Happy? Hell no we weren't. I had many heated discussions on this forum with people like JoshD that would call everyone with PS2 problems liars simply because Sony tried to deny the problem for years till they finally settled the class action law suit.

I absolutely agree that it is great MS is fixing these and extending the warranties, but that does not excuse them for selling this broken design for two years. They are still trying to deny the disc scratching problems I have seen happen to a friends games and the extended warranty is only for the red ring of death.

It is a good first step by MS, but they need to fix this design permantely to insure these problems stop.

To Sony's credit they at least redesigned the PS2 and built solid hardware with the PSP and PS3. MS can solve all these problems by fixing the 360 issues for good.

This time I summarized only the crap I care aboot

touche mister pussycat!

Honestly, I don't think there's anyway that PS2 problems were anywhere close to the problems the 360 has.

Yeah they would work fine under warranty then the drive would crap out and either stop reading CD's or DVD's. You have evidently never worked retail around consoles, although it doesn't factor the 360, when the PS2/Gamecube/Xbox were the console choices we easily got back 8-10 PS2's to every 1 Gamecube or Xbox that was defective, and I've heard horror stories from people that were around for the PS1 lifespan. I applaud SONY for the PS3 as we don't see a defect rate anywhere near their other 2 consoles.

We really don't take that many 360's back either, but with the free repairs most people are likely sending them in so we don't see a lot of the returns. I'm in the same boat as GizmoDVD though I bought mine at launch 11-22-05 and haven't had a problem yet.

Thanks. I too worked in a game store for 2 years when the PS2/Xbox/Cube were the generation. We got back at least 10 PS2 systems a week with issues (which I would buy off the customers for $10-$20, fix, and resell on ebay), and this was at a store that had maybe 15 customers a day if we were lucky.

fumanstan, Don't downplay the issue because you are your friend has a PS2 and it was fine. Many Many Many people had issues with the PS2. Why do you think so many people were adamant about buying a warranty for the PS3? Because they to went through the PS2 generation with issues.

You do realize that Sony probably also sold around 8-10 times more PS2s than Nintendo and MS sold GCs and Xboxes right? Of course more are going to come back because of that fact alone.

I'm not going to deny the problems the PS2 had, but I don't remember anywhere near the prevalance I hear about the current Xbox. Also, let's not forget, the PS2 was 100 cheaper and usually 200 cheaper than the Premium Xbox.

That's a very good point, that a lot of people seem to forget.

Didn't the Xbox and Cube both sell around 20 million and PS2 around 100 million? That would mean it sold 5 times as much, not 8-10 times as much.

Also, didn't most of the PS2 sales take place starting around the time GTA III came out and the first price drop? The PS2 problems were mostly fixed by then.

Any first gen PS2 owner rightfully feared getting the "DRE". Sure it may not have been as widespread as the 360's RROD since MS has said that EVERY 360 is defective, but the PS2 DRE problem was also notorious. If it had not been, then the class action suit never would have passed.

Many people back then were holding out on buying a PS2 until the DRE issues were fixed (I was one of them), just like many people nowadays are holding out on the 360 until the RROD is fixed.

I was not saying it wasn't a problem, but simply that the 360 problem seems much more widespread and the premium is also $100 more than the opening PS2 price. The PS2 having problems was bad luck for those people. People who don't have their 360's break consider themselves lucky. I'm not bashing. I owned all three last gen systems, and would own a 360 now (only a Wii owner) if they were cheaper and more reliable. It actually is upsetting me to hear these reports since I would love to jump on Live and play Gears and Halo 3 with the rest of the DVDtalkers. I loved doing that for the original Xbox.

On your other point, the PS2 sales were huge from day one. GTAIII may have solidified it, but you don't remember stories of people selling theirs for 1000 on eBay after launch? It's the whole reason for all the ebaying and market speculation this generation.

The 8-10 times was just a guess, but 5 times as much is still significantly more.

Plus the issues were different. The issue with the PS2 was the disc drive which was probably purchased by Sony from a manufacturer to put into the machine. The issue with the 360 is a design flaw. Some basic QA should have made them aware of the issue prior to the system launch.

My launch 360 still works fine...my launch PS2 still works fine...but my launch PS1 has to be played up-side-down to read discs. That's the only system I've ever had fail on me....(runs to go knock on wood)

I would count on one more price drop prior to Xmas.

Not really. People sold their 360s for $1000 after launch as well. That doesn't mean anything. There were shortages driving the secondary market just like the 360 and the Wii. The PS2 didn't start moving until the price drop.

Yeah, production supply was very low the entire first year of the PS2. Supply shortages always make something appear to sell better than it really does. According to the vgchartz.com, the PS3 has sold as many consoles in the same time frame as the PS2 did (by aligning the launch periods). The PS3 seems to not be selling well because supply is much greater than demand whereas the PS2 seemed to sell like hotcakes because demand was much greater than supply. PS2 sales really did not skyrocket until GTA III and the first price drop.

I do agree that the 360's problem is much more widespread for one simple reason. It is a manufacturing defect. Every single 360 currently sold is defective. There are 10 million defective 360s. The PS2 did not have a 100% defective rate, but it was much higher than the norm.

What are you people going on about? I thought this was for info related to a price drop.

Yeah! get your own damn thread! <--- Corvin's Monkey

hey now. There was some talk about a PS2 price drop at some point.

This is 2007. Sony had issues back in 2001-2003. Back them, not everyone had access to a computer to bitch about products. Nowadays just about everyone has access to the internet, including on their phones. As I kid I thought me and my friends were the only ones with blinking NES systems. Who knew!

50 bux off known defective hardware? Sign me up! Actually, scratch that, i realized i am smart enough to avoid faulty hardware.

How about the sony fan boys stay out of the 360 thread m'kay.

I didn't downplay the issue. I'm just saying the 360 problem is far worse. You can cite whatever reasons you have, but from my perspective I simply don't believe that to be the case. Your personal experience might say otherwise, but mine leads me to my own conclusion. And hell, i'm a 360 fan out of all the consoles this generation.

And I think people were more adamant about a warranty because of the already existent 360 problems and protecting their $600 console. Yeah, previous generation defects had an effect, but looking around and seeing 360 owners pay $140 for repair was probably a bit scary.

Forget PS2 - how about the fact that every single first-run Playstation had a defective laser assembly that caused massive FMV skipping and later the inability to read discs? Any of you remember rigging up your PS upside down so it would still read discs?

Many game systems have problems. It's actually a huge step forward in terms of consumer power that we have MS admitting to a manufacturing fault and extending warranties. This type of activity now sets a precedent.

Is that a fair comparison though? The PS3 may have the same first year sales numbers, but the PS2 was sold out and COULD NOT PHYSICALLY sell more. Are you going to argue that if more weren't available, that they also wouldn't have sold? I just can't agree with that. I am saying if they had more, they would have sold more.

But, maybe we should end this discussion because it's off-topic as interesting as I may find it.

I was hoping for a larger price drop. I wanted to pick up a Premium for 350 after warranty. Four hundred is still just too much for me to drop at this point.

That's all hypothetical though. The Wii would sell a ton more if Nintendo could get them out there. There is also the whole "limted availability driving demand even higher" angle. If there were Wiis on every store shelf, would they still be selling more? Same with the PS2. You can only deal with concrete numbers.

Probably, but like Michael Corvin said, it wouldn't have been guaranteed. Some people buy because of the whole limited availability thing. Some people were not interested in actually owning a PS2; they just saw the potential to make a huge profit by reselling it on ebay, so some people bought it for that sole purpose.

Anyway, how well the PS2 sold its first year really wasn't my main point for saying that. You were claiming that there were many more defective PS2s simply because they greatly outnumbered Xbox/Cube hardware. I was saying that wasn't really the case because the first and maybe some of the second year PS2s were the ones with the DRE problems, and the limited supply of the first year kept sales down. There really were not that many first year DRE machines compared to later year console sales.