What about Bizzaro?

Superman 3 actually kind of did Bizarro. They copped out making him be Superman's "dark side", but it was basically Bizarro.

They should have used Venom as the reason he turns to the dark side (or is that "Darkseid"?) rather than tar-tainted kryptonite.

For the next Superman movie to be successful, the producers have to go the outer-space epic route - using Darkseid, Brainiac, and/or Doomsday. They will most likely go with Brainiac though. The action has to be big and the next film has to be different from all the other films, because that was the biggest critisicm of the Superman Returns - a boring remake of the first film. It's almost like they have to go the same route as Superman 4 (using Nuclear Man), but only with better writing and better villains.

They've done a perfect origin story - Superman 1
They've done a perfectly balanced sequel with great villains - Superman 2
They've tried the lighter, comedy, slapstick approach with a combination of Superman getting dark (which didn't quite work) - Superman 3
They've done the "kill the franchise" approach - Superman 4
They've done the boring remake, "already did-that in Superman 1" approach - Superman Returns


It's time to do something completely different - and that doesn't mean take away Superman's cape and give him long hair.

Wow that would've been nuts! Using a character from another company, and 3 years before he was created! :)

Anyway, my vote is still Braniac. You can use the newer concept of regular size green Braniac, who uses gigantic robots.

Or Darkseid and 1 million Parademons.

They can actually use all the versions of Brainiac since he's always body jumping. They can use the robot Brainiac during most of the movie, have Superman smash him up, only to realize that Brainiac's mind jumped to his "Blofeld"-type green humanoid form by the end of the film. After all Brainiac is part computer-part humanoid. It's what Doctor Doom does all the time as well in the FF4 comics. Although it's more realistic with Brainiac because he's an alien, while Doom is just a human with really good brain powers...

I think they need to nix Doomsday for the time being. I haven't seen Iron Man, but I heard about the Avengers plot. If WB and DC were smart (real smart), they'd build up the DC universe, launch a Justice League film and then have the sequel to that or a Superman 3 be the Doomsday flick. However, it would take some serious planning, and based on what I've seen (e.g. Catwoman) I don't see that happening with these executives running things.

Problem with that is that the directors that did Begins and Returns have a very different visual incorporation of style. IM and TIH are both similar based on the world they inhabit. Nolan's Batman and Singer's Superman would never work together visually...if WB wanted to make a JL movie, they should've had that in mind from the start for the sake of easing the incorporation of the charaters together.

And I thought Superman 3 also did the poor man's version of Brainiac with the supercomputer - although I am still confused if Brainiac is a computer, alien, both or neither. Wikipedia has helped, though.

Speaking of poor man versions, I guess Robert Vaughn's character was just a rip of Lex Luthor, too. Well, at least they had the real Lana Lang.

Uhh...what the hell are you talking about with Doom? The Doombots? He's not a robot.

Anyway, I'm depressed, because had Singer done X3, he MAY have done a decent Dark Phoenix Saga, considering he was gearing up for it ever since the Liberty Island Radiation Incident.

Instead, we got two very sub-par comic movies. :(

It seemed all we had was a movie built around CGI shots. "Hey, let's have Superman get hit in the eye with a bullet! Hey, let's have Superman catch a plane! Hey, let's have Superman throw a kryptonite-laden island into space, even though that makes no fucking sense!"

Hey, at least he didn't fight a big spider or wrassle polar bears. :)

DARKEST PHOENIX,
yep, doombots, but also he's transfered his mind into other bodies (when he got stuck in his melted armor and he transfered his mind into some red-headed dude).

The problem with all super hero movies is a capable villain, Super Returns just proved Luthor is boring. I love Superman II because you actually believe the villains are a threat to Superman. Superman I showed no villain on Earth could compete, so II showed if you're going to have a plausible villain it's going to have to be a superpowered alien like Superman himself. Anyone her ever watch Dragonball? They made the hero more and more powerful every season until he became the most powerful being on Earth, so in DragonballZ they basically turned him into Superman made him an alien and started sending superpowered aliens after him, first from his home planet than from other ones. They were the only credible threats to someone so powerful, same problem with Superman he's just too powerful, so I don't care who is directing unless he's fighting a villain from another planet the movie will suck.

Luthor can be a great villain. When hes not planning land schemes. Again.

In the next installment, Luthor wants to own land....in outer space. He's going to claim the moon, and then go for Mars before Superman stops him ONCE AND FOR ALL...until the next sequel...that is...

I actually like Lex and his land schemes - it's comfy like old house slippers.

And while I agree that the Krypton criminals are good villains, I still think Supes being pushed to the max on earth protecting the humanoids is the best test of his ability.

I mean, if he couldn't turn back time, having him fetch missles here, there and everywhere is something he couldn't even take care of - to spare the lives of the people of earth. But he can turn back time, so ...

My biggest problem with Superman II, especially with the street brawl, is that it seems that the four of them could have fought all day without putting a dent into each other. I guess someone could have been strangled, but it just looked like a good excuse to throw each other around before someone ran for the hills. I love Superman II and the villains in that movie, but I wouldn't want more Hulk vs. Abomination-like fights for the next Superman movie - unless there is a very real, immediate threat to him personally.

I agree.
The character was let down at the story concept stage.
BTW, hasn't Singer said already that he wanted Spacey back for the sequel...in addition to a super powered adversary (and I do think he mentioned Zod which wouldn't suprise me in the least since his scope of reference with this character and his universe is clearly limited to the first two films.).

If you couldn't tell, I think Singer has been vastly overrated starting with the second X-men film and I'm in the minority that thinks he never did lay a substantial enough foundation for a Dark Phoenix storyline to begin with. The Liberty Island reference early in the film is a good start, but it never escalates meaningfully beyond that.
The whole premise with DP is that she undergoes a HUGE personality shift. If that's the case, wouldn't it have made more internal sense to have HER under Jasons mind control than Scott? The way Singer uses these characters in the second film, they are more or less interchangeable. The story functions that Scott and Jean perform are more or less arbitrary and the only reason Jean is really needed to be along with the incursion group (Woverine, Magneto, Storm, etc) is so Singer can almost hook her up with the titular main character of these films (Wolverine). Her 'death' is also seemingly arbitrary and meaningless. These characters are used to seeing the most outlandish extraordinary things, yet they break down and weep in grief the second Jean appears to disincorporate herself. This attitude is forced on these characters and isn't organic or natural to who they are at all (especially Wolverine).

I know the complaints have been done to death, but I think SR gets a bad rap. It does have its faults. Fortunately, all of these obvious faults also have obvious remedies.

This being the internet, they will be listed thusly ;)

1 - Lex Luthor. It's not entirely Kevin Spacey's fault. That "Lex" hasn't been cannon since the seventies. And can we all please sign a declaration to stop acting as if Hackman was brilliant in the role? He was as good as the script merited, but he was no Lex. It's as aggrivating as when people used to say that Jack was the DEFINITIVE Joker. It wasn't true twenty years ago and it's (obviously) not true now. You want to see how Lex should be done? I'll refer you to Superman: The Animated Series by Messuiers Timm, Dini, et all. Spice it up to a PG-13 rating, throw in a little Gordon Gekko, a little Col. Kurtz and BOOM - Lex Luthor.

2 - The kid. It's a problem. It was a stupid idea and it shouldn't have been done.... UNLESS.... The next movie introduces Braniac (or Darkseid, although I'd love for him to be a Justice League villain) who KILLS the kid. Fuck the whole, "You can't kill a kid in a SUPERMAN movie!!!!!" argument. Bollocks. Give the big blue boyscout some emotional depth that goes beyond, "I'm not human and Lois doesn't know how much I love her!" Puts you right back into cannon (read: no retarded, out-of-place, franchise-ending plot threads hanging out there like a penis on Kate Moss) and even moves the main character forward. Kid gone, Lois and Cyclops break up, Lois discovers Clark's identity. Boom - already we are in unexplored territory (discovers and isn't mindwiped by a kiss, I mean).

3 - As many have said before, give him a villain he can FIGHT. We need to see Supes kick ass (and get his ass kicked). Most definitely.

and finally,

4 - Give the poor bastard some lines. "I'm sorry, Mr. Singer... I just thought there was going to be some Superman in my Superman movie."


I'm giving the impression that I disliked the film. I didn't. It's just that there was as much to dislike as to like. Fortunately, as I said, all rectifiable.


Keep the tone, the music, even the same actor if you want. Just bump it up a notch, bench Lex until you get him right, have Supes do some Super stuff that involves fighting instead of catching things.


...and oh yeah - kill the kid.




-Doc

I forget where I read it recently, (it may have been here) but an article said Superman has not thrown a punch in a movie since Superman II. Think about that one.

No punches in Superman IV? (Granted, it's probably been almost 20 years since I've seen that film).

Slap-fights. Nothing but slap-fights.

No punches thrown since Superman 2? That's funny. It's like having a superhero not showoff their powers in a superhero film - oh yeah, it's been done in that awful amateurish film...The Specials.

Its been a while, but I think him and Nuclear man just grappled and threw each other around.

Wow, I had forgotten how cool a Superman punch is or could be? Well, now I just want him punching stuff in the sequel - cars, toasters, baddies, billboards ... Everything!

What about something like attack from another world like WAR OF THE WORLDS vs. SUPERMAN.