In order for it to be their fault, one would have to concede it was smart for them to do it. Sony as a whole fucked the pooch by putting BD in PS3, thereby jacking up the price. PS3 at $300 at launch would have destroyed XBox.

Maybe it will work out for Sony in the (very) long run, but for now, Sony exchanged their overwhelming dominance of a multi-billion dollar market for a 60/40 split of a niche market. That was anything but smart.

Thats hardly fair considering the PS2 had DRE errors after 91 days of owning it. I ran a video game store for 2 years, it was almost a daily basis with someone walking in with a PS2 that could only play Silver back discs and not Blue or vice versa. At least MS is fixing them for free and giving a 3 year warranty, it was pulling teeth for Sony to even waive the $120 fee they charged to fix there system. Many times I had to mention I ran a store etc. just for them to do a favor for a good customer. Sony REALLY stepped up there game this generation with products that actually work, and kudos to them for that.

The Blu-ray makes sense for Sony because they have a "10 year plan" for the system. Problem is, video game systems only have a 4-5 year shelf life before the next system arrives. MS just started year 3! Sony did a few things wrong this generation that might (I think will) cost them the lead this generation.

1. Forcing Blu-ray
We, of course, LOVE this. PS3 is by far the best Blu-ray player on the market today, and maybe for the next year or two until Profile 2.0 players are on the market and cheaper. However, Sony sacraficed the PS3 for this format that a year later still has not won. HD DVD is willing to take it slow, BDA wants HD DVD dead and gone so they can start making money and stop lowering prices of stand alones and stop having BOGOs. As long as HD DVD is around they have to compete.

2. A year delay, because of Blu-ray
PS3 would have launched around the same time as the 360, but at the time, Blu-ray was WAY too expensive. If you think $600 for a PS3 is expensive, I imagine a Blu-ray enabled one in 2005 would have been twice as much. A 6 month delay was in order (April/May) and Sony delayed it again until November.

3. High Price Point
$500/$600 for a PS3 was too much considering the Xbox 360 launched a year earlier for $300/$400. Sony had in the past launched their hardware at $299, and now they wanted to double the price? Many average folk didn't know why, but it was because of Blu-ray.

4. 25/50GB means what?
While the Blu-ray disc can hold much more then a 360 disc (9GB vs. 25/50GB)....does that matter? Sony would say yes, and you can do this and that with it, but many games don't even use more then the normal 9GB that Xbox does, instead they pad them with useless files to take up the space. Sure, it does give developers more space to do what they want, but has anyone taken advantage of it yet?

5. BC Support
At first, Sony lashed out at MS for their half-asses emulation Backwards support. Sure, the 360 could play some Xbox games, but they ran terribly. They, of course, would allow anyone to play PS1/PS2 games right in their PS3 (much like the PS2 playing PS1 games). They touted it as a selling point, and it was. Then, they remove the EE Chip for the 80GB and now the PS3 emulates PS2/PS1 games. Then, they go a step farther and remove PS2 emulations completely from the now $399 40GB system. Why did they do this? Apparently last gen games are so last gen and they want people to focus on buying and playing this generations games. That would be great if they had great titles to play, but right now the selection is still so-so.

What did Sony do right with the PS3?

1. Best Blu-ray Player around!
You can't beat the PS3. Fast Loading, should be 2.0 compliant, great picture, etc.

2. Wireless included
The Wireless adapter built-in to the PS3 is a great idea and something MS should have done with the Elite models.

Ok, I'm done

In their defense, had the PS3 NOT included Blu-Ray, the format would be gone by now.. I feel.

I understand what you are saying but looking a year or two down the road people will be thankful that Sony made that decision. Besides, the price hasn't kept 4 or 5 million or so people from owning a PS3. I know they would like to dominate the competition but at the same time at least they have made it a point to put out their ideal product and that it isn't just a video game system. They always wanted the PS3 to be a centerpiece to someone's entertainment setup. I can tell you that it is a huge piece in my entertainment setup at my house. I can play games, watch high definition movies, watch shows off my hard drive, listen to music and browse the internet. And my wife is able to communicate with her family thousands of miles away for free. You are even starting to see some of the owners of the 360 that despised the PS3 starting to buy them now.

My comment is in regards to 360 vs. PS3 specifically. I think it's very fair. You spend $400 to get a system you might have to ship out to be fixed within 30 days, or you spend $100-$200 more for a more reliable system (albeit with less games).

I don't believe I tried to say Sony has always done a great job.

Excellent point. The PS3 has been very instrumental in making sure BD has been in the forefront so far. Granted it's not a commanding lead or anything but without the PS3, BD would have been DOA

Or you spend $40 on a Warranty from the store you bought it from

I still have my launch day 360 and an Elite and have never had a RROD. I know it happens, but so far Ive been lucky.

I don't know if very many people on this forum remember this (besides us early adopters), but before the PS3 launched, Blu-ray was DEAD. On Amazon, you would see 10 HD DVDs in front of the very first Blu-ray on the charts, usually in the #900 in sales. Blu-ray really was DEAD and many imagined at CES 07 that Fox/Disney/Lionsgate would go neutral. That didn't happen (and Fox used that time to announce 30+ titles, 20 being delayed) and the format really started to pick up. It was a different time.... with weekly "Blu-ray wins!" and "By March of 07 we will have a 5:1 lead"...good times

Agree. Without BD in PS3 there would be virtually no BD player sales and it would be a dead format by now.

However, to win the next gen DVD race they have lost their huge marketshare in the gaming arena. Blu-ray movies will have to be a big business for them at some point to make that loss in the video game arena worth it.

Are you suggesting the state of the 360 is acceptable and people should just deal with it by repeatedly exchanging defective systems at their point of purchase? I don't think you are, but it certainly sounds like it.

Besides, I believe Gamestop/EBGames has since stopped selling extended warranties on the 360 due to losing too much money on them.

My comment stands - I would never rely on the 360 for playing my HD DVD movies. Hell I owned a 360 at the time I bought my A1 for twice as much as the add-on would have cost me, simply because I knew it would be a more reliable and higher quality HD player.

I understand their "philosophy/strategy." I believe it is severely flawed, and sales numbers are backing my opinion up. PS3 sales lag far behind their competition. Making matters worse is that a console's cost is subsidized by the software sales. Over the life of the product, these "royalies" turn to profits, and in many cases the hardware is further discounted to grow the install base.

PS3 is not having a problem with BD software rom the looks of the sales numbers. However, there are few compelling pieces of gaming software on the system that are not available elsewhere. Games aren't selling, meaning these "royalties" are not coming in. Making the matter worse are the shoddy ports of games from other systems which damage the PS3's credibility. This happens with every system that is not the market leader.

Those that have followed video games for decades knew and were vocal that Sony was making mistake after mistake as PS3 news came out. The hardware, while powerful, was complex. The main reason there even is a PS3 is because the ultra successful PS had a more diverse library because of the ease of development over it's initial rival, Sega's Saturn, which everyone will admit was far more "powerful" on paper than PS.

BD is not needed for gaming. We have been hearing for over a year that there will be things on PS3 that just couldn't be done on XBox. What are they? DVD is plenty of storage space, for now. BD (or HD DVD or whatever) would have been a logical choice for PS4, because it would have been less of an economical hit on the system and there would have been technical necessity for it being included. It may have also been a useful feature, not a raison d'etre.

At this point, PS3 is a great BD player, but a lousy video game machine, both in terms of sales and in mindset of the market. There is a good segment of the market that will not accept PS3 as the "centerpiece" of their home theater since they associate the PlayStation brand as a "toy."

Sony, who learned a lot from the mistakes Nintendo and Sega made in the 90's seems to have forgotten everything they had learned. As a fan who bought a PS and PS2 on the first day of their availability, it stinks to see a brand I have loved for years fall so hard, so fast. But I am not "emotionally" attached to the brand. As long as the good games keep coming for one system or another, I'm good.

The issue is that many see Ps3's success as a HD media playback machine as equaling a successful product, and they are wrong. They were foolish to trade their sure-fire dominance for a shot at dominating an untested market. PS3, thus far, is a failure.

If you strip out the emotion from this post, it is pretty much dead on. I don't agree with the "rah rah HD DVD"-ish spin to the comments, but I think every point made is fairly irrefutable.

there doesn't seem to be a "report this post" button. where should someone post to report something to a moderator?

BT: I've been reading the several few pages of this thread. Liking/disliking a format is not a crime (not against forum rules either). While some of the posts are on the edge, the discussion has not been out of control. Leave it be.

namja
Moderator, DVD Talk Forums

Just click on .

So, uhhh Pirates and Superbad comes out tommorow so who's excited?

Me! Looks like I will pick up Superbad in store and get POTC3 from Amazon since its $6 + Tax cheaper then any other alternative. No great "bonus" things from any place either (except the Superbad Beanie which will surely be gone by the time I get to CC at 1pm)

Those 2 are killer, but I'm most excited to watch 20 Million Miles to Earth.

Maybe Castaway + Mr. & Mrs. Smith too, but I'm not sure that they are shipping.

I wish I could get my hands on that beanie but don't think they will have any left nor do I really want to give C.C. any of my money. Best Buy will have a bonus disc for POTC with purchase.

I heard the bonus disc contains the same things that the Blu-ray version exclusively has already.

I'd love to own those two, but that $27.95 price tag is just too much for me, especially since it's the holiday season. Netflix will have to do until I get me some gift cards to Amazon.

I'm passing on Castaway due to lack of extras (Trailer only) and the high price. Hopefully this will be a part of a BOGO in the future as the movie really is great, but the 2 disc SE is only $7.99 at Best Buy this week. I have yet to see Mr and Mrs. Smith...so a rental for me.

...and I ordered all three from Amazon yesterday.