Will HD DVD have an answer to the "W" bomb?
01-09-08 | 02:16 PM
#152
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So here Salon puts in their declaration based on the "W" bomb:
http://machinist.salon.com/blog/2008/01/08/dvd_format/
http://machinist.salon.com/blog/2008/01/08/dvd_format/
Sony | 2008.01.08 • 14:12 EST
Peace is at hand in the pointless DVD war
Whether you should buy a Blu-ray Disc player or an HD DVD player -- two competing next-generation video disc formats -- or both or neither is the question that the consumer electronics industry believes you're wrestling with at the moment.
(In truth, you're not wrestling with this question; the question is unimportant to you, because next-gen disc formats aren't on your mind, because right now, if you're thinking about technology at all, you're most likely thinking about the TV you ought to buy.)
But the parenthetical clause notwithstanding, here you are, in the CE industry's view, agonizing over this decision. But this is your lucky year, because the multinational media corporations of the world have decided to save your ass from that terrible fork in the road. The multinational corporations of the world, you see, have decided. The Blu-ray format, made by Sony, wins.
Last week Warner Brothers announced that it will abandon Toshiba's HD DVD format and, in May, will release its films in Blu-ray.
The move left Paramount and Universal Studios as the only two big movie houses sticking with HD DVD -- and now, reports the Financial Times, Paramount is also jumping ship to Blu-ray (its partner Dreamworks Animation is likely to come along as well).
Because Paramount is set to release a slate of big films this year -- including the new "Indiana Jones" -- its defection from HD DVD would be a big blow.
So now HD DVD just has Universal, but how long can that last? To all you folks who bought an HD DVD player -- whether a stand-alone version or one with your XBox 360 -- you may now prepare for imminent obsolescence.
But isn't it nice to declare the end to at least one war?
Peace is at hand in the pointless DVD war
Whether you should buy a Blu-ray Disc player or an HD DVD player -- two competing next-generation video disc formats -- or both or neither is the question that the consumer electronics industry believes you're wrestling with at the moment.
(In truth, you're not wrestling with this question; the question is unimportant to you, because next-gen disc formats aren't on your mind, because right now, if you're thinking about technology at all, you're most likely thinking about the TV you ought to buy.)
But the parenthetical clause notwithstanding, here you are, in the CE industry's view, agonizing over this decision. But this is your lucky year, because the multinational media corporations of the world have decided to save your ass from that terrible fork in the road. The multinational corporations of the world, you see, have decided. The Blu-ray format, made by Sony, wins.
Last week Warner Brothers announced that it will abandon Toshiba's HD DVD format and, in May, will release its films in Blu-ray.
The move left Paramount and Universal Studios as the only two big movie houses sticking with HD DVD -- and now, reports the Financial Times, Paramount is also jumping ship to Blu-ray (its partner Dreamworks Animation is likely to come along as well).
Because Paramount is set to release a slate of big films this year -- including the new "Indiana Jones" -- its defection from HD DVD would be a big blow.
So now HD DVD just has Universal, but how long can that last? To all you folks who bought an HD DVD player -- whether a stand-alone version or one with your XBox 360 -- you may now prepare for imminent obsolescence.
But isn't it nice to declare the end to at least one war?
01-09-08 | 02:34 PM
#153
Banned by request
Originally Posted by sracer
And there wouldn't have been a war (or at least a much shorter war) if everyone avoided buying EITHER format. If people exercised a bit of self-control, both sides would've found out real quick that they better work things out and come to a consensus.
01-09-08 | 02:47 PM
#154
DVD Talk Legend
Originally Posted by Suprmallet
Or they would have said, "Oh, clearly NOBODY wants HDM, no matter what we call it, so let's spend our money on something else." Then we'd all be SOL.
01-09-08 | 03:31 PM
#156
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Originally Posted by Jericho
I don't really understand the argument here. Isn't the point of business to sell your stuff and make money? And isn't Sony trying to make more money by developing formats like SACD and Blu-Ray? And aren't they just telling consumers stuff so they buy their products (as well as the studios).
Didn't they try to enforce Betamax, Minidisc, UMD, Memory Stick, AMTRAC (MP3 Walkman anyone?) and now Blu-Ray? All standards that would have given Sony tons of money and consumers not a lot of choice.
That IMO is the main reason a lot of people don't like Sony and thus the Blu-Ray format.
Personally, I think the fanboys on both sides are amusing: who really cares in the end? I have a XA2 and will go purple soon. Big deal. If this is the end to the format war: good. I will keep my XA2 for upconverting and playing the 30 HD DVDs that I own, and will purchase a BR this year when hopefully some sort of profile standard will be finalized (1.1? 2.0?).
But that doesn't mean I like Sony's business practices that are going on for 20-30 years to monopolize standards.
Last edited by exm; 01-09-08 at 03:39 PM.
01-09-08 | 04:09 PM
#157
DVD Talk Legend
Originally Posted by exm
Absolutely true! I can't blame Sony for trying, but as a consumer I am blaming them for a continuous push to enforce THEIR own standards. Think about it.
Didn't they try to enforce Betamax, Minidisc, UMD, Memory Stick, AMTRAC (MP3 Walkman anyone?) and now Blu-Ray? All standards that would have given Sony tons of money and consumers not a lot of choice.
That IMO is the main reason a lot of people don't like Sony and thus the Blu-Ray format.
Personally, I think the fanboys on both sides are amusing: who really cares in the end? I have a XA2 and will go purple soon. Big deal. If this is the end to the format war: good. I will keep my XA2 for upconverting and playing the 30 HD DVDs that I own, and will purchase a BR this year when hopefully some sort of profile standard will be finalized (1.1? 2.0?).
But that doesn't mean I like Sony's business practices that are going on for 20-30 years to monopolize standards.
Didn't they try to enforce Betamax, Minidisc, UMD, Memory Stick, AMTRAC (MP3 Walkman anyone?) and now Blu-Ray? All standards that would have given Sony tons of money and consumers not a lot of choice.
That IMO is the main reason a lot of people don't like Sony and thus the Blu-Ray format.
Personally, I think the fanboys on both sides are amusing: who really cares in the end? I have a XA2 and will go purple soon. Big deal. If this is the end to the format war: good. I will keep my XA2 for upconverting and playing the 30 HD DVDs that I own, and will purchase a BR this year when hopefully some sort of profile standard will be finalized (1.1? 2.0?).
But that doesn't mean I like Sony's business practices that are going on for 20-30 years to monopolize standards.
Sony does what they do in an effort to make money on royalties. And people are free not to like them. I get that and have no problem if people feel that way. Me? I'm a free market person, so I have no problem if someone wants to try something else. The market will decide. Beta might have been a superior product to VHS, but market forces dictated it wouldn't last.I believe Blu-Ray to be a better product than HD DVD in the long run (assuming all the features get ironed out), and to some extent their winning will benefit consumers with a better product. But if people hate Blu-Ray as an extension of Sony, so be it. And yeah, Sony make have levergaed their gaming division and cash backing to help win this war, but they have every right to do so.
I don't know why people get so worked up about it or are so emotional. I try to stay even keeled, but I also try to point out what I think is true. And there's been a lot of BS and spin in this thing from both sides. So sometimes I get accused of leaning red or sometimes leaning blu, but I don't believe that I do. I just try to represent a neutral, truthful view.
01-09-08 | 04:11 PM
#158
DVD Talk Limited Edition
Originally Posted by Suprmallet
Or they would have said, "Oh, clearly NOBODY wants HDM, no matter what we call it, so let's spend our money on something else." Then we'd all be SOL.
01-09-08 | 08:56 PM
#159
Originally Posted by sracer
Doubtful. The inability of LD to reach escape velocity into the mainstream didn't stop DVDs from coming into existence.
Today, with the rapid fall in the price of Blu-ray players likely coming over the course of 2008 and with most new TV sales of units that have HDMI inputs, the market for HDM players will start to really take off, especially now that we may have a resolution to the HDM format wars very soon.
01-09-08 | 09:47 PM
#160
DVD Talk Legend
Originally Posted by RayChuang
DVD advanced with 480p video, which resulted in sharp pictures even with lower-cost players (Laserdisc could offer great picture quality but you needed expensive players that had video comb filtering to do this).
Last edited by darkside; 01-09-08 at 09:55 PM.
01-09-08 | 10:20 PM
#161
DVD Talk Limited Edition
Originally Posted by RayChuang
The biggest problem with the Laserdisc format was that the discs were quite large (the size of standard LP's!), which made storage space a problem for large collections. But when DVD's came out, the vastly smaller size of DVD packaging meant you could store much more DVD's in the same storage space. And more importantly, DVD advanced with 480p video, which resulted in sharp pictures even with lower-cost players (Laserdisc could offer great picture quality but you needed expensive players that had video comb filtering to do this).
01-09-08 | 10:55 PM
#162
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What hooked me on laserdisc was widescreen. Pure and simple.
Sure, when DVD came out people commented on how I "wasted my money". The way I see it though, I was enjoying widescreen movies with great picture YEARS before they were.
Sure, when DVD came out people commented on how I "wasted my money". The way I see it though, I was enjoying widescreen movies with great picture YEARS before they were.
01-11-08 | 08:39 AM
#163
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Originally Posted by whomod
What hooked me on laserdisc was widescreen. Pure and simple.
Sure, when DVD came out people commented on how I "wasted my money". The way I see it though, I was enjoying widescreen movies with great picture YEARS before they were.
Sure, when DVD came out people commented on how I "wasted my money". The way I see it though, I was enjoying widescreen movies with great picture YEARS before they were.
I no longer have a player but still some laserdiscs. Kinda cool to show off
01-11-08 | 09:14 AM
#164
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Originally Posted by whomod
Sure, when DVD came out people commented on how I "wasted my money". The way I see it though, I was enjoying widescreen movies with great picture YEARS before they were.
01-12-08 | 08:40 AM
#165
Originally Posted by Adam Tyner
The funny thing is that my family bought our first Laserdisc player in 1984 and had somewhere around 125 discs in total when it was all said and done, but only a tiny, tiny handful were widescreen.
Widedscreen came later. I remember Criterions "Bladerunner" getting big buzz when it came out. I also recall Woody Allen's "Manhattan" being an early wide release.
01-12-08 | 08:59 AM
#166
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Upon my advice, a friend in HS bought one in 1988. I didn't have money for one, but definitely wanted the increased quality. None of the discs he bought were in widescreen. IMO, I got in at the right time. It was 1990 and I was in college. Walking through the mall, I saw Star Wars playing in widescreen. For Christmas, I got a low end Pioneer and a pretty decent Mitsibishi 27" TV that still works today. By 1998 I had about 50 widescreen LDs and had rented many great Criterions.
Never felt I wasted money on that format. I always thought my movie buff friends buying VHS were wasting money. That became easy to do with Suncoast coming in the malls in the mid 90s.
Never felt I wasted money on that format. I always thought my movie buff friends buying VHS were wasting money. That became easy to do with Suncoast coming in the malls in the mid 90s.
01-12-08 | 11:39 AM
#167
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Originally Posted by Pizza
Widedscreen came later. I remember Criterions "Bladerunner" getting big buzz when it came out. I also recall Woody Allen's "Manhattan" being an early wide release.
It was not to long after Seiskel & Ebert did a special edition of their show on widescreen and laserdisc. I remember they showed the difference between the Pan&scan VHS of Indiana Jones & The Temple Of Doom vs the widescreen laserdisc version. After that demonstration, I wasn't going to rest until I had one of those players!
If I recall, that show came on sometime in the early 90's, possibly 91-92.
01-16-08 | 08:24 PM
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Originally Posted by sentineles
Sadly they will not. I am red b/c of unratified standards and the lack of a quality, affordable, future-proof player. The reason I have not purchased a PS3 for my BR needs is b/c from what I understand the PS3 does not support any HD audio or does not support it well thus far. I doubt that is something that can be updated via a firmware update. Do I have anything for HD audio? No but it will be part of my next HT upgrade. The DRM and region coding for BR does not concern me as much as the other issues. All I really want is to be able to rip the media to a server and stream it throughout my house. Something I have not explored yet but I understand both are/were capable of handling... thank you Wi-Fi alliance.
I wish more people would realize the format war was like all "wars" not involving human life. One side wins, the other loses but the whole is better for the fight. I do not think BD 2.0 would have been pushed out as quickly as it has if not for HD-DVD. I doubt BD prices can be justifiably increased after the war ends, so HD-DVD helped bring the prices down. There are 2 deciding factors in this for everyone: The trojan horse called a PS3 and studio support. If all studios had been neutral, HD-DVD may have prevailed due to the price point and the ratified standard. Sony made the smartest play of all by signing as many studios as they did, even 1 of going neutral may have altered the outcome.
I wish more people would realize the format war was like all "wars" not involving human life. One side wins, the other loses but the whole is better for the fight. I do not think BD 2.0 would have been pushed out as quickly as it has if not for HD-DVD. I doubt BD prices can be justifiably increased after the war ends, so HD-DVD helped bring the prices down. There are 2 deciding factors in this for everyone: The trojan horse called a PS3 and studio support. If all studios had been neutral, HD-DVD may have prevailed due to the price point and the ratified standard. Sony made the smartest play of all by signing as many studios as they did, even 1 of going neutral may have altered the outcome.
01-16-08 | 08:30 PM
#169
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Originally Posted by Parasol Stars
I really dont understand how people keep saying they prefer HD DVD better because the players were so much cheaper. Didnt the players only get really cheap recently?
01-16-08 | 09:06 PM
#170
DVD Talk Legend
Originally Posted by whomod
That was around the time I made the jump.
It was not to long after Seiskel & Ebert did a special edition of their show on widescreen and laserdisc. I remember they showed the difference between the Pan&scan VHS of Indiana Jones & The Temple Of Doom vs the widescreen laserdisc version. After that demonstration, I wasn't going to rest until I had one of those players!
If I recall, that show came on sometime in the early 90's, possibly 91-92.
It was not to long after Seiskel & Ebert did a special edition of their show on widescreen and laserdisc. I remember they showed the difference between the Pan&scan VHS of Indiana Jones & The Temple Of Doom vs the widescreen laserdisc version. After that demonstration, I wasn't going to rest until I had one of those players!
If I recall, that show came on sometime in the early 90's, possibly 91-92.
01-16-08 | 09:46 PM
#171
Originally Posted by Adam Tyner
The funny thing is that my family bought our first Laserdisc player in 1984 and had somewhere around 125 discs in total when it was all said and done, but only a tiny, tiny handful were widescreen.
I said, "Wow."
And then about six months later some guys came and repossessed all the equipment my dad apparently never paid for.
I also said, "Wow."
01-17-08 | 07:48 AM
#172
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Originally Posted by DVD Polizei
I remember when my dad amazingly had the cash to buy an LD player, large TV, and the first LD I watched was Star Trek: The Motion Picture.
I said, "Wow."
And then about six months later some guys came and repossessed all the equipment my dad apparently never paid for.
I also said, "Wow."
I said, "Wow."
And then about six months later some guys came and repossessed all the equipment my dad apparently never paid for.
I also said, "Wow."
01-17-08 | 08:04 AM
#173
DVD Talk Godfather
Originally Posted by Parasol Stars
I really dont understand how people keep saying they prefer HD DVD better because the players were so much cheaper. Didnt the players only get really cheap recently? My brother Drexl paid $400 dollars for his HD DVD player when he got his, which was early on.
01-17-08 | 08:36 AM
#174
DVD Talk Hero
Originally Posted by MBoyd
Never felt I wasted money on that format. I always thought my movie buff friends buying VHS were wasting money. That became easy to do with Suncoast coming in the malls in the mid 90s.
I remember renting Pulp Fiction with my friends so many times the rental store guy just sold it to us for $20.
01-17-08 | 09:12 AM
#175
Originally Posted by DVD Polizei
I remember when my dad amazingly had the cash to buy an LD player, large TV, and the first LD I watched was Star Trek: The Motion Picture.
I said, "Wow."
And then about six months later some guys came and repossessed all the equipment my dad apparently never paid for.
I also said, "Wow."
I said, "Wow."
And then about six months later some guys came and repossessed all the equipment my dad apparently never paid for.
I also said, "Wow."
