Trevor

I'll confess that I don't hate Resurrection much, and maybe even like it. It has a few awesome scenes (mainly with Douriff and Pearlman) and while the baby alien stuff is silly, I somehow tend to watch it as much as the other films.

PatD

I wouldn't mind Resurrection as a standalone space monster movie with a wacky tone. It came out the same year as The Fifth Element and these two films are soul siblings. I could dig it in that way.

But it's part of a series of films that up to that point had been deadly ernest in its tone. In A:R we have tracking shots going down a person's throat with an interior shot of the chestburster. We have Dan Hedaya doing his comic schtick including a Wile E. Coyote moment when a xenomorph shoots his piston tongue into the back of his skull and he pulls out a piece of his skull with his eyes crossed. (Wah wah!)

When people complain about Alien 3 wrecking the franchise, I just shake my head and point to the next installment.

Solid Snake

Just watched the AC.

I still like it more than the TC. The pace in the TC is phenomenal to me. It really flies by. That beats the AC hard and fast. Also as Rocshemp mentioned. The way Ripley goes in the TC is better. It's hokey in the AC.

I still prefer the Ox over the dog. The effect for the Xenomorph running away in that bit has aged well. I think I like Ripley coming up on the beach more too.

I think Rocshemp said it, someone did. It'd be a damn fine movie somewhere between the TC and the AC.

I prefer the AC cuz it's more atmospheric, more bodies that are recognized and fleshed out.

--------

this whole boldness thing. It's Alien 3. Alien sets it up and the whatnot but it essentially establishes and moves. Aliens continues the move. Then Alien 3 stops everything for something different and wild. Breaking down our hero's world, taking the audience away from action of Aliens, the location is depressing, and the locals are not people you like. Alien 3 had some balls on it.

Why So Blu?

If you watch the AR documentary Jeunet addresses the brain puncture and delayed reaction bit. He originally planned on removing Hedaya's reaction but test audiences loved it, so it got kept in.

Also, he mentions camera/shot set-ups and goes back to Alien and says that he Alien had like 700-900 camera set-ups. It was unreal and that he wanted to do something similar. That's what's cool about it - every shot in AR is designed in advance in terms of composition, zoom, perspective, etc.

Fuck, I may just watch it tonight.

Lt Ripley

Re-cast Call and it improves twofold already.

"They grew you in a fucking llyaaaaab."

Why So Blu?

"She's insanely fuckable."

Lt Ripley

I won't disagree with that.

RocShemp

Yeah, I'm gonna watch it right now.

Solid Snake

And those great Docs are all on Disc 5 too. FUCK I love this set.

PatD

Can you think of a better, more comprehensive Blu ray set for a movie series? I can't. (Disc six has the rarely seen "Burke Cocooned" scene from Aliens. They went all out.)

hanshotfirst1138

The character's only apparent defining trait.

Solid Snake

Say what you will about the color timing on some of these but as a package? It's literally the perfect set. The features are overwhelming to the point of bliss. You've 2 versions of every film. The technical work done on each film is top notch.

The quality of each film may vary, it does for me, but it's a set. Taking it as all that and then the films in it. A+.

Amazing set.

RocShemp

I just finished revisiting the TC of Alien: Resurrection. I forgot that whoever authored the disc made a minor editing fuckup by including an alternate scene in the theatrical cut (on the TC presented on the disc they put in the smiling version of the "I died" line that was in the trailer whereas the original theatrical cut featured a take where Sigourney Weaver delivers the line in a rather perturbed manner).

Anyhoo, overall, the movie is still a fun roller coaster ride. I still like the newborn since it's clear it's meant to be pitiable as well as creepy. Heck, Ripley even cries when she kills it because the thing isn't evil. It's just super confused and has extremely violent mood swings. Also, given what they mention of Ripley 8's memory gaps, you figure that at a subconscious level, Ripley 8 has some emotional memories of the real Ripley having been a mother.

There still are two moments that I found indefensible, even back when I saw the movie theatrically 17 years ago (I can't believe it's been that long). The first is Elgyn's death. It's just stupid how he wandered off on his own. I know that Joss Whedon claims that he tried to fix the scene by convincing the director to shoot some dialogue where Elgyn says he's going to look for guns. The problem is that such dialogue is not needed since the scene as is clearly convey's that's his intent. The problem is that he's already carrying two guns (and his crew is also well armed) and the rifle he sees is all the way down some dark hall. Even though they've yet to encounter the xenomorphs, at this point in the story all hell is breaking loose and they are making a run for the Betty. It makes no sense for him to go scouring for every gun he sees. It's just a stupid scene that doesn't work any way you look at it.

The other moment I hate is Christie's death. He has a xenomorph carcass clinging to his foot and the combined weight is too much for Vriess to hold on. All well and good but if Christie has enough strength to reach for a knife and saw through the straps holding him to Vriess, surely Christie has the strength to grab on to the railings, relieving the strain on Vriess, and then kick off the xenomorph carcass.

Why So Blu?

Oh, I forgot to mention: Kim Flowers. Smoking hot girl, with a nice ass. I think she only did a handful more films, if that, before she gave up acting.

Also, if you watch the AR documentary - she almost drowned in real life during her death scene.

RocShemp

"Nice" doesn't do that ass justice.

hanshotfirst1138

I've never quite figured out why someone at Fox thought that the screenwriter for Buffy The Vampire Slayer and the director of whimsical French art films were their choices for a new Alien movie. It's very odd for a mainstream movie.

Ringmaster

As far as Josh Whedon, his original script did not include Ripley at all. Some executive had the bright idea to have Whedon rewrite his scipt and clone Ripley to bring her back. Has anyone read that first draft without Ripley?

inri222

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alien:_Resurrection


Impressed with his work as a screenwriter, 20th Century Fox hired Joss Whedon to write the film's script. Whedon's initial screenplay had a third act on Earth, with a final battle for Earth itself. Whedon wrote five versions of the final act, none of which ended up in the film.

The studio initially imagined that the film would center around a clone of the character Newt from Aliens, as the Ellen Ripley character had died at the end of Alien 3. Whedon composed a thirty-page treatment surrounding this idea before being informed that the studio, though impressed with his script, now intended to base the story on a clone of Ripley, whom they saw as the anchor of the series. Whedon had to rewrite the script in a way that would bring back the Ripley character, a task he found difficult. The idea of cloning was suggested by producers David Giler and Walter Hill, who opposed the production of Alien: Resurrection, as they thought it would ruin the franchise.

Sigourney Weaver, who had played Ripley throughout the series, wanted to liberate the character in Alien 3 as she did not want Ripley to become "a figure of fun" who would continuously "wake up with monsters running around". The possibility of an Alien vs. Predator film was another reason for the character's death, as she thought the concept "sounded awful". However, Weaver was impressed with Whedon's script. She thought that the error during Ripley's cloning process would allow her to further explore the character, since Ripley becoming part human and part Alien would create uncertainty about where her loyalties lay. This was an interesting concept to Weaver, who thought the film brought back the spirit of Alien and Aliens. Weaver received a co-producer credit and was reportedly paid $11 million.

Trainspotting director Danny Boyle was the producers' first choice to direct the film. Boyle and his producer met with effects supervisors to discuss the film, but he was not interested in pursuing the project. Peter Jackson was also approached, but declined as he could not get excited about an Alien film. In 1995, after the release of The Usual Suspects, 20th Century Fox approached Bryan Singer to direct. Jean-Pierre Jeunet was asked to direct, as the film's producers believed he had a unique visual style. Jeunet had just completed the script to Amélie and was surprised he was offered the job for Alien: Resurrection, as he thought the franchise had finished with Alien 3 and believed that making a sequel was a bad idea. Jeunet, however, accepted the project with a budget of $70 million. He required an interpreter as he did not speak much English when filming began.

Jeunet hired French special effects supervisor Pitof and cinematographer Darius Khondji, both of whom he had worked with on The City of Lost Children. Jeunet and his crew watched the latest science fiction and Alien films as reference material, and obtained production reports from the Alien films to study the camera setups. Jeunet was given creative control, contributing several elements to the script including five different endings, although the expensive ones were dismissed. He also opted to make the film a dark comedy and was encouraged to include more violence. In June 1996, Jeunet's frequent co-director, conceptual artist Marc Caro had drawn rough sketches of characters' costumes, which were shown to veteran costume designer Bob Ringwood. Ringwood made several modifications for the final design.

RocShemp

That article doesn't make sense. If Whedon's original draft featured a clone of Newt, why did he have a hard time making it a clone of Ripley instead? And how did David Giler and Walter Hill later suggest the idea of cloning? Cloning was an angle from the start.

Why So Blu?

You gotta watch the documentary for AR in the anthology set. It's all there.

Numanoid

To be fair, even he didn't mount much of a defense, and the things he did say are arguably true.

Supermallet

As we saw in the Alien 5 thread, I love Alien 3. I love how oppressive and nihilistic and unrepentantly dark and bleak it is. To me, it is as unique as the previous two films in the series, although obviously a more troubled end product than the previous two (Resurrection is also unique, but simply nowhere near the other three in quality).

In terms of AC over TC, I look at it like this. If you want the better Alien sequel, the TC is it without a doubt. It's concise and cuts to the bone. There's no dead weight in it, and it's fucking merciless in its execution of the themes and plot.

But if you want the better film--especially if you view it more as an art film than a sci-fi franchise entry--then the AC is clearly superior. It has more of everything, more incredible imagery, more atmosphere, more bleak oppressiveness, more ambiguity, and more sheer unflinching nihilism. I agree there are elements of the TC that are superior to the AC, but as a complete experience, the AC is pretty incredible. So I think both have their place.

As for some of the other things discussed in this thread:

Alien is the best Alien film. Aliens is just as brave as the other two, it significantly changed the formula and made a surprising but ultimately satisfying twist to the life cycle of the species. All three are brave films in their own way. Alien took a b-movie and turned it into an intriguing, scary prestige film. Aliens completely turned it on its head and made the series malleable. Alien 3 took everything Aliens did and burned it to the ground.

Alien: Resurrection, on the other hand, is a complete mess. The characters feel like caricatures, the tone is all off. The Xenomorph design is streamlined to the point of making them almost uninteresting, and the less said about the hybrid, the better.

But Resurrection is a shining city on a hill compared to AvP, AvP:R, and Prometheus. I remember people called me crazy for saying Resurrection was better than Prometheus when the latter movie came out. Well, I wasn't crazy then, and I'm not crazy now. Which brings me to a further point: Ridley Scott has lost all fucking sense, and that's true of the Alien "Director's Cut" as it is of Prometheus. Obviously the material is so much better in Alien that the DC will never be as bad as any cut of Prometheus, but the DC takes what may be a perfect movie and makes it simply less perfect. Lambert attacking Ripley for not breaking quarantine is a useless moment, and Ripley chancing upon Dallas being turned into an egg completely kills the momentum of that portion of the film. There is no reason for that cut to exist except as a marketing tool, and Scott should have agreed to keep those scenes as extras on the DVD/Blu-ray.

brayzie

Ridley Scott went on record at the time as saying that the original Theatrical Cut is the director's cut. Fox just called the new version with the added deleted scenes the "Director's Cut" for promotional reasons.

Supermallet

Further proving my point.

brayzie

I don't see what the big deal is. It's not like Ridley Scott said "yes, this is my preferred vision for Alien," and the "Director's" Cut never replaced the real version. I think it was only promoted for a brief theatrical release and later as an addition the Collector's Edition of Alien. I thought it was pretty interesting to watch myself. Much better than the Director's Cut of Tombstone.

You're on point with almost everything else though. But I don't think Aliens was brave at all. It's feels like the most commercial of the first three. And I think Prometheus was better than Alien: Resurrection. I hated Prometheus but I at least found some of the sets, designs (not the xeno, squid, or the space cobra though), and the special effects nice to look at...Then again there was more real emotion in the scene when Ripley 8 discovers the clone rejects, than anything in Prometheus.