The best scene in the movie for sure. "Yeah, lose the Woody Allen Jacket." I also love the line "How much do clothes cost in the Matrix?"

This movie for me came out of nowhere. I had not heard of it before and i went in fresh. Its been a long time since i have had the experience of watching a movie that i know absolutely nothing about, and it makes it a nice change. These days with the Internet and movie trailers we tend to know the movie in and out before we actually see it. I just found it nice to see a different leading man, and an everyman type at that, and a cast that seemed to fit the roles well.

I actually worked for a few years for a large software company in England and it was funny to also see the archetypes that are in the movie. Glorious years working for that company and being paid to test video games and tech.

It's a pretty funny movie, I don't think it's as great as some people make it out to be but it definitely has some great moments in it.

You can like whatever kinds of movie you like. I never once said that you had to agree with me. But just because you like Caddyshack doesn't make it a good movie. There are plenty of movies that I like that aren't the best for different reasons. It could be bad sets or bad acting or bad effects. But that doesn't stop me from enjoying them. But you can't say a movie isn't bad just because you like it. That's dumb. There are well made movies that I just can't stand. District 9, for example, is a complete pile of crap. Completely unrealistic. Not because of the aliens, but because of how the government acted with them. Also, the SAW movies. I can tell the imagination that went into coming up with the traps, but it was a stupid movie. On the other hand, there are movies that are quite obviously badly made. Like Avatar, for example. Horrible effects. The worst that I've seen in a long time. Good effects are supposed to pull you into the movie and convince you that you're really in that world. But Avatar failed miserably. Hardly anything in the movie looked real. And the script ? Good lord, the suck-osity of it. It just picked bits and pieces from other, actually good movies (just like District 9 did), and tried to put them together to form a coherent movie. It didn't.

Avatar was plenty coherent, and actually pretty well designed and directed/paced, but it was derivative as hell and more of an animated flick than a live action one.

Oh and nobody said anything about good movies vs. bad movies, just that this one was funny as hell for some of us and not for others. It's obvious Xander doesn't agree with your taste in movies, so be it.

This movie seems to have a real divide on people who like it and those who don't. Its not worth arguing over though guys. For me its a nice little movie that takes me away from boredom for a brief time. Its not high art, or the most amazing and original story. Just take it for what it is. I guess some people expect or desire a lot more when they invest time in a movie, and i understand that. These days i simply want to be entertained and this movie achieved that for me.

Oh do your posts make me laugh.

What's so funny about my posts ? You don't have to agree, but don't dismiss my views. They're quite valid. What about my post did you disagree with ?

I agree that Avatar was coherent. I guess I just misphrased myself. What I meant to say was compelling. I got Avatar. I understood it. But just because people understand a movie doesn't make it good.

Yeah, I'm not feeling it on the Avatar hate. Is it bad? No. Is it great? no. It is sure as hell not badly made. It's got grade A production all the way through..the killer for it is that...the story is average..which can only do so much for the actors. Stephen Lang was pretty badass though...stereotypical but he really made it cool. Again it's the story that can only take it so far...which is it's flaw. Effects, camerawork (loosely using the term here but...you know what I mean), the tech created for it was pretty damn amazing as well. BUT that story makes it so predictable. It's a good movie for sake of everything else sugarcoating the story by so much.

Jeff: Hey, Alex. Can we go back to your grandma's house? I gotta pee.
Alex: Why don't you just go to the alley and pee?
Jeff: I gotta pee out of my ass.
Alex: Well I guess we could go by.

The effects weren't spectacular, like you think. Nothing in the movie looked realistic. The effects are a joke. The entire time through, you're aware you're watching computers. If the effects were any good, they'd suck you into the movie and make you feel like you're in an actual environment. Avatar felt like the simulation that it was. Nothing looked realistic and the blue whatevers didn't move realistically. Grade A production ? Not hardly. The story wasn't really the problem. It was the effects and high school grade acting. The tech was not amazing. There wasn't anything in the movie that we haven't seen before and done much better before. The CGI in Jurassic Park was incredible....and that was nearly 20 years ago ! The 3D ? Horrible. How To Train Your Dragon had far superior 3D. Avatar is not a good movie. But if you like it, more power to you. But, as I've said a million times, just because you like it doesn't make it good.

You just don't get it.

I see where this thread is headed and I've already exhausted my interest in the "Just because you like it doesn't make it good/I don't like it and my reasons are better than yours" nonsense. Gonna root around the User CP to see about un-subscribing from this thread. But the rest of y'all have fun with this.

I never once said my reasons were better than anyone elses, MiniShaw. Nothing I said is nonsense. It's true : just because you like a movie, doesn't make it good. And just because you don't like a movie, doesn't make it bad. You can look at a film and recognise that it's badly made but still enjoy it. And you can hate a movie, but recognise that it's well made. It just wasn't your cup of tea. That's my whole point. There are movies that are absolutely bad, and it's not just a matter of opinion. Just as there are movies that are good and it's not just a matter of opinion. You can enjoy bad movies just as well as good ones. But please, have the courage to admit that, if a movie is badly made, that it's badly made. It doesn't matter if you enjoy the movie or not. Good and bad is NOT always a matter of opinion. For instance, I absolutely hate Titanic, but can see that the effects are good and, except for a few small instances, the acting is alright. And I absolutely love the old Doctor Who show. But can see that the effects aren't always the best and the set often look like they were put together for a junior high school play.

If I was saying you were retarded or stupid or something like that just because you like a certain movie or don't like a certain movie,...I could understand all the hostility towards the things I've said. But everything I've said is the truth. Just because you may hate certain movies, doesn't make them bad. And just because you may like certain movies, doesn't make them good. But anyone who is openminded can look at a movie and see that it's well made, but admit they don't like it. As well as look at a movie and see that it's poorly made, but admit they like it. What about that is so hard for you people to understand ? It's not like I said I liked Who's Your Caddy, Juwanna Man, or Booty Call.

So what makes a movie absolutely good?

So what makes a movie absolutely bad?

Your Titanic description fits almost what Avatar is. Except...Avatar has a shit ton of tech work and a simpler story that can only promote so much in actors to be the way they are. I don't like titanic..but it's a good movie (though again..the story is a simple and weak but it has solid direction). I like Avatar it's an overall average film. We all know we like some shit. I like The Expendables but damnit..it's a pretty flawed film...where does one start on that flick? Color timing, effects, story, editing, etc etc. Avatar isn't nowhere as bad as The Expendables. Avatar isn't a badly made film. TF2 is a badly made film.

I'm pretty sure if a movie is bad, it's fucking bad. And if it's good, I fucking love it. My opinion is the only thing that decides what a bad or good movie is (totally subjective), there is no gray area or understanding. So no, I can't realize a movie being good even if I don't like it, because it sucks ass.

Right. I can recognise that a movie that I absolutely hate, Godfather, is well made, though I do find it boring. I'm not talking about a good movie or bad movie in terms of your opinion of it being bad or good as in liking/not liking it. I mean well made technically, effect-wise, or good acting. There are movies like that I don't like. Not because of how the movie was made, but just because I don't like it. But there are also movies that aren't so technically well made or has bad effects that I do like. Merlin's Shoppe Of Magical Wonders is a good example of this. I like bad movies as well as good movies. Why can't you admit that you can get enjoyment out of bad movies, if only for how funny they are ? Or that you may not enjoy a movie even if it's well made ? DOOM is a horrible movie in terms of acting and storyline, but it's a lot of fun to watch...at least for me, it is. I can recognise the movie's faults, but they don't hamper my enjoyment of the movie. What about that don't you get ?

A good movie has characters with depth and development. A bad movie has characters with no development, flat acting, etc. But again, just because a movie has good sets, doesn't mean it's going to be a good movie. For example Your Highness. It looks good and has good atmosphere, but that's about it.

Thank you for all that. That's what I've been trying to say for so long, but no one gets that. All they hear is that I don't like movies that they love. Then they attack me for not liking what they do and completely ignore any reasons that I give for thinking the way I do.

I agree with Spottedfeather...Caddyshack stinks. http://the-following-preview.blogspo...hack-1980.html

Well, they're ignoring your reasons because quite frankly, they do not agree with you and you're not making compelling arguments to convince anyone otherwise.

People completely get what you're saying...they just don't agree with you. Your mistake is thinking there is some absolute truth defining good and bad. There isn't.

As for Grandma's Boy...funny little flick. It's got this silly, playful stupidity to it that's just fun to watch.

I love it. I have no illusions that it's a fantastic movie or anything, but it makes me laugh, a lot.

Yes, there IS some absolute truth defining good and bad. You don't seem to get that. If you like something, you'll think it's good. But that doesn't mean that it's technically well made, or that the sets were good, or that the acting was good. And if you hate something, you'll think it's bad. I hate most horror movies, for example. But I can recognise the inventiveness that went into them. Bad sets or effects don't mean that a movie is going to be bad. It may very well be quite enjoyable. As I said, the original Doctor Who series wasn't well made, but it is fun to watch. It all comes down to the acting and the story of the movie. If a movie doesn't have decent acting and a decent story, then it's bad, right ? Just because a movie is well made doesn't make it good. If you hate it, then fine. But you should be able to see that it's a well made movie, even though you don't like it. There are plenty of well made movies that I can't stand. Up, Cars, and Ratatouille are prime examples. I hate these movies. But I'm big enough to admit that they are well made, good looking movies.

I don't, because there isn't. I will never get your point of view, because I will never agree with it. There are certain objective realities about filmmaking, but there flat out is no definition of good or bad. There is often an agreed upon consensus about what good or bad means...sure. But it is not an absolute, and it's really just egotistical to pretend you know it to a point you can lecture others about it. Don't worry though, you're not the only film snob who thinks this way...but I vehemently disagree. And it is in this opinion that your condescension can rub some people the wrong way. Don't feel bad though...I can be quite the condescending film snob also.

And again, you're not giving enough credit to the very subjective nature of filmmaking. While I probably would agree with you on many of the things you attribute as factors in what makes a good film, you cannot, and will never be right, in stating it's an absolute fact. And when you do, and when you attempt to lecture others that you know this god given truth, you will annoy the hell out of people. Because let's be real, you don't. Because there isn't one.

By all means, stand by your opinions, defend them, and make your arguments. Some of what you say I most certainly agree with. I can name lots of films that are well made that I don't like, and visa versa. But never forget what it is you're arguing...an opinion. It always is, and always will be just that. You can argue all day long a movie has good production value, there's some objective truth to that (and really, that's all your "well made" means). But that is far, far away from saying a film is good or bad. After all, who are you to define what that means?

Ok, now, I will get off my philosophical high horse. After all, this is a thread about Grandma's Boy.