hey it has the dad from Malcom In the Middle as the lead!

i think Djariya or a mod should put "contains possible Game of Thrones spoilers" in the thread title

Joffrey is a child, his behavior is mainly a result of his parents. You can't beat a dog and call it evil for snapping at people.

Catelyn treated John Snow a child like crap all his life for the crime of being born. She also imprisoned a innocent man and almost had him killed.

Theon isn't close to being evil. He was prisoner of the Starks not a guest. He also fought for the Starks and saved the life of Brandon. Theon's first plan was to help the Starks. He was not mistreated but only one of the Starks treated him as family. He was just above prisoner to Cat and Ned.

Tyrion? This is the worst example you gave. He did everything he could to save king's landing and tried his best to protect Sansa. If anything he is almost always good. His bad side comes about when dealing with his family. He would do anything to protect his family.

Ned's actions got most of his people killed. He put his honor above the safety of his people.

Spottedfeather already said he had never watched the show, only clips. Unless he suddenly did a 20 hour marathon AND read the books (some of those things mentioned are in future seasons) his posts are the result of some furious internet research. How much does someone want to prove their point?

That's the problem with talking about a show you never watched (like the complaints about Walking Dead), just say you don't like it or it's not for you. Don't make crap up to and then research it in order to prove your point.

Strike Back (Cinemax) Do not get this channel
Once Upon a Time (ABC) No interest
Revenge (ABC) Watched and liked
The Good Wife (CBS) No interestd
2 Broke Girls (CBS) No interested
Castle (ABC) Tried, did not like
Happy Endings (ABC) Never heard of it
New Girl (FOX) Never heard of it
Parenthood (NBC) Never heard of it
Modern Family (ABC) No interest
Glee (FOX) Tried, did not like
Suburgatory (ABC) Never heard of it
Person of Interest (CBS) Never heard of it
The Vampire Diaries (CW) Never heard of it
Parks and Recreation (NBC) Do not like the cast
30 Rock (NBC) Do not like the cast
The Office (NBC) Tried, not funny, do not like
Fringe (FOX) Tried first season, then it went off the rails
Community (NBC) Never heard of it
Grimm (NBC) Tried, liked but too slow to develop
Nikita (CW) Never heard of it
Homeland (Showtime) Never heard of it
Game of Thrones (HBO) Lost interest when Sean Bean was killed
Girls (HBO) Never heard of it
Dexter (Showtime) Never heard of it
Episodes (Showtime)Never heard of it
Spartacus (Starz) Do not get this channel
Justified (FX) Never heard of it
Sons of Anarchy (FX) No interest
Covert Affairs (USA) Tried, did not like
White Collar (USA) Tried, did not like
Burn Notice (USA) Tried, did not like
Suits (USA) Never heard of it
Boardwalk Empire (HBO) No interest
The Newsroom (HBO) No interest
Veep (HBO) No interest
The Walking Dead (AMC) Tried, could not get into story
Breaking Bad (AMC) No interest
American Horror Story (FX) Never heard of it
Hawaii Five-O (CBS) Tried, got tired of the comedy, terrible show
Louie (FX) Not interested
Boss (Starz) Do not get this channel, never heard of it
NCIS (CBS) Sometimes watch reruns when I need a laugh, good comedy
Mad Men (AMC) Tried, did not like
Pretty Little Liars (ABC Family) Never heard of it

Edited. Sorry guys

Don't watch:
Strike Back (Cinemax) - Don't have Cinemax
Once Upon a Time (ABC) - Unappealing
Revenge (ABC) - Tried, didn't like
2 Broke Girls (CBS) - Tried, didn't like, not as bad as the Lorre shows, but not good
Castle (ABC) - Tried, didn't care for it
Glee (FOX) - Tried it, didn't care for it
Person of Interest (CBS) - Tried it, didn't care for it
The Vampire Diaries (CW) - Thought it was terrible
Boardwalk Empire (HBO) - Tried the first season, bored the hell out of me
The Good Wife (CBS) - Will probably watch as a box set one day
Grimm (NBC) - Tried it, didn't like it
Nikita (CW) - Tried it, didn't care for it
Covert Affairs (USA) - Tried, lost interest
White Collar (USA) - Tried, lost interest
Game of Thrones (HBO) - Could never get past the first few episodes, will try again sometime
Episodes (Showtime) - No interest
Spartacus (Starz) - No interest, don't get Starz
Boss (Starz) - Don't get Starz
The Walking Dead (AMC) - Zzzzz.
Justified (FX) - Never got around to it
Sons of Anarchy (FX) - Never got around to it, heard later seasons suck
NCIS (CBS) - Procedurals are kind of boring, no exception here.
Mad Men (AMC) - Never found it all that interesting
Pretty Little Liars (ABC Family) - Just wasn't all that interesting
The Newsroom (HBO) - Will watch eventually
Veep (HBO) - Will watch eventually, especially if Season 2 has an increase in quality
Hawaii Five-O (CBS) - Procedurals are kind of boring, no exception here.

Watch occasionally:
Burn Notice (USA) - Watched several seasons, will finish one day
Parks and Recreation (NBC) - Watch it occasionally
The Office (NBC) - Watch it occasionally
Fringe (FOX) - I want to like the show more than I do, when it goes into serial mode it's very interesting, when it's Monster of the Week I don't care for it, watch occasionally
Happy Endings (ABC) - Watch it occasionally, not very funny but enjoyable cast
Parenthood (NBC) - Watch it occasionally
Suburgatory (ABC) - Watch it occasionally
Suits (USA) - Watch it on demand from time to time
Louie (FX) - Watch occasionally

Watch:
Dexter (Showtime) - I watch it, but was never a huge fan and the show has gotten worse
30 Rock (NBC) - Watch it
Community (NBC) - Favorite sitcom, watch it
New Girl (FOX) - Watch it, enjoy it, better version of Happy Endings imo
Modern Family (ABC) - Last season kind of sucked but still a very funny show
Homeland (Showtime) - Great show, watch it
Girls (HBO) - This show was a big surprise, very enjoyable
Breaking Bad (AMC) - Best show on TV
American Horror Story (FX) - Really enjoy it


I don't really watch a whole lot of scheduled TV, more of a casual viewer, but when I get a box set of a TV series I will fly through it pretty quick.

Strike Back (Cinemax) - Do not have Cinemax
Once Upon a Time (ABC) - Watched the pilot; No further interest
Revenge (ABC) - May give it a look someday, but doubtful
The Good Wife (CBS) - No interest
2 Broke Girls (CBS) - Watch it, but will likely dump it this Fall
Castle (ABC) - May give it a look someday, but doubtful
Happy Endings (ABC) - Watch it, Love it
New Girl (FOX) - Watch it, Starting to love it
Parenthood (NBC) - Watch it, Love it
Modern Family (ABC) - Watch it, Falling out of love with it
Glee (FOX) - Watched the pilot; No further interest
Suburgatory (ABC) - Watch it, Like it
Person of Interest (CBS) - May give it a look someday, but doubtful
The Vampire Diaries (CW) - No interest
Parks and Recreation (NBC) - Watch it, Love it
30 Rock (NBC) - Watch it, will continue to the end
The Office (NBC) - Watch it, will continue to the end
Fringe (FOX) - May give it a look someday, but doubtful
Community (NBC) - Watch it, Love it
Grimm (NBC) - Watched the pilot; May give the rest a look someday, but doubtful
Nikita (CW) - Ditched after the first few episodes
Homeland (Showtime) - Do not have Showtime, but I would like to see this
Game of Thrones (HBO) - Do not have HBO
Girls (HBO) - Do not have HBO, but I would like to try this out
Dexter (Showtime) - Do not have Showtime, but catch up with Dexter during Free Preview weekends
Episodes (Showtime) - Loved the first season, but no Showtime this season
Spartacus (Starz) - Ditched after the pilot, no further interest
Justified (FX) - Dropped out mid-season this past season; Too much TV
Sons of Anarchy (FX) - Gave it a shot during the first season, but ditched
Covert Affairs (USA) - No interest
White Collar (USA) - Gave it a few seasons, but dumped it
Burn Notice (USA) - No interest
Suits (USA) - No interest
Boardwalk Empire (HBO) - Do not have HBO, but I would like to check this out
The Newsroom (HBO) - Do not have HBO, but I will defintely check this out
Veep (HBO) - Do not have HBO, but I will check this out
The Walking Dead (AMC) - Watch it, but I may jump ship soon
Breaking Bad (AMC) - Life is preventing me from giving this show the time it probably deserves, so this is on the backburner until I can properly devote time to it
American Horror Story (FX) - Really liked the first season, haven't decided whether or not to watch the second
Hawaii Five-O (CBS) - Gave it about a half season, but bailed
Louie (FX) - Watch it, Love it
Boss (Starz) - Do not have Starz, but I would give this a shot
NCIS (CBS) - No interest
Mad Men (AMC) - Like Breaking Bad, I do not have the proper time to devote jumping into this show yet... Someday...
Pretty Little Liars (ABC Family) - No interest

Strike Back (Cinemax) - don't get the channel
Once Upon a Time (ABC) - not interested
Revenge (ABC) - watch it
The Good Wife (CBS) - watch it
2 Broke Girls (CBS) - watched half the 1st season, then dropped it.
Castle (ABC) - watch it
Happy Endings (ABC) - haven't watched it
New Girl (FOX) - don't like it
Parenthood (NBC) - watch it
Modern Family (ABC) - don't like it
Glee (FOX) - don't like it
Suburgatory (ABC) - watch it
Person of Interest (CBS) - watch it
The Vampire Diaries (CW) - watch it
Parks and Recreation (NBC) - watch it
30 Rock (NBC) - watch it occasionally
The Office (NBC) - watched from the beginning, gave up midway last season, don't care anymore
Fringe (FOX) - caught bits of season one, gave up on it
Community (NBC) - watch it
Grimm (NBC) - watch it
Nikita (CW) - going to try it
Homeland (Showtime) - eventually
Game of Thrones (HBO) - not interested, tried to read the first book
Girls (HBO) - not interested
Dexter (Showtime) - watched the pilot
Episodes (Showtime) - not interested
Spartacus (Starz) - not interested
Justified (FX) - watch it
Sons of Anarchy (FX) - watch it, haven't liked it as much since season 3
Covert Affairs (USA) - watch it
White Collar (USA) - watch it
Burn Notice (USA) - watch it
Suits (USA) - watch it
Boardwalk Empire (HBO) - maybe eventually
The Newsroom (HBO) - tried the pilot, didn't like it
Veep (HBO) - not interested
The Walking Dead (AMC) - might try season 3
Breaking Bad (AMC) - watched some
American Horror Story (FX) - not interested
Hawaii Five-O (CBS) - always have a Monday night conflict, so never watched it
Louie (FX) - not interested
Boss (Starz) - not interested
NCIS (CBS) - watch it
Mad Men (AMC) - watch occasionally
Pretty Little Liars (ABC Family) - not interested

So judging by alot of the responses in my thread, it seems that the vast majority of this forum are only casual TV viewers and don't really keep up with it weekly. Especially seeing how many really popular shows alot of you say you have never heard of.

Since I've posted in this thread enough I figured I'd contribute:

Strike Back (Cinemax) Don't subscribe
Once Upon a Time (ABC) Tried it, disliked it after 3 episodes
Revenge (ABC) Didn't look interesting
The Good Wife (CBS) Didn't look interesting
2 Broke Girls (CBS) Tried it for about 6 episodes and the laugh track drove me away
Castle (ABC) Love it!
Happy Endings (ABC) Watch it on DVR, just an OK show
New Girl (FOX) Kids love it but I could never get into it
Parenthood (NBC) No time to watch it, didn't excite me enough in previews
Modern Family (ABC) Love it!
Glee (FOX) Kids watch it… the music is OK but the stories and character grate
Suburgatory (ABC) Didn't look interesting
Person of Interest (CBS) Love it! It took a few episodes but it became a must watch.
The Vampire Diaries (CW) Didn't look interesting
Parks and Recreation (NBC) Love it!
30 Rock (NBC) Great show.
The Office (NBC) I watch it but more because it's been a habit for so long
Fringe (FOX) I wish I had started watching if from the beginning. Plan to start it on DVD
Community (NBC) Love it!
Grimm (NBC) Good show. It started pretty bad and I almost gave up. Now glad I didn't
Nikita (CW) I found out about this show too late to start. Too much else on to take the time
Homeland (Showtime) Don't subscribe
Game of Thrones (HBO) Love it!
Girls (HBO) Didn't look interesting
Dexter (Showtime) I watch it (even bought the first few seasons) now more out of habit.
Episodes (Showtime) Don't subscribe
Spartacus (Starz) Saw part of the 1st season on Netflix, keep meaning to go back to it
Justified (FX) I tried. I should have loved it. It didn't grab me and I gave up after 4 episodes.
Sons of Anarchy (FX) I watch it out of habit now, hopefully this next season delivers
Covert Affairs (USA) never heard of it
White Collar (USA) never heard of it
Burn Notice (USA) Watched the first season for Bruce. Couldn't get me back though
Suits (USA) Didn't look interesting
Boardwalk Empire (HBO) Great show
The Newsroom (HBO) Didn't look interesting
Veep (HBO) looked like it sucked terribly
The Walking Dead (AMC) Good show. Waiting for it to get great. HUGE zombie fan
Breaking Bad (AMC) Love it!
American Horror Story (FX) Couldn't make it through to the end
Hawaii Five-O (CBS) Didn't look interesting
Louie (FX) Love it!
Boss (Starz) Never heard of it
NCIS (CBS) Didn't look interesting
Mad Men (AMC) Great show
Pretty Little Liars (ABC Family) Daughter watches it, Didn't look interesting

I watch way more tv than I should, but there were some in there that missed me entirely.

So, if I was going to give either Strike Back or Homeland a shot, which would you suggest?

Pretty Little Liars does seem to be aimed at a younger audience. The serial drama part is really not that intriguing, but is worth watching. Switched at Birth and Bunheads (which I've only watched 3 ep) seem pretty good. But all of these have a younger feeling theme, which is not necessarily bad.

Again, I don't think these observations about CW shows being aimed at a younger audience are unwarranted. I have stopped watching most CW shows except Gossip Girl. I think the conflicts last year for Vampire Diaries and Nikita killed the shows for me. Most of the new shows in the last year (except for the witch show??),I haven't even tried.

If I had to drop some shows though CW and ABC Family shows would be among the first to go.

Then how is their "popularity" being measured? Or are they popular only if you are an advertiser?

I would consider myself more than a casual viewer but shows I like seem to get cancelled. In additon I enjoy watching programming not listed here like things on the History Channel, the Discovery Channel or CNBC original series programming.

I hate, simply HATE the History Channel. They turned an informative channel with series and specials that informed the viewer in a unique way to ... a bunch of reality shows about men driving trucks, cutting logs, treading swamps and finding "treasures" while roaming the American heartland (could anyone really make money that way without being subsidized by A&E). Pawns Stars is OK, but the Old Man and Chumlee are a bunch of jerks. I rarely even watch anything on "History" and don't even bother checking the listings anymore.

Don't get me started.

Sorry, those are not the shows I was referring to, I like to watch shows with actual history, not faux reality. I realize there are not many but I find them better than the network fodder on this list.

I usually DVR them, there are some shows on about Apollo 11, Modern Marvels is good, Ancient Discoveries and Mystery Quest

Watch History International, or whatever it is called now. Better than regular History

Like I wanna watch some commie European's version of history

I have seen Walking Dead. I'm not making crap up and only did research to make sure I spelled the names properly.

You don't. By your own admission you don't.

Everything you mentioned (in spoilers, thank you) happens or is revealed in later books, not in the first two seasons. There is no telling that the show will follow that. You obviously looked it up online somewhere. Earlier you mentioned you had only watched clips. I still contend that none of the acts you mentioned was truly evil (not in the context of the books and world), nor takes away from the good he has done.

I hate to argue but I can't stand someone making uninformed statements. I watch and read a lot of fantasy and GoT is unlike anything on screen, and rare even in books. It is a gripping character driven political thriller, regardless of world it is set in.

As far as The Walking Dead, there are a lot of faults with it but you listed only that it violated "the zombie rules" and mentioned a few. As far as I can tell the only thing the Walking Dead does perfectly is stick to the Romero rules of Zombies. Which rules are you referring to?

The programs that I have mentioned in this thread are popular in the sense that they are covered in entertainment publications like Entertainment Weekly or TV Guide, gotten acknowledgment by TV critics (especially Homeland on Showtime) or have done well in the Nielsen ratings.