But where are those dollars coming from? Toshiba (like Sony) is losing money on HD media/players in the hopes of recouping it in the long-run. How much more money is anyone involved with HD-DVD willing to lose? If there were some chance that it could win maybe, but I highly doubt their shareholders will stand for it....

Even though I'm too late to make my reply line up with your original quote, I must quote it. Firmware updates are great for things that are constantly connected to an internet connection. CE have ruined the whole idea of firmware updates, J6P has no idea how to hook up his TV to get a firmware update plus it's a pain for those of us who are technologically savvy. I feel it's an even more atrocious to release firmware updates to CE that are not universally acceptable (like needing 1GB of internal memory, I'm not picking on BR but this is the first one I thought of). I love my 360 but damn I do hate the constant updates for shoddy products.

Those 2 "news" stories do not explicitly state that Universal is gong blu. All they are "reporting" is that Universal's exclusive agreement with HD-DVD has ended. Just because there is another format does not mean Universal is required to release on that format following their deal expiring. All it means is that Universal can now release on any format it so chooses.

As for the digital downloads. I will disclose up front I am 26 and have for the most part stopped purchasing CDs a couple of years ago. I have purchased 2 songs from iTunes in 10 months. (My overall lack of purchases is mostly due the lack of new quality music I like. And no not Beethoven) I prefer to purchase whole CDs of artists I like because of the quality I get when I rip it in using lossless. The compression to 128 kbps is greater than some may expect. The individual songs that pique my interest are iTunes purchases. If/when iTunes offers a monthly subscription at a reasonable price, I will immediately join. Just as when Netflix offers HD movie rentals via a variety of sources (one of the hopes of the Netflix CEO joining the MS board was the 360 being such a device) , I will join when the prices are reasonable. The only reason I do not download my movies and TV shows from XBox Live is the cost is too prohibitive. The days of me amassing physical media are gone because I find it entirely too expensive and space wasting for my tastes. I would rather send a movie back to Netflix and wait 2 days to watch the next one. Does that mean I will no longer purchase movies? No, I have purchased a handful of movies since I joined Netflix. Digital Distribution will destroy rentals if a renting model is used but will fail if a purchase model is used. There is a reason why Netflix is getting out in front of the Digital Distribution wave. The ultimate end is movies on a server, my music is already on one that is streamed throughout my house. I will say that due to the current constraints of 802.11g, the experience is slow moving 300 MB CDs to and from the server. It takes nearly 20 minutes to rip it using iTunes. Playback is bufferless for the most part. Filling a 4GB iPod takes an hour. Once 802.11n becomes fully functional and finalized you will see a large influx of network attached storage devices and playback devices. It is funny that the speed of the internet came up in this discussion. There was an article on how the US has gone from the internet leader to on-par with 3rd world nations not that long ago on either MSNBC or Cnet and how this was severely hindering the American public. There's all this hope that Internet2 will resolve all of those problems but we will see. Once 802.11n is rolled out fairly well and the internet is up to par with more developed countries, the digital distribution debate should begin. Until then it's all a pipe-dream. Physical media will never completely die just like digital distribution will never succeed to the heights people are predicting. The end will fall in between. As for the cheap internet, the US sucks. I'm trying to remember where I saw it and I think it was the same story as the speed tests and I'm beginning to think it was a 60 minutes thing because I think I remember interviews. Anyway... people throughout the world are able to get internet delivered to their homes 5 to 10 times faster than in the US for less than 1/3 of the cost. I remember something about the people of France getting one of those 3 bundles for less than $70 with better components. Shouldn't we be spending our time on improving our technology to match that of France instead of picking new names for Freedom Fries?

Those stories don't say what's going to happen, sure, but Universal would be a bit foolish to stick around with HD-DVD now, wouldn't they? I'm an HD-DVD supporter but at this point, I don't see universal sticking with HD-DVD.

I dunno... I just feel like there is going to be one last huge salvo fired by the HD DVD side.

I do too, but I wouldn't be sad to see that logo at the top go away once the HD DVD software disappears from shelves.

I agree. While it is the natural progression of thought to assume that if they are not exclusive, then they must have plans to launch on BD, but that is not what the article indicates, and until Universal makes an official announcement, the status quo is still in effect.

Speculate away, but don't present speculation as fact. That is something both sides have been guilty of for months.

They may pull out of HDM all together, if they feel like they can't turn a profit.

The title of this piece sounds a hell of a lot more optimistic about things than most of us here.

Variety: Universal exclusive contract with HD DVD is over

You're JOKING! We have never seen this story before! Especially not on page 17 of this very thread...

I don't see it, I'm only showing 12 pages in this thread.

Probably... and it will be equally misplaced as claims of betrayal are now. It has become pretty obvious (to me anyways) that most of those who are in this format war didn't really expect there to be a loser (in the disappearing sense)... but that both formats would continue to co-exist. That belief is completely unreasonable.

Wow, will these same people be claiming this Universal situation means nothing also feel the same about a candidate dropping out of a two person race come this November? For a short time it could be said that the other candidate hasn't won until the election folks officially declare a winner, but in a contest win only two real options, one situation does result in the other without question.

This isnt a "Dewey Wins" scenario. Nobody is projecting anything here, only going with the facts. Unless it's a factual error, in these cases an end of a exclusive contract only has one meaning. That the studio will at the very least manufacture both formats. I don't see anybody claiming when it will definitively start or that anybody will switch and be exclusively Blu. In other words, they are sticking with the facts.

If you want to dispute the facts, go for it. But I don't see anybody disputing that these exclusive contracts are ending. Unless the word exclusive suddently has a different meaning, the flip side of an exclusive contract ending is quite clear.

I agree. Given the total lack of promises by anybody that both formats would be supported for any length of time, I find these comments aobut the studios totally ridiculous.

This is a piece of entertainment equipment, not a car. I can see people being upset that a car would no longer be supported by the manufacturer, but not a DVD player. It's not like the players and discs are defective, they just will no longer be made.

Nobody is claiming it means nothing. The problem is when people draw inappropriate and overreaching conclusions based on a set of incomplete data (read: thread entitled "Universal Going Blu"). Just for reference, it was reported that WB's BDA membership lapsed at the end of October, I believe. This fueled nutty rumors over on AVS for a few weeks. In the end, it meant nothing. Ultimately, Universal's contractual end with HD DVD means only one thing: they are free to stop producing HD DVD's. Since Universal has no financial interest (patent interest such as WB) in the success of BD relative to HD DVD, it may very well release nothing on Blu Ray until the market matures, especially given the low sales volume to this point. Do I think this is likely? Not particularly. But it's about as certain an outcome as "Universal to release on Blu" based on our current data set.

took the words out of my mouth. it's not that it means nothing. it's just that it does not explicitly mean that which some have claimed it does. that kind of thing has been happening on both sides since the format war started and it's extremely tiring.

The only people overreaching IMO are the ones trying to tell people there is nothing to see here. The conclusion is a given since in this case the flip side of exclusive only has one meaning.

If people want to step in and join the studios in these word games, be my guest. But it doesn't mean anybody else is wrong for refusing to play with you.

Wow -- I guess I've been told!

Look, I posted the news originally because it has to do with the current state of affairs at Warner, about whom this thread primarily seems to be devoted. My "theory" was really nothing more than wild-eyed conjecture, no different than much of what goes on here already. The only real difference being that I never really expected it to be taken seriously, which, apparently, you did, even in spite of the "wink" in my previous post. I apologize for having been so vague.

That Reuters article sounds more optimistic because a lot of the quotes are from retailers... Retailers who don't want a FLOOD OF RETURNS on recently purchased HD DVD players and discs... The average person who just got an HD DVD player probably isn't keeping up on news like we do, so this kind of story might be the only one they see... and it won't send them into a panic and retailers won't lose money...

I know I knew you were joking, but it did get me thinking. WHo knew what, and when? Sure gives those awesome sales on HD-DVD players at the end of the year a new meaning. If somebody was to put on their tin foil hat and go nuts they could wonder if these retailers knew something was coming.

This is just anecdotal evidence but I have a friend who is the media supervisor of the Galleria Best Buy in Houston which is one of the bigger ones in the greater Houston area. I asked him if there was any adverse reaction to the Warner announcement and he said they have been getting an unusual amount of returns for hd-dvd as "christmas returns". I asked him if it also applied to players but he said he did not know about that.
Whether this has to to do with the warner shift or uninformed buyers, I have no idea.

no matter how much you want it to be, variety reporting that universal's HD DVD-exclusive agreement has ended is not the same thing as universal announcing blu-ray releases. will universal do that at some point? it is highly likely. do you know that with absolute certainty? no. that's called speculation.

additionally, your logic is flawed. an exclusivity agreement ending does not have just one flip side. it simply means universal now has the freedom to release whatever they want. they could continue to exclusively release on HD DVD. they could release on Blu-ray and HD DVD. they could drop HD DVD and release on Blu-ray only. there are many possibilities based on the reported "facts" and educated speculation suggests they will release on Blu-ray soon, but that is still speculation until universal gives an official announcement.

that's been my whole point. speculation treated as absolute fact is an obnoxious exercise in this format war and i'm not going to miss it. don't get me wrong - i firmly believe, along with you, that universal will be releasing on blu-ray soon (within the year at the very least), but i'm not going to present that as a fact until universal announces it.

Interesting that everybody telling others their logic is "flawed" is sneaking in disclaimers that they agree since the conclusion IS there for everybody to see. Nobody willing step up and say that an other conclusion will happen. Just a bunch of wordplay and hot air.

It's now obvious, that what I guess is two sides here, will never agree. I'll end my posts on this subject with this;

I'm glad that the people writing these acrticles, and the people posting them here, are not afraid of the backlash from people who want join the studios in their word games.

I would rather see these articles give the facts as we know them now rather than wait for what some people seem to want to see happen. Wait until the final anouncement, after they ahve purchased countless more of HD-DVDs. Then they can whine even more than the studios did them wrong. They can claim that Universal didn't tell them that they were switching till (enter date months from now), and it's Universal's fault that they bought (insert movie here) on HD-DVD when they could have waited to get it on Blu-Ray later in the year. Unbelievable, but maybe that's just me.

Exactly. There are four options, three of which many people are completely discounting. The first is that they renew their contract with HD DVD (unlikely IMO) , the second is that they go with BD (possible), the third is that they back both (most likely IMO) and the fourth is that they step away from HDM all together.

The problem with a lot of these opinions dressed as stories is that there are nuggets of news in them. If Obama drops out tomorrow does that mean Hillary wins? Maybe, but someone else could come along and win too. So the story would be "Obama drops out," not "Hillary wins." The twisting of fact to suit a preference and presenting of opinion as fact has got to stop.