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Ticketmaster--where's the outrage?

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Ticketmaster--where's the outrage?

Old 12-26-22, 01:56 PM
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Re: Ticketmaster--where's the outrage?

This is just a fabulous article from The Ringer, both about the Ticketmaster outrage, the Taylor fiasco, and as a larger picture of the music industry as a whole. Itís long, but worth the read.

Is Live Music Broken? Itís Not Just Ticketmaster, Itís Everything.

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Old 12-26-22, 04:36 PM
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Re: Ticketmaster--where's the outrage?

All irrelevant. People get upset when they don't score tickets. Not this, that, or the other. Figure out how to sell 3 million tickets for 1 million seats and problem solved. Until then people are going to have a grievance.
Old 12-26-22, 06:12 PM
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Re: Ticketmaster--where's the outrage?

Originally Posted by rw2516
All irrelevant. People get upset when they don't score tickets. Not this, that, or the other. Figure out how to sell 3 million tickets for 1 million seats and problem solved. Until then people are going to have a grievance.
Did you read the article? They address that point specifically
Ticketmaster, which did not respond to a request for comment for this article, has provided a pretty straightforward defense of what went wrong. In a blog post that was temporarily deleted (and later edited and reposted) after Swifties swarmed it, the company said it believed that limiting the presale to “Verified Fans,” who had to receive a code ahead of time, would contain the demand to a reasonable amount. Instead, the post said, “the staggering number of bot attacks as well as fans who didn’t have invite codes drove unprecedented traffic on our site, resulting in 3.5 billion total system requests—4x our previous peak.” At an event that week, Live Nation CEO Michael Rapino said, “We invited a million and a half on that day to come and buy those tickets, but it’s kind of like having a party. Everybody crashed that door at the same time with 3.5 billion requests.”

There is some legitimacy to the notion that any ticketing agency would have faced immense struggle in attempting to navigate the mind-boggling level of fame and popularity that Taylor Swift now has. (Her new album, Midnights, broke the record for largest overall week for any album; it took just four days for her to break the previous record, which was held by … her, for her 2017 album Reputation.) Dean Budnick, the Ticket Masters author, pointed out that Ticketmaster would have likely fared better if it had staggered the presale dates, instead of attempting to handle them all at once. Still, in a larger sense, the demand was unparalleled. “I’m not here to altogether defend Ticketmaster, I want to be clear,” Budnick said. “Get me going on service fees and you got me. But when it comes to this? I don’t know what they realistically could have done.”
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Old 12-29-22, 09:42 AM
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Re: Ticketmaster--where's the outrage?

Dean Budnick, the Ticket Masters author, pointed out that Ticketmaster would have likely fared better if it had staggered the presale dates, instead of attempting to handle them all at once.
the man is a genius. Seriously have to wonder WTF they were thinking doing all dates and venues on one day and not going with at least an east coast, middle states and west coast schema. Just a stupid move.
Old 12-29-22, 11:14 AM
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Re: Ticketmaster--where's the outrage?

As I said, the best thing they could have done is gate-kept the online lobby to only those who had a valid pre-sale code. The fact that anybody or any Bot could wait in the lobby totally overwhelmed the system. If that lobby was limited to the million people who had a valid pre-sale code would have kept the system from crashing.
I am still amazed that I got phenomenal seats for the Vegas show within ten minutes of them going on sale for PSL owners. It was exactly the same time as the Capitol One sale, but maybe because I had a different link, I got very lucky
Old 12-29-22, 04:30 PM
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Re: Ticketmaster--where's the outrage?

What is the origin of the outrage? "I didn't get tickets". How much outrage is coming from people who got tickets but are furious over the price, service fee, system failures? Are people who got tickets suing?
I'm sorry, but in the Taylor Swift case, it comes off as more of an entitlement issue. People need to learn you don't get everything you want in life.
Old 12-29-22, 04:39 PM
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Re: Ticketmaster--where's the outrage?

Originally Posted by rw2516
What is the origin of the outrage? "I didn't get tickets". How much outrage is coming from people who got tickets but are furious over the price, service fee, system failures? Are people who got tickets suing?
I'm sorry, but in the Taylor Swift case, it comes off as more of an entitlement issue. People need to learn you don't get everything you want in life.
I think you need to look at it separately. For those who just wanted to buy tickets but didn't get a pre-sale code, then sure. Those who were lucky enough to get a pre-sale code should have been able to buy a ticket. Ticketmaster knew exactly how many tickets were available for pre-sale and determined how many Fan Verified codes would be issued. There's no reason to send out several times the number of codes than tickets available, because even if many who got the codes decided not to use them (extremely unlikely), they could still sell those tickets at the Capitol One or later the General ticket sale (which as it turned out never even happened).
If they had limited the number of Fan Verified pre-sale codes to a reasonable number, and more importantly, if they made it so that only those with valid pre-sale codes could enter the waiting room, things would have gone a lot smoother and those with the codes would have had a fair chance to buy the tickets.
I know a lot about this because my daughter got a pre-order code, entered the lobby and waited five hours to get a chance to buy tickets. She ended up with very expensive VIP package seats, but we did get something at least.

One follow up note : There were apparently some unsold seats still after they cancelled the General sale. Those tickets were made available to certain people who were gifted pre-sale codes and couldn't get tickets. I think that was the only fair solution and I'm glad a few more fans got to buy tickets.
Old 12-29-22, 05:15 PM
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Re: Ticketmaster--where's the outrage?

Was it communicated by Swift or Ticketmaster that receiving a code would guarantee you tickets? I was under the impression it moved you up in line but still didn't guarantee you tickets. With a six ticket limit they would have had to limit codes to 333,000.
How fast were the pre codes gobbled up? If the number of precodes had been reasonably limited, and were gone real fast, wouldn't we still be where we are now with people upset about not getting a code?

I want to be fair here. But when I see videos of people crying over not getting tickets, like Ticketmaster killed their dog, I get the impression that there is absolutely nothing that would satisfy these people, outside of getting a ticket. No system would have been fair enough.

Last edited by rw2516; 12-29-22 at 05:20 PM.
Old 12-29-22, 06:02 PM
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Re: Ticketmaster--where's the outrage?

Originally Posted by rw2516
Was it communicated by Swift or Ticketmaster that receiving a code would guarantee you tickets? I was under the impression it moved you up in line but still didn't guarantee you tickets. With a six ticket limit they would have had to limit codes to 333,000.
How fast were the pre codes gobbled up? If the number of precodes had been reasonably limited, and were gone real fast, wouldn't we still be where we are now with people upset about not getting a code?
The pre-sale codes weren't "gobbled up", they were sent to a select few of the millions who registered for a chance to get one. I talked to a bunch of people who signed up for a chance to get one. None of us did, besides my daughter (whose chances got "boosted" because she bought an album through Taylor's merch store).
No there wasn't a guaranty that the code would get you tickets, but it's a limited code with access to pre-sale. So it wasn't unreasonable to expect to be able to get a shot at tickets, considering how relatively few were sent out (at least compared to the number of applecants)

Per Ticketmaster's post :

TICKETS TO TAYLORíS TOUR

  • By requiring registrations, Verified Fan is designed to help manage high demand shows Ė identifying real humans and weeding out bots. Keeping bots out of queues and avoiding overcrowding helps to make wait times shorter and onsales smoother.
  • Based on fan interest at registration we knew this would be big. Over 3.5 million people pre-registered for TaylorSwiftTix Presale powered by Verified Fan, which is the largest registration in history.
  • Historically, around 40% of invited fans actually show up and buy tickets, and most purchase an average of 3 tickets. Around 1.5 million people were sent codes to join the onsale for all 52 show dates, including the 47 sold by Ticketmaster.
  • The remaining 2 million Verified Fans were placed on a waiting list on the small chance that tickets might still be available after those who received codes had shopped.
Old 01-24-23, 10:27 AM
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Re: Ticketmaster--where's the outrage?

Ticketmaster hearing kicked off about 20 minutes ago:
Live updates: Ticketing industry testifies after Ticketmaster's Taylor Swift concert debacle (cnn.com)
Old 01-24-23, 05:55 PM
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Re: Ticketmaster--where's the outrage?

Read some recaps of the hearing today. It's hilarious to me that Live Nation basically says there is nothing they can do about bots and scalpers. I think anyone with an ounce of tech savvy could come up with some ideas. And they also say that ticketing is super competitive right now, which I can't believe is something Live Nation actually said on the record.
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Old 01-24-23, 06:10 PM
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Re: Ticketmaster--where's the outrage?

I saw a compilation of Senators doing Taylor Swift lyric-based puns. It was painful
Old 01-24-23, 07:27 PM
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Re: Ticketmaster--where's the outrage?

It was a crooked industry for decades...and it's still a crooked industry.
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Old 01-25-23, 03:13 PM
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Re: Ticketmaster--where's the outrage?

Originally Posted by Decker
I saw a compilation of Senators doing Taylor Swift lyric-based puns. It was painful
Yeah - that showed me the politicians really don't give a shit. They're just paying lip service to their constituents while continuing to take payoff money and laughing.
Old 01-27-23, 12:17 PM
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Re: Ticketmaster--where's the outrage?

While TM certainly sucks as is a near-monopoly, the issue isn't just them, you know - it's the whole system that is rotten, right down to many of the performers and their agents and promoters.
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Old 01-31-23, 12:09 PM
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Re: Ticketmaster--where's the outrage?

This is something I've not seen before, sounds like maybe trying to help with the scalping. This is the note on on the ticket ordering page for a Robert Plant and Alison Krauss show around here:

**This tour is mobile only and will have a ticket delivery and transfer delay until 3 days prior to the show date. Box office will not be selling tickets until the day of show.**.
Old 01-31-23, 12:13 PM
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Re: Ticketmaster--where's the outrage?

I've bought a few tickets from shows like that on the secondary market. It's super nerve-wracking because you don't get your tickets transferred to you until the day of the show, and that's if the guy you bought the tickets from remembers to transfer them. It made our Harry Styles concert experience a total nightmare, as I discussed in this thread I made.
Old 01-31-23, 12:45 PM
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Re: Ticketmaster--where's the outrage?

Originally Posted by The Cow
This is something I've not seen before, sounds like maybe trying to help with the scalping. This is the note on on the ticket ordering page for a Robert Plant and Alison Krauss show around here:

**This tour is mobile only and will have a ticket delivery and transfer delay until 3 days prior to the show date. Box office will not be selling tickets until the day of show.**.
It's a fairly common practice for some big events and markets... even before mobile ticketing. They had been doing with the Print At Home pdfs.
Old 01-31-23, 03:41 PM
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Re: Ticketmaster--where's the outrage?

The last few tickets I've purchased have said "You have the tickets! We'll send them to you two weeks before the event.". A little unnerving.
My biggest thing is letting scalpers buy tickets, and the dynamic or "platinum" pricing where TM scalps their own tickets.
I do like how TM lets you sell tickets through their website (sometimes). I had to resell tix last year when my wife had to travel for work and missed the show. I much preferred selling them to dealing with insurance. (I broke even money wise, no scalping).
Old 01-31-23, 04:43 PM
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Re: Ticketmaster--where's the outrage?

Did scalping laws go away with printed tickets. I can remember it being illegal to sell a ticket for more than the price printed on them. Classifieds in newspaper had a ticket section. There were all these ads taking advantage of loophole in law:

FOR SALE. Bruce Springsteen Born in U.S.A. CD. $800. Includes two free concert tickets.
Old 01-31-23, 08:24 PM
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Re: Ticketmaster--where's the outrage?

If people just stopped paying the ridiculous price for tickets, then they wouldn't be charging as much.
This is tickets to a concert - it isn't a necessity - it's not a life-saving operation.

If you don't mind paying the exorbitant price, then more power to you. If you don't want to spend that much money - then don't.
Old 02-02-23, 05:15 AM
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Re: Ticketmaster--where's the outrage?

Beyoncť is going on tour. Will Ticketmaster be able to handle it?
Old 02-06-23, 11:27 AM
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Re: Ticketmaster--where's the outrage?

Originally Posted by rw2516
Did scalping laws go away with printed tickets. I can remember it being illegal to sell a ticket for more than the price printed on them. Classifieds in newspaper had a ticket section. There were all these ads taking advantage of loophole in law:

FOR SALE. Bruce Springsteen Born in U.S.A. CD. $800. Includes two free concert tickets.
Pretty much. Most of the scalping laws were for in person transactions, so with the advent of the internet they became obsolete. I also assume there was a good amount of lobbying by ebay in the late 90s/early 2000s to either undo the prior laws, or make sure the new ones didn't apply to online sales. Add in how complex it is to enforce state laws when you have a seller who is likely out of state, and a buyer who may or may not reside in the state.
Old 02-06-23, 11:38 AM
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Re: Ticketmaster--where's the outrage?

Agreed. Without buyers, there'd be no sellers.
It's easier now in many ways now by selling on the official websites or reselling sites.
Of course, not two days after my last post, I bought tickets from a "Verified Reseller" on Ticketmaster. Not scalping because they were the exact same price as the same ticket purchased directly from TM, so I'm OK with that. Probably some couple whose plans changed and wanted to recoup most of the ticket price (which is fine and like I said, I have done.)
There was another showing of the same event where 12 seats near the front row of one section are all for sale by a reseller. At 170% of the regular ticket price. They've sold two of them and have 12 days left to sell the rest. I hope they get stuck with them or at least lower the price to a reasonable amount.

I still, at some events, see the occasional person walking around outside offering to buy or sell tickets from people going into the venue. Not sure how that works nowadays.
Old 02-06-23, 11:45 AM
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Re: Ticketmaster--where's the outrage?

Originally Posted by tonyc3742
There was another showing of the same event where 12 seats near the front row of one section are all for sale by a reseller. At 170% of the regular ticket price. They've sold two of them and have 12 days left to sell the rest. I hope they get stuck with them or at least lower the price to a reasonable amount.
That's probably the band selling them.

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