Reading some of the negativity about SUPERMAN RETURNS, I can't help but recall that when SUPERMAN first came out, it wasn't exactly greeted with unanimous acclaim by audiences. Of course, the internet wasn't yet invented by Al Gore at the time, so posting opinions were less than likely. However, I do recall reading in magazines (STARLOG and other genre publications) and just through casual discussions that many people had problems with the first two movies:

Why didn't Krypton look like it did in the comics? Why was Lois such a pushy loudmouth? Why wasn't there a Superboy character? Why was Superman's father alive? Where was Krypto, the Superdog? Why didn't the Phantom Zone look like a place for ghosts? Why wasn't Lex Luthor a mad scientist? Why wasn't there a big yellow key to enter the Fortress of Solitude? How did Superman turn back time? What about the Bottle City of Kandor? How could they let Superman screw Lois onscreen? Etc, etc...

I point this out because while SUPERMAN RETURNS had flaws, its predecessors also had their fair share of disappointment and criticism, even though they are considered (rightfully so) classics and the gold standard for comics adaptations. I think SUPERMAN RETURNS will become better regarded with time.

Those same scenes in ATTACK OF THE CLONES also annoy me. But not as much as the terrible exchange where Anakin and Padme are fighting in the arena, and repeat their "diplomatic solutions/aggressive negotiations" dialogue. For whatever reason, I just can't listen to it without having a seizure.

Sorry, didn't mean to turn this to a STAR WARS topic.

Personally, I thought Superman Returns blew. Somehow, I wasn't interested in a character that always interested me...the guy was creepy, using his powers to stalk Lois Lane. I thought Lois Lane was too young, especially to have a kid.....the action scenes I thought were boring ----except for the Space Shuttle Rescue..

I thought Lois Lane was too young and vapid...and this whole returning to Krypton - well I never understood that either - it was never explained well, and seems to go totally against the Donner Superman ethos (and I'm not even talking about the end of Superman 2)..plus he should have known through Jor-El that the planet was completly destroyed and nothing was left..

Maybe he figured somebody had spun around the destroyed Krypton and brought it back to life!

I've said it before and I'll say it again. SR was a good, solid, Superman movie. However, it replicated Donner's style down to everything including the flaws. I would rather Singer have used the great special FX available in this day and age to give us Superman doing something different than just more or less a re-hash of the first movie.

Fixed.

It's there right on the screen right before the credits. AND he mentions it again during the rooftop interview with Lois.

That is one of the things I regret about the editing. That Luthor planted the story to lure Superman away from earth would have been a powerful piece of detail. And it could have been mentioned as originally written in the script during the scene where he beats him up.

I hope that when the next film comes out, Singer releases an extended cut. Despite the lengthy running time, SUPERMAN RETURNS could have benefitted from the additional exposition.

And not knowing that you had a child with Supes? I know it's just a movie but here goes:

1. Lois has sex with Superman in Superman 2
2. Supposedly, he leaves for Krypton for many years right away at the end of Superman 2 and comes back for Superman Returns.
3. In the time that Lois realizes that Superman is gone, she instantly hooks up with another dude (James Marsden) and has unprotected sex right away? Sure, she could have been depressed and upset, but there is no way the time span was that close when Superman and James Marsden had sex with Lois. Lois Lane must have known the whole time that Superman was the father of Asthma Boy.

I really hope they do a sequel/redo a la HULK 2. Don't continue that Superman Returns crappy storyline. I hope the movie producers won't feel pressured to follow up on little Super Boy. In Superman sequel, I just hope:
1. No Lex Luthor
2. No Super boy
3. No Kryptonite
4. No good-looking blond actress turned into a skanky brunette playing Lois Lane.

I still wonder why it took Superman 5 years to get there and back.

peepee breaks?

No thanks, I go by what was in the movie, and the explanation doesn't make any sense.

Ah yes, thank you but it doesn't make any sense..if his father has knowledge far greater than any mere mortal, and his father said the planet was blown up, why bother listening to what humans are saying..

here is the crucial point, Superman in Superman 2 already decided to try and quit being the earth's guardian..for a good reason ..love..and he realized he had made a gigantic mistake when zod + crew showed up and started causing destruction...

so why did he do it again? Because some earth scientist, having far less knowledge of the universe than Jor El, thinks they might have discovered Krypton???

Makes no sense, and ruins the movie for me. If he has been gone, give him a good reason..like maybe he decided human kind wasn't worth fighting for or something.

I'm going to agree with this. I still have a problem with him being gone for so long. Like I said above, 5 years? His freaking time traveling Superman. 5 years is a long damn time in comic time. We're talking Robin to Nightwing time or something.

At first I was hoping it was a self-imposed exile like the comics once did. But for him looking for remains of Krypton, I don't know...He shouldv'e at least found Kandor

It just seems like they needed him off planet to push the kid storyline. He could've at least been in an intergalactic war or something.

*edit- I still enjoy the movie, and watch it often, just the little things that bother me.

For some reason, I wish they filmed Smith's script.. killer polar bears and all..

So did Brandon Routh make so much money from Superman Returns that he's waiting for the sequel and not doing any other work in the meantime?

It did have a nice depiction of Braniac as the villain ... even if the dialog was way too snarky for a Superman movie.

Well, you have valid points, and your frustration is understandable. It's too bad that a few cut lines and a wholly deleted scene could not have made the whole quest for Krypton scene clearer.

The movie was trying to get across Superman's feeling of alienation. He takes his journey (again, contrived by Luthor) to see if there were other survivors like him (save for the villains of SUPERMAN 2 and with the exception of Supergirl, and the people of Argo City, of course). I understood his willingness to leave earth as one of impulse and desperation, with Lex planting the seeds for his wild goose chase. Again, it would have added wit and cleverness to the film had those references not been removed in the final edit.

So Superman leaves after he breaks up with Lois and disposes of earth's last threat (from SUPERMAN II) Luthor was in jail. The Kryptonian villains were de-powered and imprisoned. Everything else on earth seems A-Okay (other than his ignorance of Lois being pregnant). Hey, why not take a vacation?

Well, I guess it goes back to the initial unveil of Superman in Superman I.

Supes decides to use his powers in a public way - saving Lois, saving the President, stopping the bank robbers , hey even saving a cat! when there was no immediate threat to earth as a whole - he didn't know of Lex's plan to blow up California or that Zod would be making an apperance. Instead he was just there to help humankind, to "show them the way" as Jor-El puts it.

Indeed, his fortress is the fortress of solitude..he understands in Donner's first film that his lot in life is to be alone..in fact in both Donner films it is Superman's conscious decision to have a loved one that gets him into trouble - first by reversing time in order to save Lois and then depowering himself in order to make out with her...

also the scene with the constant humming when Clark first decides to go to North Pole is so powerful because he realizes that he has to leave his home, and his mother, to go on this quest...man those Smallville scenes really get me everytime..

So it would seem that Superman has eventually come to the realization at the end of II, that he cannot have a partner and that his role would be the guardian of the planet. In fact, if we use Donner's end to Supe II when he time travels, he essentially wipes out all that came before in order to maintain his guardianship.

Now, Superman Returns would have us believe that their is some type of yearning to find other Kryptonians that he would jump on the nearest rumor to leave the Earth - I just don't believe it and it ruined the whole movie for me...I don't think he would leave his home - Earth - in the vain attempt to find Krypton..it goes against the Superman mythos and more importantly, the previous 2 movies.

And also that Superman has such a strong desire to be with Lois, even after the events of I + II, that he would resort to stalking a married woman seem beyond me...

Well, all I can respond is that Singer has stated for the record that SUPERMAN RETURNS is a vague sequel to the Donner originals. Some elements are in continuity, some are not. A cop-out? Sort of. But it serves the purpose of building upon the significant elements of what was established before (the origin, the power of the crystals, the Fortress, his prior relationship with Lois), as well as giving enough breathing room to move forward.

I actually think that the Return To Krypton is one of the more fascinating elements with the movie, and I'm disappointed that key scenes were removed explaining it more. When you can't have the woman you love, when the only surviving Kryptonians are evil and have to be disposed of, when you've already given up your powers once only to find out that the sacrifice isn't enough, and when all is back to status quo on earth, what is there left to do? You go on a personal quest, the consequences of which are personally affecting, but not intentional. Again, he doesn't know Lois is pregnant, nor does he know that Luthor is still a viable threat.

About the whole stalker scene...we all know that he eavesdropped on Lois's conversation, but only to the extent of finding out her current situation and feelings. Notice that he leaves before she and Richard get too personal about the topic. I didn't see it as stalking. Superman has not always acted honorably angelic with her before (hiding his identity, giving her amnesia, and so forth).

Okay, so now we're off-topic. Sorry again.

WAS a-go, evidently.

For those interested in what didn't make it to the final cut of SUPERMAN RETURNS:

http://www.supermanhomepage.com/tv/t...eleased-stuff2

(scroll towards the bottom)

I'm really not looking forward to this sequel

Because it's far, far away and he needed a spaceship to travel there. Once away from our yellow sun, he's not "Superman" any more. He can't do amazing things, and time travel, and such.

At least that's how I see it.

Yes, remember that Kal-el was just a baby when Jor-el and Lara put him in the starship that carries Kal to earth. When Kal-el is found by the Kents, that's no baby, it's a small child, probably almost 2 years old, so the journey from Krypton to earth is almost 2 years, so the return trip for Superman is at about 4 years, and he spent some time to look for a planet not there anymore, so that could account for the 5th year.

Ok, now I want an extended cut

Maybe they should take a old Superman comic book and take it's story and make that the next movie.