5th Annual Criterion Challenge - Discussion Thread
#326
DVD Talk Hall of Fame
Re: 5th Annual Criterion Challenge - Discussion Thread
My own assessment of the film as "keeping its distance" has to do with the genre-blending that Anderson utilizes as well as the diversity of odd (even for him) stylistic choices. The camera and style is (I thought at the time) more erratic and extreme than in his previous films. I remember telling a friend that it felt like Anderson was chugging Red Bulls while making parts of the film.
During last month's challenge, I watched quite a few cartoon shows I watched as a child and realized that the 90s were the era of the referential cartoon.
I do not have a taste for Melville and have managed to avoid him.
#327
DVD Talk Platinum Edition
Re: 5th Annual Criterion Challenge - Discussion Thread
I have to add that icheckmovies has really helped me with this. It's very satisfying checking a movie off and seeing the list shorten or seeing that I got 27 checks for one movie (On the Waterfront had that many!). I've actually gotten an award there just from the few movies I've already watched this month!
#328
Re: 5th Annual Criterion Challenge - Discussion Thread
Thanks for the list...Streetcar has been on my list of shame for a while now. One day I'll get to it! I think I've mentioned it before during a challenge, so forgive me if it's a repeat, but I do try to mark off movies on that list of shame when I do these challenges. I've found several duds, but the few gems in there more than make up for it. Also, when people talk about those iconic movies, I can chime in rather than smiling and nodding along.
I have to add that icheckmovies has really helped me with this. It's very satisfying checking a movie off and seeing the list shorten or seeing that I got 27 checks for one movie (On the Waterfront had that many!). I've actually gotten an award there just from the few movies I've already watched this month!
I have to add that icheckmovies has really helped me with this. It's very satisfying checking a movie off and seeing the list shorten or seeing that I got 27 checks for one movie (On the Waterfront had that many!). I've actually gotten an award there just from the few movies I've already watched this month!In other news, I finally saw Henri-Georges Clouzot's DIABOLIQUE (1955). It was written by the French writers who later wrote the source novel for Hitchcock's VERTIGO. They, in fact, had wanted Hitchcock to direct DIABOLIQUE. Too bad he didn't. I might have liked it then. Hitchcock had a way of making nonsense like this work. The French don't. They take this kind of absurd story way too seriously.
Last edited by Ash Ketchum; 09-11-13 at 07:00 PM.
#329
Re: 5th Annual Criterion Challenge - Discussion Thread
I watched BLOW OUT again tonight. I don't know how many times I've seen it, but it still has yet to become one of my favorite De Palma films. It's good--make no mistake of that; I just don't connect to it quite as solidly as I do with PHANTOM OF THE PARADISE, CARRIE, BODY DOUBLE, or CASUALTIES OF WAR. I think that Travolta's never been better, and I always love John Lithgow when he plays a heavy, but Nancy Allen (whom I love dearly) was just wrong for her role. You should probably take my opinion with a grain of salt, however, as several of my friends think that BLOW OUT is undoubtedly De Palma's best movie.
The Criterion disc has a great batch of supplements: there's an hour-long interview with De Palma conducted by director Noah Baumbach (whose first film, KICKING AND SCREAMING, is in the Criterion Collection, and whose latest film, FRANCES HA, is coming to the Collection soon) that was absorbing; a half-hour interview with Nancy Allen, who still looks great; and a 15-minute interview with Garrett Brown, the guy who invented the Steadicam, which is pretty cool. There's also the complete early De Palma feature MURDER A LA MOD, which I haven't gotten around to watching yet, and some on-set shots.
The Criterion disc has a great batch of supplements: there's an hour-long interview with De Palma conducted by director Noah Baumbach (whose first film, KICKING AND SCREAMING, is in the Criterion Collection, and whose latest film, FRANCES HA, is coming to the Collection soon) that was absorbing; a half-hour interview with Nancy Allen, who still looks great; and a 15-minute interview with Garrett Brown, the guy who invented the Steadicam, which is pretty cool. There's also the complete early De Palma feature MURDER A LA MOD, which I haven't gotten around to watching yet, and some on-set shots.
#330
Re: 5th Annual Criterion Challenge - Discussion Thread
In other news, I finally saw Henri-Georges Clouzot's DIABOLIQUE (1955). It was written by the French writers who later wrote the source novel for Hitchcock's VERTIGO. They, in fact, had wanted Hitchcock to direct DIABOLIQUE. Too bad he didn't. I might have liked it then. Hitchcock had a way of making nonsense like this work. The French don't. They take this kind of absurd story way too seriously.
You may be the first person I've come across that watches foreign films and doesn't like DIABOLIQUE. Sure, it may be nonsense, but the actors and director play it completely straight and approach it with conviction, so it works for me in spades. I was lucky enough to see it not long after movies, for me, went from being passing entertainment to something to be studied and appreciated as art, and I dug it HARD. Still do. I also got to see it before I'd seen any of the movies that ripped it off (well, except PSYCHO), so all the twists were new to me and terribly effective.
Every once in a while, especially on rainy Sunday afternoons, I'll pop it in and watch a bit of it, just because I love the atmosphere of the run-down boarding school. It also helps that I find Vera Clouzot to be quite fetching. Even though the Sharon Stone version was awful, there was a made-for-TV remake in the '70s called REFLECTIONS OF MURDER, directed by John Badham and starring Tuesday Weld, Joan Hackett, and Lance Kerwin, that was really, really well done. I've got it on VHS around here somewhere.
#331
DVD Talk Hall of Fame
Re: 5th Annual Criterion Challenge - Discussion Thread
Shortly after midnight last night, I revisited The Spy Who Came in from the Cold. From my Letterboxd diary:
-X- 1960 (1965)
-X- #451-500 (#452)
-X- Language: English
-X- Theme: Novels on the Big Screen
-X- Theme: War Films
-X- Essay: The Spy Who Came in from the Cold: True Ritt by Michael Sragow
-X- The Spy Who Came in from the Cold Trailer [on Criterion.com]
1/10 John Taylor's Top 10
1/10 Wes Anderson's Top 10
Spoiler:
-X- 1960 (1965)
-X- #451-500 (#452)
-X- Language: English
-X- Theme: Novels on the Big Screen
-X- Theme: War Films
-X- Essay: The Spy Who Came in from the Cold: True Ritt by Michael Sragow
-X- The Spy Who Came in from the Cold Trailer [on Criterion.com]
1/10 John Taylor's Top 10
1/10 Wes Anderson's Top 10
Last edited by Travis McClain; 09-12-13 at 03:21 AM.
#332
Re: 5th Annual Criterion Challenge - Discussion Thread
Ash,
You may be the first person I've come across that watches foreign films and doesn't like DIABOLIQUE. Sure, it may be nonsense, but the actors and director play it completely straight and approach it with conviction, so it works for me in spades. I was lucky enough to see it not long after movies, for me, went from being passing entertainment to something to be studied and appreciated as art, and I dug it HARD. Still do. I also got to see it before I'd seen any of the movies that ripped it off (well, except PSYCHO), so all the twists were new to me and terribly effective.
Every once in a while, especially on rainy Sunday afternoons, I'll pop it in and watch a bit of it, just because I love the atmosphere of the run-down boarding school. It also helps that I find Vera Clouzot to be quite fetching. Even though the Sharon Stone version was awful, there was a made-for-TV remake in the '70s called REFLECTIONS OF MURDER, directed by John Badham and starring Tuesday Weld, Joan Hackett, and Lance Kerwin, that was really, really well done. I've got it on VHS around here somewhere.
You may be the first person I've come across that watches foreign films and doesn't like DIABOLIQUE. Sure, it may be nonsense, but the actors and director play it completely straight and approach it with conviction, so it works for me in spades. I was lucky enough to see it not long after movies, for me, went from being passing entertainment to something to be studied and appreciated as art, and I dug it HARD. Still do. I also got to see it before I'd seen any of the movies that ripped it off (well, except PSYCHO), so all the twists were new to me and terribly effective.
Every once in a while, especially on rainy Sunday afternoons, I'll pop it in and watch a bit of it, just because I love the atmosphere of the run-down boarding school. It also helps that I find Vera Clouzot to be quite fetching. Even though the Sharon Stone version was awful, there was a made-for-TV remake in the '70s called REFLECTIONS OF MURDER, directed by John Badham and starring Tuesday Weld, Joan Hackett, and Lance Kerwin, that was really, really well done. I've got it on VHS around here somewhere.
Spoiler:
#333
DVD Talk Hall of Fame
Re: 5th Annual Criterion Challenge - Discussion Thread
I haven't conducted any research studies to gather empirical data, but my high school class watched a Cousteau documentary every now and again in school and his name would come up in the occasional biology class. Ahab is known for his obsession, but my reflexive reaction would be that Cousteau is a clearer shorthand for Zissou as a character than is Ahab, if only because Ahab has been appropriated for any kind of obsession. Cousteau, however, specifically evokes dedicated underwater research and documentarian work.
That's a harsh - and fairly ludicrous - comparison, I'd say! But, if true, that would still make Ahab firmly in the public consciousness... and with considerably more justification that various un-"celebrities".Interestingly enough, when I revisited the film a couple of years ago, I realized that it's essentially The Wrath of Khan at sea. And, of course, TWOK borrowed heavily from Moby Dick, so I laughed when I realized I hadn't actually thought of Moby Dick prior to the TWOK realization. No one who ever taught me an English class would be surprised to learn I respond more strongly to Star Trek than to classic literature, though.
#334
Re: 5th Annual Criterion Challenge - Discussion Thread
Shortly after midnight last night, I revisited The Spy Who Came in from the Cold. From my Letterboxd diary:
-X- 1960 (1965)
-X- #451-500 (#452)
-X- Language: English
-X- Theme: Novels on the Big Screen
-X- Theme: War Films
-X- Essay: The Spy Who Came in from the Cold: True Ritt by Michael Sragow
-X- The Spy Who Came in from the Cold Trailer [on Criterion.com]
1/10 John Taylor's Top 10
1/10 Wes Anderson's Top 10
-X- 1960 (1965)
-X- #451-500 (#452)
-X- Language: English
-X- Theme: Novels on the Big Screen
-X- Theme: War Films
-X- Essay: The Spy Who Came in from the Cold: True Ritt by Michael Sragow
-X- The Spy Who Came in from the Cold Trailer [on Criterion.com]
1/10 John Taylor's Top 10
1/10 Wes Anderson's Top 10
#335
#336
DVD Talk Hall of Fame
Re: 5th Annual Criterion Challenge - Discussion Thread
I watched SPY WHO CAME IN FROM THE COLD for the first time right after reading the book and I was unmoved precisely because it was so close to the book and I'd just read the book. It seemed redundant. Nothing wrong with the film itself, very well acted, directed and put together. It was just anti-climactic. I need to see the film again after the memory of the book fades.
#337
DVD Talk Hall of Fame
Re: 5th Annual Criterion Challenge - Discussion Thread
Revisited Gojira this morning. This film never ceases to amaze me. While the vast majority of 50s-70s Godzilla films were widely known for camp sci fi status, the original that started it all is a very serious and thoughtful anti nuclear allegory, complete with some very moving scenes.
Spoiler:
#338
DVD Talk Special Edition
Re: 5th Annual Criterion Challenge - Discussion Thread
) I do have Les Enfants Terribles on my list of films to watch this month.All this talk of The Spy Who Came in From the Cold compels me to seek it out, but the library doesn't have a copy. Boo. I read the novel when I was fourteen or so while visiting my grandparents for the summer. Grandma loves spy novels and suggested it. While I do not remember a lot about it, I do remember staying up until early in the morning to finish reading it.
#339
Challenge Guru & Comic Nerd
Re: 5th Annual Criterion Challenge - Discussion Thread
Celebrating my birthday with my favorite* film of all time, Monty Python and the Holy Grail.
Or sometimes Jaws, or Ben Hur, or Ordet.
Or sometimes Jaws, or Ben Hur, or Ordet.
#340
DVD Talk Platinum Edition
Re: 5th Annual Criterion Challenge - Discussion Thread
Spoiler:
I have been watching the Sabu! box set, Eclipse series tonight. This includes, The Jungle Book, The Drum and The Elephant Boy. I watched the Jungle Book first, the The Elephant Boy. While I enjoyed the first, the second wasn't near as good. Part of it is that in the 2nd one, they treat the animals horribly. And I'm pretty sure they did it just for the movie-no special effects used there!
It has been nice seeing this part in India's history, though. Having visited there, a quite a bit ago, it's interesting to see how they were perceived during Colonial/British occupation times, The Drum especially with this.
#341
DVD Talk Hall of Fame
#342
DVD Talk Hall of Fame
Re: 5th Annual Criterion Challenge - Discussion Thread
It wasn't for my birthday as mine was last month, but I watched Monty Python and the Holy Grail earlier in the challenge.
#344
DVD Talk Special Edition
#345
DVD Talk Ultimate Edition
Re: 5th Annual Criterion Challenge - Discussion Thread
...Then I watched something completely different: Luis Buñuel’s The Milky Way (1969). I was introduced to Buñuel through a screening of The Discreet Charm of the Bourgeoisie. I instantly feel in love – even though the film confused the hell out of me. I quickly watched more of his films but had never got around to this one. Its DVD release highlights why I really like the Criterion Collection. While watching the film, I was again confused (not the sharpest) and did not find it as interesting or fulfilling as the director’s other films. I was expecting a withering satire, and while there are definitely satirical parts and an absurdist tone throughout, the film really just explores how religious fanaticism operates by putting the world on a slant.
So after watching, I felt dissatisfied and worked my way through the provided interviews, documentary and essays. Through these, I was able to develop a clear idea about the film’s objectives and the context in which it was made. I think my initial (and continued on some points) confusion is due to my ignorance of Catholicism. The parts I found funny were connected with issues that were also applicable to Protestantism. I grew up United Pentecostal – which was an odd experience – so I was able to grasp some of the points about fanatics and quibbling over semantics and minor points. In the interview with Jean-Claude Carrière, he mentions that Milos Forman that the film was very political, because it’s critique of fanaticism could also be applied to political and philosophical movements of the time – something I would never have though of even though it makes perfect sense.
So after watching, I felt dissatisfied and worked my way through the provided interviews, documentary and essays. Through these, I was able to develop a clear idea about the film’s objectives and the context in which it was made. I think my initial (and continued on some points) confusion is due to my ignorance of Catholicism. The parts I found funny were connected with issues that were also applicable to Protestantism. I grew up United Pentecostal – which was an odd experience – so I was able to grasp some of the points about fanatics and quibbling over semantics and minor points. In the interview with Jean-Claude Carrière, he mentions that Milos Forman that the film was very political, because it’s critique of fanaticism could also be applied to political and philosophical movements of the time – something I would never have though of even though it makes perfect sense.
#346
DVD Talk Special Edition
Re: 5th Annual Criterion Challenge - Discussion Thread
The Milky Way is one of my favorite films; it's an oddball presentation of various religious heresy staged in an absurd manner this is humorous but thought provoking (to me). I found it to have a lot of substance and depth, some of which initially escaped me. There's a lot of culturally specific commentary involved. I searched the thread looking for discussion about Milky Way because I plan to revisit it soon but I've really enjoyed it. I love the sword duel bit, poker monks, and the rabbit pate gag. Since Criterion lost the rights to Milky Way, I wonder if we will see anyone re-issue it in high definition.
Hopefully, someone will re-issue Buñuel's films in HD. His films are so visually interesting that they definitely deserve a spectacular release. I rewatched The Discreet Charm of the Bourgeoisie recently and laughed so hard that I had to pause several times so I didn't miss subtitles. I am planning to watch Phantom of Liberty at some point. It's another one that I've never seen.
#347
DVD Talk Ultimate Edition
Re: 5th Annual Criterion Challenge - Discussion Thread
Hopefully, someone will re-issue Buñuel's films in HD. His films are so visually interesting that they definitely deserve a spectacular release. I rewatched The Discreet Charm of the Bourgeoisie recently and laughed so hard that I had to pause several times so I didn't miss subtitles. I am planning to watch Phantom of Liberty at some point. It's another one that I've never seen.
#348
DVD Talk Gold Edition
Re: 5th Annual Criterion Challenge - Discussion Thread
I watched Bergman's Winter Light, a brilliant, albeit bleak, film about a a Lutheran pastor's inability to salve the existential dread felt by one of his congregants. It's clear that Bergman is addressing a crisis in faith, shown by the pastor's admission that he doesn't think God exists, but the congregant would have been better served by going to a psychiatrist to be treated for clinical depression. For me, the real standout is the pastor's housekeeper/girlfriend's monologue, performed in one take directly to the camera, as he reads her letter.
I didn't quite get Bergman's purpose in making his protagonist such a selfish, cold, unfeeling prick. He's so unpleasant and callous; how can anyone in the audience identify with him?
I didn't quite get Bergman's purpose in making his protagonist such a selfish, cold, unfeeling prick. He's so unpleasant and callous; how can anyone in the audience identify with him?
Last edited by Gobear; 09-14-13 at 12:35 AM.
#349
DVD Talk Hall of Fame
Re: 5th Annual Criterion Challenge - Discussion Thread
Forgot to share it, but yesterday morning I watched Koyaanisqatsi. From my Letterboxd diary:
-X- 1980 (1983)
-X- 601-650 (#640)
-X- Theme: Cult Movies
-X- Theme: Documentaries
-X- Theme: First Films
-X- Theme: Great Soundtracks
1/10 List: Christopher Nolan's Top 10
Spoiler:
-X- 1980 (1983)
-X- 601-650 (#640)
-X- Theme: Cult Movies
-X- Theme: Documentaries
-X- Theme: First Films
-X- Theme: Great Soundtracks
1/10 List: Christopher Nolan's Top 10
#350
DVD Talk Hall of Fame
Re: 5th Annual Criterion Challenge - Discussion Thread
Today I watched Days of Heaven - completely by chance exactly* 35 years after it opened on September 13, 1978. It literally put me to sleep at least three times, so I wound up watching much of it twice, and still have very little idea what it's about or why it matters. Amazon said it's one of the most critically acclaimed films of all time, which I suppose should have tipped me off - given that that's often shorthand for "no-one saw it" and/or "didn't make any money" (Wikipedia, I now see, alleges both) - but I really don't know why it's held in such supposed high estimation.
The voiceover didn't add anything, or clarify much, and sounded... off. I wonder if the accent was affected, which sometimes takes me out of things, or it's just a side-effect of watching it under inopportune circumstances, but either way... possibly the most charitable thing I can say is that I'm fairly sure I'm not the target audience.
EDIT: I think I've worked out why I didn't enjoy it. From Wikipedia: "Following the completion of principal photography, the editing process took more than two years... Malick had a difficult time shaping the film and getting the pieces to go together... Malick jettisoned much of the film's dialogue, replacing it with Manz's voice-over..."
So it's a poorly-constructed complicated jigsaw that doesn't necessarily even reflect what was shot, and the voiceover I didn't like replaced the dialogue I was expecting. That'd do it... but maybe I'll look out an essay and see what 'Experts' say.
*Hopefully an actual, accurate use of "exactly"..!
The voiceover didn't add anything, or clarify much, and sounded... off. I wonder if the accent was affected, which sometimes takes me out of things, or it's just a side-effect of watching it under inopportune circumstances, but either way... possibly the most charitable thing I can say is that I'm fairly sure I'm not the target audience.
EDIT: I think I've worked out why I didn't enjoy it. From Wikipedia: "Following the completion of principal photography, the editing process took more than two years... Malick had a difficult time shaping the film and getting the pieces to go together... Malick jettisoned much of the film's dialogue, replacing it with Manz's voice-over..."
So it's a poorly-constructed complicated jigsaw that doesn't necessarily even reflect what was shot, and the voiceover I didn't like replaced the dialogue I was expecting. That'd do it... but maybe I'll look out an essay and see what 'Experts' say.

*Hopefully an actual, accurate use of "exactly"..!
Last edited by ntnon; 09-14-13 at 07:10 AM.





