EVERYTHING that was wrong with INDY4....
02-17-11 | 01:42 AM
#28
DVD Talk Gold Edition
Re: EVERYTHING that was wrong with INDY4....
02-17-11 | 01:46 AM
#29
Re: EVERYTHING that was wrong with INDY4....
.
.
.
BETH: Like in the middle of our fight last night he did this thing that he always does where he asks questions to himself, aloud. And then answers them.
[Jump to David and Elaine out to Dinner]
DAVID: Am I happy Beth left me? Of course not. Do I hope to pick up the pieces and move on? Absolutely
(Elaine sitting in a chair and Jerry in his Kitchen)
ELAINE: Did I have a great time with David Lickner last night? I sure did. (Jerry comes over to the couch with a beverage and sits down) Do I think there is a future here? I don't see why not.
02-17-11 | 06:53 AM
#30
DVD Talk Godfather
Re: EVERYTHING that was wrong with INDY4....
The movie is a fun albeit flawed sequel.
This thread should be collapsed into the general Indy 4 thread as it offers nothing new that wasn't already discussed when it was released.
This thread should be collapsed into the general Indy 4 thread as it offers nothing new that wasn't already discussed when it was released.
02-17-11 | 08:57 AM
#32
DVD Talk Ultimate Edition
Re: EVERYTHING that was wrong with INDY4....
I enjoyed it. Although my tastes have matured, and the ants scene really got to me, since the kids I watched this with couldn't take their eyes off the screen, I would say this was a win.
Sure, there were a lot of problems with the flick, but look at the old Indy movies. They hold up, but they are not immune from aging and their inherent problems.
Imagine the pressure the producers and writers were under for this one. They had to make an over the top flick assuming they would get only one chance and would have to please everyone all at once.
I'm sure you could have done a better job making this movie, but you didn't.
Sure, there were a lot of problems with the flick, but look at the old Indy movies. They hold up, but they are not immune from aging and their inherent problems.
Imagine the pressure the producers and writers were under for this one. They had to make an over the top flick assuming they would get only one chance and would have to please everyone all at once.
I'm sure you could have done a better job making this movie, but you didn't.
02-17-11 | 09:22 AM
#33
Re: EVERYTHING that was wrong with INDY4....
Crystal Skull is not the worst movie ever and I agree that you get more comfortable with it after multiple viewings...
... however, all you Temple of Doom haters can suck it!
Certainly, Raiders is the best film and would be the one I'd recommended to anyone who could only see one Indiana Jones film... but Temple is far and away my favorite of the series.
... however, all you Temple of Doom haters can suck it!
Certainly, Raiders is the best film and would be the one I'd recommended to anyone who could only see one Indiana Jones film... but Temple is far and away my favorite of the series.
02-17-11 | 09:26 AM
#34
Re: EVERYTHING that was wrong with INDY4....
I disagree about the motorcycle chase. Easily the best action sequence in the movie, because there are stuntmen on actual motorcycles and in real cars, and the campus doesn't look like a set.
The Darabont screenplay was much better, ESPECIALLY in terms of retaining Marion's character. And of all the things wrong with Crystal Skull, I think I might've even been able to forgive Shia swinging with the monkeys if Darabont's accurate take on Marion were retained in the movie. It might've even made Ford better, because when Marion is neutered, Indy has nothing to bounce off of.
The Darabont screenplay was much better, ESPECIALLY in terms of retaining Marion's character. And of all the things wrong with Crystal Skull, I think I might've even been able to forgive Shia swinging with the monkeys if Darabont's accurate take on Marion were retained in the movie. It might've even made Ford better, because when Marion is neutered, Indy has nothing to bounce off of.
02-17-11 | 09:29 AM
#35
DVD Talk Hall of Fame
Re: EVERYTHING that was wrong with INDY4....
Everything that was wrong can be summed up in two words
George Lucas
end of discussion
and I love Temple of Doom. It was the first Indy movie I saw when I was a kid.
George Lucas
end of discussion
and I love Temple of Doom. It was the first Indy movie I saw when I was a kid.
02-17-11 | 09:29 AM
#36
Thread Starter
Banned
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 503
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: EVERYTHING that was wrong with INDY4....
I enjoyed it. Although my tastes have matured, and the ants scene really got to me, since the kids I watched this with couldn't take their eyes off the screen, I would say this was a win.
Sure, there were a lot of problems with the flick, but look at the old Indy movies. They hold up, but they are not immune from aging and their inherent problems.
Imagine the pressure the producers and writers were under for this one. They had to make an over the top flick assuming they would get only one chance and would have to please everyone all at once.
I'm sure you could have done a better job making this movie, but you didn't.
Sure, there were a lot of problems with the flick, but look at the old Indy movies. They hold up, but they are not immune from aging and their inherent problems.
Imagine the pressure the producers and writers were under for this one. They had to make an over the top flick assuming they would get only one chance and would have to please everyone all at once.
I'm sure you could have done a better job making this movie, but you didn't.
02-17-11 | 09:49 AM
#37
DVD Talk Limited Edition
Re: EVERYTHING that was wrong with INDY4....
This. Crystal Skull isn't worthy enough to clean Temple of Doom's underwear.
02-17-11 | 09:58 AM
#38
DVD Talk Hero
Re: EVERYTHING that was wrong with INDY4....
Agreed!Raiders is the best
Temple is the most fun
Last Crusade is the most boring
and Crystal Skull is the worst
02-17-11 | 10:05 AM
#39
02-17-11 | 11:05 AM
#41
DVD Talk Hero
Re: EVERYTHING that was wrong with INDY4....
My only real gripe about Indy 4 is its lack of scale. This was an Indiana Jones movie 20 years in the making! It should have been epic. At least on par with Raiders or The Last Crusade. To me Raiders felt like it was filmed in the Middle East, Last Crusade felt like it was filmed throughout Europe, and Indy 4 felt like it was filmed on a studio backlot. There's an overhead shot of the cemetery that looks peculiarly like a miniature, The South American Village scenes were shot so tight that they looked like backlot scenes, and the jungle had way too much CGI for my tastes.
To me the opening warehouse scene is the best sequence in the entire movie. It fits perfectly with the rest of the series. IMO, it's an Indiana Jones movie at its best!
The college Campus chase sequence was also fantastically done. It was fun and energetic throughout. I loved the smirk that Mutt gives to Indy only to have Indy glare back at him. I was a great callback to The Last Crusade when Indy gives that same smirk to his dad only to have Henry Sr. glare back at him.
To me the opening warehouse scene is the best sequence in the entire movie. It fits perfectly with the rest of the series. IMO, it's an Indiana Jones movie at its best!
The college Campus chase sequence was also fantastically done. It was fun and energetic throughout. I loved the smirk that Mutt gives to Indy only to have Indy glare back at him. I was a great callback to The Last Crusade when Indy gives that same smirk to his dad only to have Henry Sr. glare back at him.
02-17-11 | 01:23 PM
#42
DVD Talk Legend
Re: EVERYTHING that was wrong with INDY4....
Hello Friends!
Big Indiana Jones fan here. I've been still reading in this forum lately that people are still convinced that CRYSTAL SKULL was a DECENT film......even though it didn't compare with the original trilogy. I've compiled a list of just about EVERYTHING that went wrong in INDY 4. It's one of the worst sequels of ALL-TIME imo. Again, that's coming from a franchise where the original film was GREAT!! Hope you guys get a kick out of this list.
1. How many shots did we need of Groundhogs? None, but we got 4 or 5.
2. Using "HOUND DOG" by Elvis during opening credits. I get it Lucas....we are in the 50s now.
3. The Warehouse. What was the point of having the opening sequence take place in the warehouse from the end of RAIDERS? Just so we can have that one quick shot of the ark as Lucas winks at the camera.
4. Why is there a working tv playing Howdy Doody in that fake house with lead fridge?
5. Why is there a mannequin watering his fake front yard?
6. Nuke fridge. Need I say more?
7. Indy getting his privates scrubbed because of possible radiation exposure. Yeah Lucas, very Funny.
8. Why are there publicity stills of Henry Sr. and Willie from the other films in Indy's house?
9. Shia LaBeouf. Can someone tell Hollywood to stop matching this kid up with A-List actors? He is a tv actor AT BEST!
10. How did Mutt know Indy was at the train station? And just in time as the train was leaving.
11. Mutt's hair. Worst greaser hair since Fonzie.
12. What was with Mutt's switchblade? He never used it for anything! So why show he is handy with one? It that supposed to connect up with the sword fighting on the jeeps? Still doesn't make sense.
13. The motorcycle chase through the campus. One of the most uninspired action sequences I've ever seen! I actually went to Yale in June of '07 to watch them shoot this piece of shit.
14. Indy and Mutt at the graveyard. You had these things jumping out of trees and Indy hitting them with shovels. ZZZZZzzzzz
15. Mutt: "You're a teacher?" Indy: "Part time." Just a terrible piece of dialogue. David Koepp is one of the worst and most overrated screenwriters in Hollywood.
16. Indy and Mutt enter cave and find crystal skull. This whole scene is SO BORING and it goes on FOREVER!!! I actually forgot what they were doing here after a while.
17. Indy and Mutt reach prison where Oxley was staying. In this scene, we have to watch Mutt cry for some reason. Good Lord!
18. Cate Blanchett. Women don't make good villians...PERIOD! Especially if they are written by David Keopp. Listen to all her dialog next time. It's all cliched nonsense!
19. The scene where Indy is getting brainwashed by skull in tent with Spalko. More boring stuff.
20. Marion. She was AWSOME in the first film. Here she has NOTHING to do! The first meeting between her and Indy is written so poorly beyond belief. And watch how bad Ford is in this scene. His acting is just terrible.
21. The scene in quicksand. This scene was SO BAD for so many reasons. The snake. The dialog. Marion's confession that Mutt is Indy's son. This scene was so bad, I remember feeling embarrassed for the filmmakers. I wanted to turn my head away from the screen at this point.
22. John Hurt. All he does in this film is mumble.
23. Indy having to solve these stupid riddles/puzzles. ZZZZzzzz
24. The jungle chase. Another uninspired action sequence. I remember producer Frank Marshall saying that this scene was on par with the truck chase in RAIDERS. Is he out of his friggin mind? We get boring sword fighting, Mutt getting hit in the balls with trees and Mutt swinging from vines with monkeys. Embarrassing!
25. The waterfall sequence. We get Indy and Co. going over 3 waterfalls. Wow.....pretty exciting.
26. No one seems to mention this, but after the waterfall sequence and they all reach land, Marion is still pretending she is driving the truck by holding the steering wheel. Wtf???
27. Ants? It's bad enough we get ants this time, but CGI ants? They couldn't even give us the real thing.
28. Mac. He kept going back and forth between good and bad. Who cares?! His character was so pointless. I mean that too!
29. The ENTIRE 3rd act! All this stuff is just nonsense. Bad acting, bad CGI ect....
30. Indy getting married. Why did we need to see this? You can imply it, but don't show it.
31. John Williams. He is a GOD! But this is one of the WORST soundtracks he's ever done. But how do you compose to crap? Even his scores for THE PREQUELS were just God awful. But once again, how do you compose to crap? Try to hum a theme (besides the main theme) from this film. You can't do it..can you?
Pbishop69
Big Indiana Jones fan here. I've been still reading in this forum lately that people are still convinced that CRYSTAL SKULL was a DECENT film......even though it didn't compare with the original trilogy. I've compiled a list of just about EVERYTHING that went wrong in INDY 4. It's one of the worst sequels of ALL-TIME imo. Again, that's coming from a franchise where the original film was GREAT!! Hope you guys get a kick out of this list.
1. How many shots did we need of Groundhogs? None, but we got 4 or 5.
2. Using "HOUND DOG" by Elvis during opening credits. I get it Lucas....we are in the 50s now.
3. The Warehouse. What was the point of having the opening sequence take place in the warehouse from the end of RAIDERS? Just so we can have that one quick shot of the ark as Lucas winks at the camera.
4. Why is there a working tv playing Howdy Doody in that fake house with lead fridge?
5. Why is there a mannequin watering his fake front yard?
6. Nuke fridge. Need I say more?
7. Indy getting his privates scrubbed because of possible radiation exposure. Yeah Lucas, very Funny.
8. Why are there publicity stills of Henry Sr. and Willie from the other films in Indy's house?
9. Shia LaBeouf. Can someone tell Hollywood to stop matching this kid up with A-List actors? He is a tv actor AT BEST!
10. How did Mutt know Indy was at the train station? And just in time as the train was leaving.
11. Mutt's hair. Worst greaser hair since Fonzie.
12. What was with Mutt's switchblade? He never used it for anything! So why show he is handy with one? It that supposed to connect up with the sword fighting on the jeeps? Still doesn't make sense.
13. The motorcycle chase through the campus. One of the most uninspired action sequences I've ever seen! I actually went to Yale in June of '07 to watch them shoot this piece of shit.
14. Indy and Mutt at the graveyard. You had these things jumping out of trees and Indy hitting them with shovels. ZZZZZzzzzz
15. Mutt: "You're a teacher?" Indy: "Part time." Just a terrible piece of dialogue. David Koepp is one of the worst and most overrated screenwriters in Hollywood.
16. Indy and Mutt enter cave and find crystal skull. This whole scene is SO BORING and it goes on FOREVER!!! I actually forgot what they were doing here after a while.
17. Indy and Mutt reach prison where Oxley was staying. In this scene, we have to watch Mutt cry for some reason. Good Lord!
18. Cate Blanchett. Women don't make good villians...PERIOD! Especially if they are written by David Keopp. Listen to all her dialog next time. It's all cliched nonsense!
19. The scene where Indy is getting brainwashed by skull in tent with Spalko. More boring stuff.
20. Marion. She was AWSOME in the first film. Here she has NOTHING to do! The first meeting between her and Indy is written so poorly beyond belief. And watch how bad Ford is in this scene. His acting is just terrible.
21. The scene in quicksand. This scene was SO BAD for so many reasons. The snake. The dialog. Marion's confession that Mutt is Indy's son. This scene was so bad, I remember feeling embarrassed for the filmmakers. I wanted to turn my head away from the screen at this point.
22. John Hurt. All he does in this film is mumble.
23. Indy having to solve these stupid riddles/puzzles. ZZZZzzzz
24. The jungle chase. Another uninspired action sequence. I remember producer Frank Marshall saying that this scene was on par with the truck chase in RAIDERS. Is he out of his friggin mind? We get boring sword fighting, Mutt getting hit in the balls with trees and Mutt swinging from vines with monkeys. Embarrassing!
25. The waterfall sequence. We get Indy and Co. going over 3 waterfalls. Wow.....pretty exciting.
26. No one seems to mention this, but after the waterfall sequence and they all reach land, Marion is still pretending she is driving the truck by holding the steering wheel. Wtf???
27. Ants? It's bad enough we get ants this time, but CGI ants? They couldn't even give us the real thing.
28. Mac. He kept going back and forth between good and bad. Who cares?! His character was so pointless. I mean that too!
29. The ENTIRE 3rd act! All this stuff is just nonsense. Bad acting, bad CGI ect....
30. Indy getting married. Why did we need to see this? You can imply it, but don't show it.
31. John Williams. He is a GOD! But this is one of the WORST soundtracks he's ever done. But how do you compose to crap? Even his scores for THE PREQUELS were just God awful. But once again, how do you compose to crap? Try to hum a theme (besides the main theme) from this film. You can't do it..can you?
Pbishop69
02-17-11 | 01:36 PM
#43
DVD Talk Platinum Edition
Re: EVERYTHING that was wrong with INDY4....
I enjoyed the movie. I dont get most of your complaints of the movie. Movie isnt great but I enjoyed it. I had a fun time watching it. Its not great like the other Indy movies but its a fun movie. Just dont compare it to the others.
The only thing that made my cringe was Shia LeBouf swinging around like Tarzan and the monkeys who follow him.
The only thing that made my cringe was Shia LeBouf swinging around like Tarzan and the monkeys who follow him.
02-17-11 | 02:12 PM
#45
DVD Talk Ultimate Edition
Re: EVERYTHING that was wrong with INDY4....
Not once through all your ranting did you even mention the man who directed the film, and was probably just as responsible for every negative thing, if not more responsible. Steven Spielberg probably had more control than anyone once actual filming started. For all of Lucas' faults, he didn't write or direct this film. His only credit was story credits and executive producer, meaning he paid for the film.
As for Darabont's script, I've read the script online that is supposedly his Indy IV screenplay, and if it is indeed the real thing, then Lucas killing it was the best decision he's made in 15 years.
As for Darabont's script, I've read the script online that is supposedly his Indy IV screenplay, and if it is indeed the real thing, then Lucas killing it was the best decision he's made in 15 years.
Last edited by Terrell; 02-17-11 at 02:17 PM.
02-17-11 | 02:21 PM
#46
Banned
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 7,982
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: EVERYTHING that was wrong with INDY4....
The Temple of Doom hate I don't understand. It's a dark movie and DVDTALK memebers like dark anything. Indy 4 is more like Phantom Menace and that hate I do understand.
I myself liked 3 out of 4 Indy movies. The one I didn't like was Indy 3.
I liked all 6 Star Wars too.
I myself liked 3 out of 4 Indy movies. The one I didn't like was Indy 3.
I liked all 6 Star Wars too.
02-17-11 | 03:33 PM
#48
DVD Talk Hero
Re: EVERYTHING that was wrong with INDY4....
The thing that I really love about "Temple of Doom" is that it's completely different from "Raiders of the Lost Ark." It isn't just a retread, it's a completely different movie with Indiana Jones in it, but still fits comfortably in the mythology established in Raiders.
The flying saucer, not so much.
The flying saucer, not so much.
02-17-11 | 03:50 PM
#49
Moderator
02-17-11 | 03:54 PM
#50
DVD Talk Legend
Re: EVERYTHING that was wrong with INDY4....
The thing that I really love about "Temple of Doom" is that it's completely different from "Raiders of the Lost Ark." It isn't just a retread, it's a completely different movie with Indiana Jones in it, but still fits comfortably in the mythology established in Raiders.
The flying saucer, not so much.
The flying saucer, not so much.
I also don't get all of the hate for Temple of Doom. I don't buy into all of the hate for Crystal Skull, but I don't get how it seems to get less hate than Temple of Doom. ToD was the first VHS movie I ever owned when I was 10, and boy did I wear that thing out from the amount of times I watched it. Raiders is the better movie, but Temple grabs you in the first scene and doesn't let up until the very end.
I too enjoy how it went into a different, darker, direction for the second outing(though it occurs first in the series). Lucas himself said that was meant to reflect the way he approached ESB. What I find disappointing is that in both cases, instead of continuing the path of something new and interesting with the characters, Lucas seemed to play it safe and be formulaic with each subsequent effort. ESB was the most interesting SW movie, but after that one it was about as cookie cutter as possible (Sith being somewhat of a callback to Empire, which is probably why it's the only prequel I truly like ) . Same with Indy. In fact, if you were to watch them in chronological order, it's something interesting and different followed by something even better and more uplifting, then two plots more or less copied from the second in terms of story progression within the plots.