so advertised. Any violation of the provisions of this
section is a misdemeanor punishable by imprisonment in the county
jail not exceeding six months, or by a fine not exceeding two
thousand five hundred dollars ($2,500), or by both that imprisonment
and fine.