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The Fantastic Four (2025, D: Shakman) S: Pascal, Kirby, Moss-Bachrach, Quinn

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The Fantastic Four (2025, D: Shakman) S: Pascal, Kirby, Moss-Bachrach, Quinn

Old 11-16-23, 06:55 AM
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re: The Fantastic Four (2025, D: Shakman) S: Pascal, Kirby, Moss-Bachrach, Quinn

Today, it was finally reported that Pedro Pascal is going to play Mister Fantastic, which is one of the things I was holding. One of the reasons I was asked not to say anything is because Pascal’s schedule is… pretty packed!He’ll soon resume shooting Ridley Scott’s Gladiator sequel overseas, and he’s also due to shoot Season 2 of HBO’s The Last of Us and Zach Cregger’s epic thriller Weapons in 2024. So, it was unclear whether Pascal’s schedule would allow for a major Marvel shoot early next year, but apparently, the two recently concluded strikes have created a window in his schedule, which is being figured out this week prior to the holiday break.

With all of these release date changes and production shifts, and surely more to come — for example, will Destin Daniel Cretton’s exit from Avengers: The Kang Dynasty have a domino effect on the MCU calendar? — the schedules of in-demand actors like Pascal have become pure anarchy.

Nonetheless, I’m told there’s already Fantastic Four concept art featuring Pascal’s handsome face.

With Vanessa Kirby widely tipped to be Sue Storm (aka the Invisible Woman), who is said to be the clear lead of the film, and Joseph Quinn and Ebon Moss-Bachrach poised to play Johnny Storm (aka the Human Torch) and Ben Grimm (aka the Thing), respectively, the feeling at Marvel was that they needed a big star for Mister Fantastic.

And now, here’s the inside story of the Mister Fantastic search.

Just prior to the SAG-AFTRA strike, Marvel conducted secret screen tests for Reed Richards, just like James Gunn was doing for Superman: Legacy — rushing to get them done in time. A group of actors flew to London, including Christopher Abbott and Jamie Dornan, and I’m told the tests did not go very well.

It quickly became apparent to Marvel that they needed a bigger name. Just before the strike took effect, they went out to Jake Gyllenhaal, but he wanted too much money (as did Adam Driver early on, if I’m not mistaken). Budget has been a real issue for this Fantastic Four movie, which is why Emma Stone isn’t playing Sue Storm. She’s too expensive and Marvel’s Kevin Feige is trying to contain talent costs.

With Kirby, Quinn, and Moss-Bachrach lined up for the other three leads, Feige foresaw another issue with Gyllenhaal besides the actor’s fee.

I’m told he feared that the cast was “way too white,” in the words of one insider. Reed Richards would be the character eyed to diversify the cast.

It didn’t hurt that Pascal, who is Chilean, is hotter than both Gyllenhaal and Driver at the moment; he’s the internet’s new boyfriend who can do no wrong. So while Pascal refused to engage during the strike, his team acknowledged they would be interested in talking once it ended.

Though there was some initial concern that Pascal’s age might be an issue going forward (he’s 48 years old), neither he nor Moss-Bachrach (46) look their age. The feeling internally was that Mister Fantastic was a tricky role to cast — not just because of the demand for multiple movies, but also because Sue is the quote-unquote lead of this first film. Feige felt Pascal was a get, and it wouldn’t shock me if the studio made some accommodations for his schedule.

It stands to reason that Pascal’s participation in the MCU — and the global marketing campaign that comes with it — would only stand to benefit these other projects, such as The Last of Us and Weapons, so perhaps they’ll make accommodations of their own.

Pedro, it seems, is worth waiting for.

And now for the other name to simply keep an eye on as far as Fantastic Four goes. Last week, I was told by the same source who told me about Pedro that Oscar winner Javier Bardem is being eyed to play Galactus.

One insider I spoke to said that Bardem had a scheduling conflict, which appears to be Apple’s F1 movie starring Brad Pitt, a film I’ll write more about tomorrow. The question is whether that F1 movie will truly preclude Bardem from performing what is largely a voice role a la Josh Brolin’s Thanos, though I imagine there will be some motion-capture element involved that may require whoever plays Galactus to be on set.

I know that Antonio Banderas had previously been tipped for the role of Galactus, and perhaps it will come back to him, but for now, I believe Bardem is the frontrunner, schedule permitting… which it may not! The strike just ended, and that F1 movie is expected to be a long shoot, so we’ll see… but Marvel has a history of getting its man, with a few exceptions here and there. Then again, neither Emily Blunt nor Joaquin Phoenix starred in Lyle Lyle Crocodile last year.

Of course, Bardem would, by then, be coming off of Dune: Part II and that aforementioned F1 racing movie, plus he already has a relationship with Disney after playing King Triton in the studio’s live-action remake of The Little Mermaid.

If Galactus doesn’t turn out to be Javier Bardem, so be it. All I’m saying right now is that he is Marvel’s top target — and why wouldn’t he be? From No Country for Old Men to Skyfall, he makes for a hell of a villain. And yes, you can expect to see a female Silver Surfer, as I noted on last week’s Hot Mic podcast, which you can catch live on YouTube every Thursday, and everywhere podcasts are found these days.

Stay tuned for more on the Fantastic Four front…
https://www.theinsneider.com/p/fanta...-best-director
Old 11-16-23, 08:09 AM
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Re: Marvelís Fantastic Four (2025, D: Shakman) - news, rumors, etc.

Originally Posted by dex14
"Iím told he feared that the cast was ďway too white,Ē in the words of one insider. Reed Richards would be the character eyed to diversify the cast."
https://www.theinsneider.com/p/fanta...-best-director
At least they have their priorities straight when it comes to casting decisions.
Old 11-16-23, 08:22 AM
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Re: Marvelís Fantastic Four (2025, D: Shakman) - news, rumors, etc.

Originally Posted by HeIsTheZissou
So it's Wakanda for mutants and the MCU would already be repeating storylines.
I mean I know it's swept under the rug and not really a part of the MCU but they also did this with Agents of SHIELD and Inhumans.

I think there's a feasible explanation for why the FF would be considered heroes and not mutants, but you'd have to lean really heavily into the freakish aspect of most mutants, the real world bias we have for attractive people and ethnicities, have Reed's inventions be a great benefit to the world and most importantly the concept of mutants as a separate species threatening to take over homo sapien. In that aspect, the FF and even the superpowered Avengers or Asgardians are finite in number, but for sure Fox News and the like would be talking endlessly about being replaced/having your jobs stolen by mutants (who could even be your neighbor)
Old 11-16-23, 08:50 AM
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re: The Fantastic Four (2025, D: Shakman) S: Pascal, Kirby, Moss-Bachrach, Quinn

Just because the actors don't look their age now.. doesn't mean that will be the case down the road. Hiddleston has been Loki for 14 years, but he was cast when he was 29. Just saying.
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Old 11-16-23, 11:11 AM
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Re: Marvelís Fantastic Four (2025, D: Shakman) - news, rumors, etc.

Originally Posted by devilshalo
Just because the actors don't look their age now.. doesn't mean that will be the case down the road. Hiddleston has been Loki for 14 years, but he was cast when he was 29. Just saying.
And also them saying Pedro Pascal doesn't look his age is weird because he definitely looks late 40's / early 50's to me even with him being a handsome guy.
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Old 11-16-23, 11:19 AM
  #156  
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re: The Fantastic Four (2025, D: Shakman) S: Pascal, Kirby, Moss-Bachrach, Quinn

I don't really see PP as the "dad" type that Reed Richards needs. He's comes off more like a pirate or soldier than the Ward Cleaver type.

I'm also not sure about the accent; he speaks with a really thick accent that doesn't quite seem right for Reed Richards. But then, I think he hides it well in The Mandalorian, and, thinking of that series, the voice for that character seems like it would be a good fit for Reed. Can't remember what he sounded like in The Last of Us, but that's the kind of part where it doesn't really matter.

I also think his age could be a problem. If he's 48 now, he'll probably be committed to this part for fifteen years. Especially the way Marvel is slow-walking things right now and pushing everything back. I have a feeling that the next couple of phases are going to be seeing a lot of delays in production while they retool the macro-story and individual films.
Old 11-16-23, 12:22 PM
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re: The Fantastic Four (2025, D: Shakman) S: Pascal, Kirby, Moss-Bachrach, Quinn

Reed Richards is one of the few characters in (superhero) comics who was actually able to age (white hair and all) and have kids, though.
Old 11-16-23, 01:52 PM
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re: The Fantastic Four (2025, D: Shakman) S: Pascal, Kirby, Moss-Bachrach, Quinn

He was probably around 40 when the comic started (it came out in 1961, and Reed and Ben served in WWII) and already had gray temples.

Not sure how old he's currently supposed to be, but I would assume that, like most of the other Marvel characters, he's stuck at a perpetual age.

I think with Marvel Comics, the general rule is that Fantastic Four #1 happened seven years ago no matter who long ago it was in the real world, and historical details get fudged along the way. (Presumably, in the current comics, I would guess that Reed and Ben served in the Iraq or Afghanistan wars instead of WWII if they ever mention that part of their history.)

I think it would probably be better to cast someone who's about thirty-five to play Reed; maybe thirty for Sue and Johnny. The Thing will be CGI, so the age of the actor doesn't matter as much, but they'd probably want someone with a gravely voice.
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Old 11-16-23, 02:26 PM
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re: The Fantastic Four (2025, D: Shakman) S: Pascal, Kirby, Moss-Bachrach, Quinn

I mean how old are Franklin and Valeria though?

You're right he's supposed to be around 40 though the "official" explanation for his grey temples is something else entirely:
https://www.cbr.com/fantastic-four-r...-grey-temples/
Old 11-16-23, 04:14 PM
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re: The Fantastic Four (2025, D: Shakman) S: Pascal, Kirby, Moss-Bachrach, Quinn

I think Franklin Richards spent most the 1970s, 1980s, and 1990s being about four years old.

I don't keep up with the comics, but at some point he was rapid-aged into a teenager or young adult I think.

Not sure what Valeria Richards' deal is; I stopped following Marvel comics by the time she came into the picture.

Marvel generally tries to keep the ages of their characters ambiguous. The teenagers like Peter Parker and the original X-Men were allowed to age into twenty-something young adults. Not sure about Kitty Pryde, it seems like various writers would age her up only for her to go back to being fourteen or fifteen without explanation. Poor Kitty Pryde, forever jailbait.
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Old 11-16-23, 04:30 PM
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Re: Marvelís Fantastic Four (2025, D: Shakman) - news, rumors, etc.

Originally Posted by Josh-da-man
I think Franklin Richards spent most the 1970s, 1980s, and 1990s being about four years old.

I don't keep up with the comics, but at some point he was rapid-aged into a teenager or young adult I think.

Not sure what Valeria Richards' deal is; I stopped following Marvel comics by the time she came into the picture.

Marvel generally tries to keep the ages of their characters ambiguous. The teenagers like Peter Parker and the original X-Men were allowed to age into twenty-something young adults. Not sure about Kitty Pryde, it seems like various writers would age her up only for her to go back to being fourteen or fifteen without explanation. Poor Kitty Pryde, forever jailbait.
I think Excalibur is when they allowed Kitty to not be the teenaged sidekick (replaced by Jubilee) and grow into her own, so she has to be early 20s (even though the rest of them didn't age). Like I doubt she was 16 when she almost married Colossus a few years ago.
Old 11-16-23, 04:56 PM
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Re: Marvelís Fantastic Four (2025, D: Shakman) - news, rumors, etc.

Originally Posted by Josh-da-man
I think Franklin Richards spent most the 1970s, 1980s, and 1990s being about four years old.
Yeah, by the time I stopped reading the FF (1990?) he was still a little kid.
Old 11-16-23, 10:31 PM
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Re: Marvelís Fantastic Four (2025, D: Shakman) - news, rumors, etc.

Originally Posted by fujishig
I think Excalibur is when they allowed Kitty to not be the teenaged sidekick (replaced by Jubilee) and grow into her own, so she has to be early 20s (even though the rest of them didn't age). Like I doubt she was 16 when she almost married Colossus a few years ago.
Technically, her age up is in X-Men 141, right?
Old 11-16-23, 11:03 PM
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re: The Fantastic Four (2025, D: Shakman) S: Pascal, Kirby, Moss-Bachrach, Quinn

Matt Shakman also directed the first 2 episodes of Monarch Legacy for ATV+.
Old 11-16-23, 11:18 PM
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Re: Marvelís Fantastic Four (2025, D: Shakman) - news, rumors, etc.

Originally Posted by candyrocket786
At least they have their priorities straight when it comes to casting decisions.
I just find it annoying that people keep using Hispanic as a race. We are not a race. We are an ethnicity. You can have white Hispanics (like myself) and black Hispanics, as well as many combinations in between. Just casting a Hispanic doesn't diversify shit, if you're looking for "non-white cred".
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Old 11-17-23, 07:29 AM
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Re: Marvelís Fantastic Four (2025, D: Shakman) - news, rumors, etc.

🤣🤣🤣



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Old 11-17-23, 08:30 AM
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Re: Marvelís Fantastic Four (2025, D: Shakman) - news, rumors, etc.

Originally Posted by RocShemp
I just find it annoying that people keep using Hispanic as a race. We are not a race. We are an ethnicity. You can have white Hispanics (like myself) and black Hispanics, as well as many combinations in between. Just casting a Hispanic doesn't diversify shit, if you're looking for "non-white cred".
Both terms race and ethnicity are social constructions and they more or less have the meaning the society wants to apply to them at a certain moment in time and which can change, since language is always in development. In German the term "race" is replaced by ethnicity because the word for race and breed was the same and people are not German Shepherds or British Bulldogs. So Hispanic can be diverse, depending on the definition. In human anthropology "tribe" is outdated and replaced by nation or people although some of those nations would self describe as a tribe.
Old 11-17-23, 05:17 PM
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Re: Marvelís Fantastic Four (2025, D: Shakman) - news, rumors, etc.

Originally Posted by Runaway
Both terms race and ethnicity are social constructions and they more or less have the meaning the society wants to apply to them at a certain moment in time and which can change, since language is always in development. In German the term "race" is replaced by ethnicity because the word for race and breed was the same and people are not German Shepherds or British Bulldogs. So Hispanic can be diverse, depending on the definition. In human anthropology "tribe" is outdated and replaced by nation or people although some of those nations would self describe as a tribe.
And yet, in the context of this casting:
Iím told he feared that the cast was ďway too white,Ē in the words of one insider. Reed Richards would be the character eyed to diversify the cast.
So whatever way you want to define it, he's still clearly white. And if they were truly afraid the cast was ďway too white,Ē I find it hilarious that this is to be the team leader:


Don't get me wrong, Vanessa Kirby is a fantastic actress (and Pedro Pascal is great too). I just wish that casting could just be done in a "let the chips fall where they may" manner as far as race is concerned. Just hire whoever, without patting yourself on the back over how progressive you think you are.


​​​​​​​
Old 11-17-23, 06:00 PM
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Re: Marvelís Fantastic Four (2025, D: Shakman) - news, rumors, etc.

Originally Posted by RocShemp
And yet, in the context of this casting:


So whatever way you want to define it, he's still clearly white. And if they were truly afraid the cast was ďway too white,Ē I find it hilarious that this is to be the team leader:
Just for clarification, the article says she's the clear lead of the film, not that the character is the team's leader.
Old 11-17-23, 08:45 PM
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Re: Marvelís Fantastic Four (2025, D: Shakman) - news, rumors, etc.

Originally Posted by RocShemp
I just find it annoying that people keep using Hispanic as a race. We are not a race. We are an ethnicity. You can have white Hispanics (like myself) and black Hispanics, as well as many combinations in between. Just casting a Hispanic doesn't diversify shit, if you're looking for "non-white cred".
Its a lot better than that LatinX crap they thought was trendy. I hated that fucking label.
Old 11-17-23, 10:44 PM
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Re: Marvelís Fantastic Four (2025, D: Shakman) - news, rumors, etc.

Originally Posted by clckworang
Just for clarification, the article says she's the clear lead of the film, not that the character is the team's leader.
Fine, that still makes her the "face" of the movie.

In any case, this should be an ensemble (with the cast ideally listed in alphabetical order, to drive the point home). For all their faults, the Tim Story movies at least felt like a team effort (even if fans bemoaned Reed not truly taking charge in the first film, which was corrected in the second movie). Yes, Alba got the short end of the stick, but at least she wasn't treated like a token hottie (yes, she got nude gags, but so did Chris Evans).

​​​​​​​
Originally Posted by candyrocket786
Its a lot better than that LatinX crap they thought was trendy. I hated that fucking label.
Yeah, that was idiotic. But now they have LatinE, which sounds downright Canadian. So, progress?

Last edited by RocShemp; 11-17-23 at 10:52 PM.
Old 11-18-23, 08:13 AM
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Re: Marvelís Fantastic Four (2025, D: Shakman) - news, rumors, etc.

Originally Posted by clckworang
Just for clarification, the article says she's the clear lead of the film, not that the character is the team's leader.
Well, she is The Invisible Woman, so...
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Old 11-18-23, 09:39 AM
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Re: Marvelís Fantastic Four (2025, D: Shakman) - news, rumors, etc.

The more I think about it I really donít know if I like Pedro being cast as Reed. Itís nothing at all against him as an actor but he just doesnít feel quite right for the role.

It feels like one of those castings where the actor is hot at the moment so someone at Marvel was like: ďletís get him for somethingĒ. Just not sure if heís really the right fit though.

Last edited by Mike86; 11-18-23 at 10:55 AM.
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Old 11-18-23, 10:35 AM
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Re: Marvelís Fantastic Four (2025, D: Shakman) - news, rumors, etc.

Originally Posted by Josh-da-man
I also think his age could be a problem.
That's what stood out to me, there's a big difference between early 40's and late 40's. Just from a business pov, it's a risk. I don't personally mind it, but usually you don't see them go with the high end of an age range.
Old 11-18-23, 11:58 AM
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Re: Marvelís Fantastic Four (2025, D: Shakman) - news, rumors, etc.

Originally Posted by story
Well, she is The Invisible Woman, so...

Originally Posted by Artman
That's what stood out to me, there's a big difference between early 40's and late 40's. Just from a business pov, it's a risk. I don't personally mind it, but usually you don't see them go with the high end of an age range.
I had to Google RDJ's age when he did Iron Man. He was 43 years old, and your point is valid. But I wonder if the plan is to give Reed the same shelf life as Tony. Probably have him retire or die after a climactic showdown versus Doom and Galactus.

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