Recent Amazon Price Error: You'll be charged unless you return!!
#926
DVD Talk Limited Edition
Originally Posted by excom101
Also, Canadian commerce laws don't apply in the US.
Just want to make sure I am understanding you correctly.
#927
DVD Talk Special Edition
Originally Posted by Jah-Wren Ryel
Perhaps you should have stayed on the sidelines yourself... Do you actually know what you are claiming is true, or do you just think it? If you actually have proof that it is true, please provide the proof.
Every state I've lived in has had consumer protection laws that do require just that. Here's the first one that came up in google:
Pay Attention at the Checkout.
To prevent overcharges, make sure the items you purchase have price tags on them and that those tags match the price you are charged. If you are charged more than the tag price, notify the seller right away. Michigan law provides the seller must refund the difference plus a bonus of 10 times the difference up to $5.00, or be subject to a consumer lawsuit.
PS - notice there is nothing in this law about coming back a week later and getting your money back.
Every state I've lived in has had consumer protection laws that do require just that. Here's the first one that came up in google:
Pay Attention at the Checkout.
To prevent overcharges, make sure the items you purchase have price tags on them and that those tags match the price you are charged. If you are charged more than the tag price, notify the seller right away. Michigan law provides the seller must refund the difference plus a bonus of 10 times the difference up to $5.00, or be subject to a consumer lawsuit.
PS - notice there is nothing in this law about coming back a week later and getting your money back.
You must notify the seller that you were overcharged, within 30 days of the transaction, either in person or in writing. Within two days of receiving your notice, the seller may choose to refund you the difference between the amount charged and the price marked plus a "bonus" of ten times the difference, with a minimum of $1.00 and a maximum of $5.00. If the seller refuses to give you both the refund and the bonus, you may bring a lawsuit to recover your actual damages or $250.00, whichever is greater, plus reasonable attorney fees up to $300.00. (MCL 445.360a(2).)
Not to turn this thread into a treatise on Michigan consumer protection laws (goodness knows it has morphed into everything else), but it's interesting that the consumer is given a thirty day window to claim an overcharge and the seller is given an opportunity to correct the overcharge without penalty (i.e. no harm, no foul). Seems reasonable, no?
Now let's see, where have we seen a similar thirty day opportunity given to correct a mistake........
?
#928
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I'm not sure this even applies, but a basic tenet of contract law is that advertisements, displays, and other similar pricing methods are not actually offers, but rather invitations to make offers.
In other words, if a car dealership mistakenly runs an ad selling a Mercedes for $50 instead of $50,000, I can't show up and say "I accept, where's my new car?" Courts consider the mistaken advertisement as an invitation to make an offer. So when I show up and say "I accept..." I'm actually making an offer to the dealership to buy the car for $50, which they will likely reject.
So, taking a fresh, new 50-inch plasma with a $.50 price tag to the register and demanding the TV and change from your $1 bill probably won't work. Now, what happens if the person working the register actually sells it to you for that, I have no idea...
In other words, if a car dealership mistakenly runs an ad selling a Mercedes for $50 instead of $50,000, I can't show up and say "I accept, where's my new car?" Courts consider the mistaken advertisement as an invitation to make an offer. So when I show up and say "I accept..." I'm actually making an offer to the dealership to buy the car for $50, which they will likely reject.
So, taking a fresh, new 50-inch plasma with a $.50 price tag to the register and demanding the TV and change from your $1 bill probably won't work. Now, what happens if the person working the register actually sells it to you for that, I have no idea...
#929
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From: Phoenix, AZ
Originally Posted by Fire Joe Morgan
So, taking a fresh, new 50-inch plasma with a $.50 price tag to the register and demanding the TV and change from your $1 bill probably won't work. Now, what happens if the person working the register actually sells it to you for that, I have no idea...
I am not greedy. They can keep the change.
#930
DVD Talk Special Edition
Originally Posted by Jah-Wren Ryel
California law states otherwise:
17500. It is unlawful for any person, firm, corporation or
association, or any employee thereof with intent directly or
indirectly to dispose of real or personal property or to perform
services, professional or otherwise, or anything of any nature
whatsoever or to induce the public to enter into any obligation
relating thereto, to make or disseminate or cause to be made or
disseminated before the public in this state, or to make or
disseminate or cause to be made or disseminated from this state
before the public in any state, in any newspaper or other
publication, or any advertising device, or by public outcry or
proclamation, or in any other manner or means whatever, including
over the Internet, any statement, concerning that real or personal
property or those services, professional or otherwise, or concerning
any circumstance or matter of fact connected with the proposed
performance or disposition thereof, which is untrue or misleading,
and which is known, or which by the exercise of reasonable care
should be known, to be untrue or misleading, or for any person, firm,
or corporation to so make or disseminate or cause to be so made or
disseminated any such statement as part of a plan or scheme with the
intent not to sell that personal property or those services,
professional or otherwise, so advertised at the price stated therein,
or as so advertised. Any violation of the provisions of this
section is a misdemeanor punishable by imprisonment in the county
jail not exceeding six months, or by a fine not exceeding two
thousand five hundred dollars ($2,500), or by both that imprisonment
and fine.
The key being exercise of reasonable care.
17500. It is unlawful for any person, firm, corporation or
association, or any employee thereof with intent directly or
indirectly to dispose of real or personal property or to perform
services, professional or otherwise, or anything of any nature
whatsoever or to induce the public to enter into any obligation
relating thereto, to make or disseminate or cause to be made or
disseminated before the public in this state, or to make or
disseminate or cause to be made or disseminated from this state
before the public in any state, in any newspaper or other
publication, or any advertising device, or by public outcry or
proclamation, or in any other manner or means whatever, including
over the Internet, any statement, concerning that real or personal
property or those services, professional or otherwise, or concerning
any circumstance or matter of fact connected with the proposed
performance or disposition thereof, which is untrue or misleading,
and which is known, or which by the exercise of reasonable care
should be known, to be untrue or misleading, or for any person, firm,
or corporation to so make or disseminate or cause to be so made or
disseminated any such statement as part of a plan or scheme with the
intent not to sell that personal property or those services,
professional or otherwise, so advertised at the price stated therein,
or as so advertised. Any violation of the provisions of this
section is a misdemeanor punishable by imprisonment in the county
jail not exceeding six months, or by a fine not exceeding two
thousand five hundred dollars ($2,500), or by both that imprisonment
and fine.
The key being exercise of reasonable care.
That other side of the coin is that this very same consumer protection law goes on to state that a consumer must prove that he or she has suffered an "actual injury" and lost money or property as the result of a business' alleged unfair practice.
Who here claims to have been injured in this case?................................Didn't think so
#931
DVD Talk Special Edition
Originally Posted by Fire Joe Morgan
I'm not sure this even applies, but a basic tenet of contract law is that advertisements, displays, and other similar pricing methods are not actually offers, but rather invitations to make offers.
In other words, if a car dealership mistakenly runs an ad selling a Mercedes for $50 instead of $50,000, I can't show up and say "I accept, where's my new car?" Courts consider the mistaken advertisement as an invitation to make an offer. So when I show up and say "I accept..." I'm actually making an offer to the dealership to buy the car for $50, which they will likely reject.
So, taking a fresh, new 50-inch plasma with a $.50 price tag to the register and demanding the TV and change from your $1 bill probably won't work. Now, what happens if the person working the register actually sells it to you for that, I have no idea...
In other words, if a car dealership mistakenly runs an ad selling a Mercedes for $50 instead of $50,000, I can't show up and say "I accept, where's my new car?" Courts consider the mistaken advertisement as an invitation to make an offer. So when I show up and say "I accept..." I'm actually making an offer to the dealership to buy the car for $50, which they will likely reject.
So, taking a fresh, new 50-inch plasma with a $.50 price tag to the register and demanding the TV and change from your $1 bill probably won't work. Now, what happens if the person working the register actually sells it to you for that, I have no idea...
#932
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Originally Posted by Jah-Wren Ryel
Perhaps you should have stayed on the sidelines yourself... Do you actually know what you are claiming is true, or do you just think it? If you actually have proof that it is true, please provide the proof.
Every state I've lived in has had consumer protection laws that do require just that. Here's the first one that came up in google:
PS - notice there is nothing in this law about coming back a week later and getting your money back.
Every state I've lived in has had consumer protection laws that do require just that. Here's the first one that came up in google:
PS - notice there is nothing in this law about coming back a week later and getting your money back.
o and another thing..some of you probably didnt read this early THERE ARE DIFFERENT LEGAL RULES REGARDING B&M AND ONLINE! know somethin before saying somethin
and yes this might be handled on a state by state basis in the long end..if some sate explicitly prohibits amazon's behaviour
Last edited by romuo; 01-29-07 at 05:35 PM.
#933
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Originally Posted by romuo
he is right... best buy might be stuck selling computer for maybe 200-300 less (normal computer promotions) but no way would they be required LEGALLY to sell for a penny.
#934
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Originally Posted by excom101
Could you explain why they would be stuck in one case and not in the other?
-also the store itself might have a personal policy to honor ALL mistakes but thats not neccessary
ie..you guys should go shop at nordstroms because the customer is always right and no matter how much dvdtalkers
screw them over they will take all the hitas far as online mistakes go..they are held to a lesser standard of being honoroed..because a B&M store would only have to honor one misprice before changing the sign/price whereas an online shop doesnt face the same timeframe of doing things..it gets nitpicky
Last edited by romuo; 01-29-07 at 05:52 PM.
#935
DVD Talk Hall of Fame
I can see the 'obvious mistake' affecting expectations: that is, if I go to the store with their mispriced ad saying this 1000$ computer is 10.00, they can and should say, Um, no, and I'd walk away. But once they sell it to me, that's agreeing to the price, right or wrong. Sure, I may have thought the price was wrong, but since they sold it to me, obviously it was right.
I have an issue with the 'obvious mistake' thing. What's obvious to some is not obvious to others...as evidenced by this thread. Especially when it comes to loss leaders, both at the store and the manufacturer level. IANAL, so if you can quote a legal reference that discusses the 'obvious mistake', I'd like to read it.
And yes the etailer can get hit more on one misprice than the B&M....but they've also got , as far as I know, the opportunity to run their business for a whole lot less overhead, so it seems like it would be a wash to me.
And again as far as I know, no retailer is 'stuck' selling anything--they can refuse to sell anything to anybody for virtually any reason other than that of protected classes.
I have an issue with the 'obvious mistake' thing. What's obvious to some is not obvious to others...as evidenced by this thread. Especially when it comes to loss leaders, both at the store and the manufacturer level. IANAL, so if you can quote a legal reference that discusses the 'obvious mistake', I'd like to read it.
And yes the etailer can get hit more on one misprice than the B&M....but they've also got , as far as I know, the opportunity to run their business for a whole lot less overhead, so it seems like it would be a wash to me.
And again as far as I know, no retailer is 'stuck' selling anything--they can refuse to sell anything to anybody for virtually any reason other than that of protected classes.
#936
DVD Talk Limited Edition
But if they do generate the price, accept your offer to buy at that price, accept your payment, do not notify you of a higher charge or cancel the order as per their stated policy, and proceed to verify your order, accept your payment, and ship the item to you? What then?
#937
DVD Talk Hall of Fame
Originally Posted by drmoze
But if they do generate the price, accept your offer to buy at that price, accept your payment, do not notify you of a higher charge or cancel the order as per their stated policy, and proceed to verify your order, accept your payment, and ship the item to you? What then? 

In total agreement.
By the way, anyone get charged yet?
#938
DVD Talk Limited Edition
Originally Posted by romuo
cause there is a distinction between a misprice on the sellers part which the buyer would assume to be a correct price and a "misprice" the buyer knows is an obvious mistake. if someone was selling xbox360 premium for 349.99 or even 300 that could be a misprice the store would HAVE to honor wheras an xbox360 premium for $99.99 would be an obvious mistake that the buyer knows the seller made.
#939
DVD Talk Limited Edition
Originally Posted by ResIpsa
Who here claims to have been injured in this case?................................Didn't think so 

#940
DVD Talk Platinum Edition
Originally Posted by ResIpsa
Who here claims to have been injured in this case?................................Didn't think so 

#941
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From: Malvern, PA
Originally Posted by cpgator
Good catch - I will look for a US version. Just out of coursity, you believe that a store is required by law to honor all prices on all items in the store, regardless of obivious error, correct? Do you believe website have this same requirement? Does Best Buy and Best Buy .com both have to honor all listed prices?
Just want to make sure I am understanding you correctly.
Just want to make sure I am understanding you correctly.
#942
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From: Malvern, PA
Originally Posted by Peep
Interesting example. Wasn't Amazon running a promotion around that same period where they were selling a limited amount of 360's for $100?
#943
DVD Talk Hall of Fame
Originally Posted by Goldblum
In most states, I don't think a store has to honor an obvious misprice (e.g. a DVD for $.01). Thought I learned that in law school, but I could be wrong. Contracts was not my specialty.
But they did. What's being argued is that they can't honor it, then say, Whoops, never mind, changed our mind.
Yes, they had a very limited quantity of hot items drastically reduced for a very brief amount of time.
#944
If amazon does decide to charge those that don't return the DVD's, then couldn't you just turn around and return them after the charge for a refund? If you are being charged on 02/04/07, then it seems like that would be the start of when you could return for refund. I mean, amazon is making up the rules as they go along, so theoretically, this could NOT work, but it also seems as though you could say, well I was charged this and I decided I don't want it. Of course, if you want to fight the charges, that is another thing all together. Me, I'm just waiting to see what happens, I'm not calling my credit card company.
I'm waiting to see what amazon does next. Way back when this first started someone mentioned that had amazon been nicer about it, then they would have felt bad and returned the DVD's, but because of the tone of the e-mails, it makes you a little more defiant. I think I would agree with that contention. People can try and "refute" my position all they want, but it is what I would actually do, what you would actually do is different and that is your position. You can be skeptical, but I know that had amazon sent a "nicer" e-mail then I would have returned the DVD's without question.
I'll go ahead and make other's arguments against that and say, "Why should amazon be nice, you ripped them off?" One, I don't see that I have ripped amazon off. I see it that they have charged, had five days to correct it and decided to ship it anyway. They knew about the glitch, problem, whatever you want to call it and decided to ship them anyway. Two, they should be nice because that is what a respectable, reputable company does and I have no problem saying that I expect the best out of amazon. If this were happening with other e-tailers (who will remain nameless) it would be par for the course. However, I believe that amazon could have sent out an e-mail that was apologetic in tone rather than accusatory.
Those are just my two cents.
I'm waiting to see what amazon does next. Way back when this first started someone mentioned that had amazon been nicer about it, then they would have felt bad and returned the DVD's, but because of the tone of the e-mails, it makes you a little more defiant. I think I would agree with that contention. People can try and "refute" my position all they want, but it is what I would actually do, what you would actually do is different and that is your position. You can be skeptical, but I know that had amazon sent a "nicer" e-mail then I would have returned the DVD's without question.
I'll go ahead and make other's arguments against that and say, "Why should amazon be nice, you ripped them off?" One, I don't see that I have ripped amazon off. I see it that they have charged, had five days to correct it and decided to ship it anyway. They knew about the glitch, problem, whatever you want to call it and decided to ship them anyway. Two, they should be nice because that is what a respectable, reputable company does and I have no problem saying that I expect the best out of amazon. If this were happening with other e-tailers (who will remain nameless) it would be par for the course. However, I believe that amazon could have sent out an e-mail that was apologetic in tone rather than accusatory.
Those are just my two cents.
#945
DVD Talk Limited Edition
Originally Posted by dtcarson
I don't think anyone's arguing they "have" to honor it.
Originally Posted by BeatlePaul
As it stands already, Amazon does not honor misprices, yet if you walk into a store, they are legally bound to honor them.
Originally Posted by Jah-Wren Ryel
( And lastly, a store is not legally required to honor a pricing MISTAKE) Every state I've lived in has had consumer protection laws that do require just that.
Originally Posted by excom101
If you walk up to that counter with an item that is mistagged, in most places, they are required to give you the item for that price.
#947
DVD Talk Hall of Fame
So, does anyone know what is ACTUALLY happening with this? Has anyone gotten charged yet? Wading through these incessant posts spouting the same holier than thou attitudes is getting a little old. Would just like some actual info on the situation rather than some idiot on a soapbox posting his ramblings under multiple usernames.
#948
DVD Talk Legend
No charges yet, I assume since the date has been changed to Feb 2nd
#949
DVD Talk Legend
Originally Posted by jjcool
Would just like some actual info on the situation rather than some idiot on a soapbox posting his ramblings under multiple usernames.

I made one order(Rescue Me 1/Rescue Me 2) and received both e-mails stating that they were going to charge my card if I don't return the items. I have yet to contact Amazon at all regarding this whole thing(I decided to take the wait and see approach). As of right now, my credit card has not been charged, nor are there and holds for this order.
#950
Defunct Account
Originally Posted by jjcool
Wading through these incessant posts spouting the same holier than thou attitudes is getting a little old. Would just like some actual info on the situation rather than some idiot on a soapbox posting his ramblings under multiple usernames.



