General Blu-ray News and Discussion - Part 5
02-11-08 | 03:54 PM
#451
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Originally Posted by darkside
I said it after the Warner announcement, but I will be surprised to find HD DVDs in retail stores by summertime.
02-11-08 | 03:59 PM
#452
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Originally Posted by kefrank
what surprises me is that the Best Buy announcement says they will still carry HD DVD. why even issue this press release if you're going to issue another one in a few months saying you're dropping HD DVD altogether?
Because with two press releases, they get twice as much press?
02-12-08 | 11:15 AM
#453
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FWIW:
http://panasonic.net/pavc/blu-ray/dmp-bd50/
I am still trying to track down additional information. So far as I am aware, this is the first full-featured BD player to be released.
Edit: There is some speculation on AVS that the BD50 may have the same LFE bug that the BD30 has (LFE output on PCM tracks is 5 db too low and can't be compensated for on the player, or receiver in some cases.) No one knows at this point.
[Feb 12, 2008]
Blu-ray Disc™ Player DMP-BD50 is released on European market.
Blu-ray Disc™ Player DMP-BD50 is released on European market.
I am still trying to track down additional information. So far as I am aware, this is the first full-featured BD player to be released.
Edit: There is some speculation on AVS that the BD50 may have the same LFE bug that the BD30 has (LFE output on PCM tracks is 5 db too low and can't be compensated for on the player, or receiver in some cases.) No one knows at this point.
Last edited by lizard; 02-12-08 at 11:38 AM.
02-12-08 | 03:28 PM
#454
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From: A far green country
Continuing discussion from the Netflix thread, at namja's request...
There are no real projected price decreases for Blu-ray players that are based on HD DVD thriving, so it seems silly to me for anyone to say "it would have dropped to this amount by this time if only HD DVD were still around". The only basis for that claim is pure conjecture.
Originally Posted by namja
I don't think anyone thinks that the BD player prices will actually go up. That really is silly. What I think they're saying is that the BD player prices will drop more slowly than if both formats were doing equally well (hence it'll be "more expensive").
It's sort of like the U.S. Government budget. If a program's budget goes up by 2% but inflation was 3%, then that's considered a budget cut. So if BD player prices drop by 20% with HD DVD being out when it was projected to drop by 35% with HD DVD in, then the BD prices have "gone up" from what was projected, and this is very likely the case.
It's sort of like the U.S. Government budget. If a program's budget goes up by 2% but inflation was 3%, then that's considered a budget cut. So if BD player prices drop by 20% with HD DVD being out when it was projected to drop by 35% with HD DVD in, then the BD prices have "gone up" from what was projected, and this is very likely the case.
02-12-08 | 05:22 PM
#455
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Originally Posted by RoboDad
Continuing discussion from the Netflix thread, at namja's request...
There are no real projected price decreases for Blu-ray players that are based on HD DVD thriving, so it seems silly to me for anyone to say "it would have dropped to this amount by this time if only HD DVD were still around". The only basis for that claim is pure conjecture.
There are no real projected price decreases for Blu-ray players that are based on HD DVD thriving, so it seems silly to me for anyone to say "it would have dropped to this amount by this time if only HD DVD were still around". The only basis for that claim is pure conjecture.
BD player prices will continue to drop. But everything else being equal, not having competition will only slow down the price drops.
I think it'll be very beneficial for Blu-ray if the BDA manufacturers got together and did a huge sale one weekend (sorta like what Toshiba did with the A2). Have the participating manufacturers sell their entry level players for $199. I'll bet they'll sell more than 100,000 units and it'll do wonders for Blu-ray's image.
02-12-08 | 06:04 PM
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From: A far green country
Originally Posted by namja
It's not conjecture at all. That is economics (unless you're of the camp that economics is pure guesswork). Exhibit 1: Without HD DVD around, would we have $350 BD players right now? Absolutely not.
BD player prices will continue to drop. But everything else being equal, not having competition will only slow down the price drops.
BD player prices will continue to drop. But everything else being equal, not having competition will only slow down the price drops.
Originally Posted by namja
I think it'll be very beneficial for Blu-ray if the BDA manufacturers got together and did a huge sale one weekend (sorta like what Toshiba did with the A2). Have the participating manufacturers sell their entry level players for $199. I'll bet they'll sell more than 100,000 units and it'll do wonders for Blu-ray's image.
02-12-08 | 08:02 PM
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From: Houston, Texas
Originally Posted by lizard
FWIW:
http://panasonic.net/pavc/blu-ray/dmp-bd50/
I am still trying to track down additional information. So far as I am aware, this is the first full-featured BD player to be released.
Edit: There is some speculation on AVS that the BD50 may have the same LFE bug that the BD30 has (LFE output on PCM tracks is 5 db too low and can't be compensated for on the player, or receiver in some cases.) No one knows at this point.
http://panasonic.net/pavc/blu-ray/dmp-bd50/
I am still trying to track down additional information. So far as I am aware, this is the first full-featured BD player to be released.
Edit: There is some speculation on AVS that the BD50 may have the same LFE bug that the BD30 has (LFE output on PCM tracks is 5 db too low and can't be compensated for on the player, or receiver in some cases.) No one knows at this point.
02-12-08 | 08:19 PM
#458
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Originally Posted by RoboDad
I guess this is where we disagree. From my perspective, there is still the same level of competition for Blu-ray players that there has always been. You say that we absolutely would not have $350 Blu-ray players without HD DVD. I say that we absolutely would. Why do so many people keep associating competition only with the two sides of the format war? Samsung, Sony, Panasonic and other manufacturers of Blu-ray players are all competing with each other, more than they ever were competing with HD DVD. And that competition is what has driven prices to their current point.
BD was set to launch with players at well over $1000. When HD DVD came to the market at less than 1/2 of what the CEs planned on selling their decks for, they HAD to jump or BD would have been stillborn. The prices dropped very quickly to move out of a whole magnitude of difference in price. This also made them compete on media pricing as well.
This all holds true for the converse as well. HD DVD kept cutting their margins each time BD did.
Anyone, even the president of the fucking BDA, that cannot admit that HD DVD and BD competing brought us to the current state of the pricing of HDM is just absolutely out of touch.
I do not see how this point is debatable in any way, shape or form.
It was NOT competition between the various CEs that brought prices down. Hell, aside from the PS3, BD player sales are pitiful, almost not even worth gauging. I am not knocking BD player sales, it is a testament to the PS3 how much better it moves than all other decks combined. Everyone knows that PS3 is far and away the best, safest and most well supported BD player available.
02-12-08 | 10:47 PM
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From: In the Universe.
Yes. There is no doubt either HD-DVD or BD player prices would be this low. Granted we can never really be sure of this fact but it's pretty much a lock that both dropped their prices because of one another.
02-13-08 | 01:38 AM
#460
Blu-ray won, now where are the fucking movies? Seriously, since that Warner announcement we haven't gotten anything. We got teased by rumors of Lawrence of Arabia seen promos for Ghostbusters and finally getting Gattaca that was supposed to be released last year.
When the Paramount deal with HD-DVD was announced, Fox countered with a big release schedule. We've got nothing now.
Disney is keeping up with what they promised. Fox has announced a few memorable classic war films including Mrs. Doubtfire but at the same time postponed the release of Master & Commander for what seems like a year now. Warner has announced that we'll get an expected Batman anthology re-release and Wizard of Oz and Gone With the Wind in 2009. That wouldn't be so bad if it weren't fucking February!
Is this what we are to expect now? The blu-ray camp sitting on their asses?
When the Paramount deal with HD-DVD was announced, Fox countered with a big release schedule. We've got nothing now.
Disney is keeping up with what they promised. Fox has announced a few memorable classic war films including Mrs. Doubtfire but at the same time postponed the release of Master & Commander for what seems like a year now. Warner has announced that we'll get an expected Batman anthology re-release and Wizard of Oz and Gone With the Wind in 2009. That wouldn't be so bad if it weren't fucking February!
Is this what we are to expect now? The blu-ray camp sitting on their asses?
02-13-08 | 04:27 AM
#461
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Originally Posted by PopcornTreeCt
Blu-ray won, now where are the fucking movies? Seriously, since that Warner announcement we haven't gotten anything. We got teased by rumors of Lawrence of Arabia seen promos for Ghostbusters and finally getting Gattaca that was supposed to be released last year.
When the Paramount deal with HD-DVD was announced, Fox countered with a big release schedule. We've got nothing now.
Disney is keeping up with what they promised. Fox has announced a few memorable classic war films including Mrs. Doubtfire but at the same time postponed the release of Master & Commander for what seems like a year now. Warner has announced that we'll get an expected Batman anthology re-release and Wizard of Oz and Gone With the Wind in 2009. That wouldn't be so bad if it weren't fucking February!
Is this what we are to expect now? The blu-ray camp sitting on their asses?
When the Paramount deal with HD-DVD was announced, Fox countered with a big release schedule. We've got nothing now.
Disney is keeping up with what they promised. Fox has announced a few memorable classic war films including Mrs. Doubtfire but at the same time postponed the release of Master & Commander for what seems like a year now. Warner has announced that we'll get an expected Batman anthology re-release and Wizard of Oz and Gone With the Wind in 2009. That wouldn't be so bad if it weren't fucking February!
Is this what we are to expect now? The blu-ray camp sitting on their asses?
02-13-08 | 08:10 AM
#462
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Originally Posted by PopcornTreeCt
Fox has announced a few memorable classic war films including Mrs. Doubtfire but at the same time postponed the release of Master & Commander for what seems like a year now.
On a more serious note, I do think announcements will pick up once we hit March. Imagination my impatience at receiving $270 in store credit at DVD Planet only to find 3 pre-orders worth my time ordering on BD. What??? You mean I actually have to sit on the rest of that credit until they list some new, great pre-orders??? Any day now we will be seeing some more goods.
02-13-08 | 11:44 AM
#463
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Originally Posted by namja
It's not conjecture at all. That is economics (unless you're of the camp that economics is pure guesswork). Exhibit 1: Without HD DVD around, would we have $350 BD players right now? Absolutely not.
after divx died what drove dvd prices down? what has altered in the consumer electronics landscape which will prevent the same thing from happening again?
02-13-08 | 11:51 AM
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From: A far green country
Originally Posted by Burnt Thru
that is conjecture, possibly correct but certainly not backed up by any facts. economics is something else entirely...
after divx died what drove dvd prices down? what has altered in the consumer electronics landscape which will prevent the same thing from happening again?
after divx died what drove dvd prices down? what has altered in the consumer electronics landscape which will prevent the same thing from happening again?
02-13-08 | 11:51 AM
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Originally Posted by Burnt Thru
that is conjecture, possibly correct but certainly not backed up by any facts. economics is something else entirely...
after divx died what drove dvd prices down? what has altered in the consumer electronics landscape which will prevent the same thing from happening again?
after divx died what drove dvd prices down? what has altered in the consumer electronics landscape which will prevent the same thing from happening again?
It's not really a question of whether or not the prices will eventually go down; they will. The issue is that without competition from a rival format, there is much less of a reason to drop prices very soon.
02-13-08 | 11:54 AM
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From: A far green country
Originally Posted by applesandrice
It's not really a question of whether or not the prices will eventually go down; they will. The issue is that without competition from a rival format, there is much less of a reason to drop prices very soon.
02-13-08 | 12:09 PM
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Originally Posted by RoboDad
Right, because all of the Blu-ray player manufacturers are in league and fixing prices. Or is it that they are all controlled by Sony? I have yet to see any of the "only competing formats drive down prices" explain how competition between different manufacturers within a given format doesn't have the same effect.
Of course each of the CEs is going to want their player(s) to sell more units, and they will price them accordingly. The difference is that it's now a format that is no longer under the same pressure to survive. They'll keep their prices as high as they can for as long as they can.
02-13-08 | 12:35 PM
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From: A far green country
Originally Posted by applesandrice
I was going to point my finger at the Trilateral Commission rather than Sony . . .
I think, based on some of the posts I read here and at AVS, in some peoples' minds there is no difference.
Originally Posted by applesandrice
Of course each of the CEs is going to want their player(s) to sell more units, and they will price them accordingly. The difference is that it's now a format that is no longer under the same pressure to survive. They'll keep their prices as high as they can for as long as they can.
02-13-08 | 12:58 PM
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Originally Posted by RoboDad
I think, based on some of the posts I read here and at AVS, in some peoples' minds there is no difference.
Well, that's the question, isn't it? Do the CEs feel comfortable enough with both their relative position in the Blu-ray sector, as well as the overall "health" of the sector, to justify keeping prices high? I can't believe they do. Their goal has to be to supplant DVD, at least to a degree, and they can't begin to accomplish that until prices come down. That's a fair amount of pressure, if you ask me.
Especially if they're still expecting do it within the next two years (counting down from the three year figure given by -- wasn't it Panasonic? -- last year) . . .
02-13-08 | 02:22 PM
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http://whathifi.com/hi-fi/archive/20...k-blu-ray.aspx
NEWS: Harman Kardon to back Blu-ray
Feb 13, 2008
It's day two here at the Harman Kardon product launch in Munich, and the company this morning confirmed it will release a standalone Blu-ray player at the IFA Show in Berlin this September, priced at £450-£500.
Details are still under wraps, but a spokesman for the company said it will also add further Blu-ray players to its line-up, including its all-in-one AV systems, next year.
Harman Kardon is also working on a Blu-ray/HDD recorder that can record up to eight channels of TV. The DVC 600 digital video entertainment centre (above) has a 1 Terabyte hard drive, twin built-in digital TV tuners and can record up to eight standard- or high-definition TV channels simultaneously.
What's more, a ninth channel can be recorded in the background using the manual or automatic timeshift function, and a tenth channel can be viewed at the same time. Quite when you might have time to watch all your recordings is another matter.
As standard the DVC 600 can play DVDs and CDs, while DVD and Blu-ray disc writers are optional. The unit can upscale video to 720p, and has a range of connections including DVI, USB and analogue audio and video sockets.
Other features include the ability to remove advertisements from recorded programmes, an instant replay function and seven EPG (Elecrtronic Programme Guide) modes.
For those who need less storage capacity, the DVC 300 model has a smaller 500GB hard drive.
However, neither is yet destined for the UK because they won't be compatible with Sky satellite TV until Harman Kardon and Sky resolve certain encryption issues.
Feb 13, 2008
It's day two here at the Harman Kardon product launch in Munich, and the company this morning confirmed it will release a standalone Blu-ray player at the IFA Show in Berlin this September, priced at £450-£500.
Details are still under wraps, but a spokesman for the company said it will also add further Blu-ray players to its line-up, including its all-in-one AV systems, next year.
Harman Kardon is also working on a Blu-ray/HDD recorder that can record up to eight channels of TV. The DVC 600 digital video entertainment centre (above) has a 1 Terabyte hard drive, twin built-in digital TV tuners and can record up to eight standard- or high-definition TV channels simultaneously.
What's more, a ninth channel can be recorded in the background using the manual or automatic timeshift function, and a tenth channel can be viewed at the same time. Quite when you might have time to watch all your recordings is another matter.
As standard the DVC 600 can play DVDs and CDs, while DVD and Blu-ray disc writers are optional. The unit can upscale video to 720p, and has a range of connections including DVI, USB and analogue audio and video sockets.
Other features include the ability to remove advertisements from recorded programmes, an instant replay function and seven EPG (Elecrtronic Programme Guide) modes.
For those who need less storage capacity, the DVC 300 model has a smaller 500GB hard drive.
However, neither is yet destined for the UK because they won't be compatible with Sky satellite TV until Harman Kardon and Sky resolve certain encryption issues.
02-13-08 | 02:32 PM
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From: A far green country
Harman Kardon is also working on a Blu-ray/HDD recorder that can record up to eight channels of TV. The DVC 600 digital video entertainment centre (above) has a 1 Terabyte hard drive, twin built-in digital TV tuners and can record up to eight standard- or high-definition TV channels simultaneously.
What's more, a ninth channel can be recorded in the background using the manual or automatic timeshift function, and a tenth channel can be viewed at the same time. Quite when you might have time to watch all your recordings is another matter.
What's more, a ninth channel can be recorded in the background using the manual or automatic timeshift function, and a tenth channel can be viewed at the same time. Quite when you might have time to watch all your recordings is another matter.
02-13-08 | 03:21 PM
#472
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So what's the status of Rendition on Blu-Ray? I didn't know it was coming out until I saw next week's ads. But no Blu-Ray in sight. The only news I could find was from a German release schedule (posted here and otherwhere). Any rumors of what's going on, or is this more likely an import to be?
02-13-08 | 03:48 PM
#473
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Originally Posted by RoboDad
And I thought I recorded too much TV. NINE CHANNELS??
02-13-08 | 04:01 PM
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From: SF Bay Area
Originally Posted by Drexl
I don't have DirecTV so I don't know how it works, but could that be used with that NFL Sunday Ticket thing to record every game?
02-13-08 | 04:03 PM
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From: The Phantom Zone
Originally Posted by RoboDad
And I thought I recorded too much TV. NINE CHANNELS??