I totally agree...

Ok, so you like splitting all the stuff out of Other so that you never have to go to Other? What about those of us who like sports, music, and books, and thought it was nice having one place to go?

The more you split off other, the worse it becomes (generally), IMO.

Everything that has been split off is now discussed more than when it was part of Other, so if you like discussing music, video games, etc. you should be thrilled with the new forums. Isn't it better to have to read a few forums on the same site if it means there are more discussions, and better discussions, on the topics you like to talk about, rather than having fewer discussions on them all crammed into one cluttered forum? Plus you have less dorks who don't care about the topic posting off-topic crap in the threads.

I like coming to DVD Talk to discuss DVD's, Movies, Music, Video Games, TV, Sports etc. and I think it saves time to have a specific are for each one. It makes it easy to find the threads I want to post in and it fosters more discussion on the topics. I think it takes less time to skim a few forums, than it used to take to skim through page after page of crap that doesn't interest me in Other to find one or two threads on music or video games. Now I just go to those forums and see if there are any new threads. Plus stuff stays on the front page long enough that everyone that might be intersted in that topic will get to see it.

As I've always said in these discussions. Splitting something off doesn't change what's be discussed, or who's discussing it. The same topics will get posted by the same people, they'll just be easier to find and stay on the front page long enough to generate some decent discussions. It's a win-win situation.

The argument that eventually there will be nothing left for other is kind of silly too. The forum is 90% conversation threads, advice threads, news threads, and debate threads. That's what Other should be for. In other words, sports is the last thing that needs it's own forum. Take it out, and other will pretty much be the same.

Other hasn't suffered from TV, Books, Music or Video Games being taken out, and discussion on those topics has thrived in the new forums. In truth other has improved as it was made less cluttered. The same would be true if sports gets it's own forum. It's a win-win situation.

What about those of us who don't and didn't? I guess we can't make everyone happy, but I do think that Sports deserves its own thread ... but then you're right -- where do you draw the line? Are we then going to then have a "Sex-related" forum and a "Twikoff-related" forum? It could potentially never end!

I sure would have liked to have voted in that poll though that was alluded to above -- I would have voted for Sports to have its own thread above all the other options.

Agree totally, polls of this kind need to be "stickies" in the forums. Many people (including myself) are bookmarked into the forum area.

I also agree that a sports forum would draw a lot of interest. Geoff, try posting this poll in all forums and I would bet money that you would get a much different result...

I enjoy the WWF too, but there would still be a debate whether it belongs in Sports, TV, or Otter.... But then again that is a fun debate...

Just my 2 pennies...

bump for das


arguements against: dont want to take another section out of other.

arguements for: most of the people that post in the sports threads, are annoyed that everything has to be restricted into single threads.. but if seperate threads were created for all sports related topics we would like to discuss, it would overrun the other forum...


the general arguement is not to take them out, because they are fine where they are at.. but I dont think Im alone in feeling that most of the dvdtalk sports fans would like to be able to have individual threads for most of the stories, rather then trying to keep everything tied up in specific 'one and only' type threads.

Since you went to the effort, I'll post some comments.

People who don't want sports (or other popular topics) moved are just lazy. Other is for "other", not "everything." If I want to talk TV, I go to TV Talk. If I want to talk movies, I go to Movie Talk. If I want to talk sports, I have to find page 7 of some "Daily Thread" that discusses 30 different games all at once. It's absurd.

If I want to talk about crazy obscure stuff that has no obvious grouping, that's when I go to Otter, because it's "other." I know I'm not the only one who rarely discusses sports because it's such a hassle. And I cannot bring up a sports-related topic without it getting buried beneath genuine Otter topics. If all sports topics are supposed to be confined to daily threads, then what is the possible benefit of them being in Otter? Either let us run wild through Otter like every other topic gets to do, or give us our own forum. We don't have a daily "Stupid Crap That Nobody Cares About" thread ... that's what Otter is to begin with.

A Sports Forum would thrive if split off instead of being suffocated in Otter. I loathe the thought of another baseball season of 30 discussions going on at the same time every day.

das

I agree with you Das, for the most part. I think that one (maybe two) general topics could be pulled from otter. Sports is the big one.

My reasoning is as follows.

The nature of sports threads dictates a lot of posts.

--With book talk it is usful for it to have it's own little forum because by nature the posts are more relaxed. It is a slower forum but one that is looked at. When book topics were in other they were simply lost.

--While Sports is the opposite of this - I find it the very reason sports should have their own area. The amounts of sporting events of interest are HUGE. It would be very nice to get a thread for each, but they die quickly. Each day there are so many events that the front page would be filled with them if it weren't relegated to one and only type threads. One and only are VERY problematic. Most people don't bother joining the discussion when it hits page 3-4 if they weren't in it prior. Furthermore, I don't think that people really understand what they can or cannot post about. There is just simply too much for one thread and people don't try.

eh, I lost my train of thought and do not remember my next thought on this subject. Anyhow, I think that this is good enough.

If there were a Sports Forum, would you expect there to be 32 separate threads for Round 1 of the NCCA Men's Basketball Tournament? I can see you sitting there with 4 different threads open at once, updating what's happening in each game in progress.

I would think that situations like that would still need to go into a single thread no matter where that thread is.

I'm not against having a Sports Forum. I'm sure it would be popular, but maybe it would be too popular. Would you really want 90+ threads about the St. Louis Cardinals regular season games?

Would NASCAR threads be moved to Sports? How about pro bowling, pro billiards, hunting, and fishing? If I want to talk about taking Tae Kwon Do, would I post about it in Sports? Would wrestling threads go in TV Talk, Other, or Sports?

For the most part, the General Discussion forums have fairly clear definitions:

Book Talk- talk about books
TV Talk - talk about TV shows
Video Game Talk - talk about console or PC games
Music Talk - talk about music

Where would the line be drawn for Sports Talk? Only talk about televised sporting events(if that's the case, they could go in TV Talk)? Since sport is "physical activity that is governed by a set of rules or customs and often engaged in competitively," would chess be a sport? Would dating be a sport? I can see the "Why was my thread moved?" posts now.

nope.. i wouldnt expect to see 32 seperate threads.. but having everything combined into 1, gets pretty rough..
there are definitly several games that deserve there own threads.. and several teams that have enough of a following, they could have their own team..
and we tend to toss pretty big sports news into these threads, when alot of time, they would be better off in its own thread and getting better discussion..
I think it would still be best to have a single thread for tournaments, for general chatter.. but not have the limitation of not being able to open seperate threads for the games of more interest.. of course the moderation would have to be rather loose, to decide which threads to leave alone rather then trying to combine with other threads.. but I think this could be handled pretty easily once guidelines were set down.
what would be considered a sport? I think we could all come to a pretty good understanding on what is considered worthy of going in a sports forum.. basketball, hockey, baseball, football, of course.. and I feel that if there is a seperate sports forum, it should also include golf, tennis, la crosse, rugby, soccer, wrestling, etc... I was thinking about this also.. I think it would be best to have a sticky thread to explain where the limitations lie.. and if someone feels that a real sport is being excluded, they can bring up the arguement.. chess would be a sport (unless you consider it a game), but I doubt we would have a rush for chess discussion just 'physical contact' would not constitute a sport.. we wouldnt allow for such a broad definition where it means dating, sex, girl watching, etc.. would be considered a sport.. basically, I guess we would be limiting it to the generally accepted sports.. ones you would see on espn, cnnsi, etc..
I dont think we would have much trouble getting people to agree on the definition of sport, and which ones are included.

ideas for what would go into a sports forum:


single threads for tournaments and bigger events

seperate threads for larger games

seperate threads for trades and other player rumors

information on status of different sport changes and franchise moves

general sports news

injury reports

fantasy league threads

individual team threads (such as bfranks constant laker threads )



looking in the other forum.. I dont think it would remove a whole lot of content from that forum.. but it would definitly allow for in depth discussion in alot of areas that we currently dont go into because we dont want to overrun the other forum..

I guess the grey area is.. do you also include sports cards.. sports memorabilia, etc.. discussion

Anything that requires physical exertion in a structured competetive atmosphere would go in sports and anything that surrounds that, such as pools, memorobilia, etc. Billiards, NASCAR, etc would all qualify. Chess, Bridge, etc are "games." We could make it Sports and Games if people want that.

I hate to throw the "fair" word around, but to me, it seems like there are only two fair scenarios:

1) Sports discussion gets to run wild in Otter like everyone else does.
2) Sports discussion gets its own forum.

If sports discussion is so distracting in Otter that it has to be condensed into these daily threads, then it follows that the discussion should have its own forum. Nothing against anyone here, but this double standard we have for sports is really silly, IMO.

das

I would also like to see a sports forum. I don't know what goes into making one here, but I don't know why people would have an argument to not have one. There are a lot of posters that post on the sports threads. Having a sports only forum would make things a lot easier to keep up with and like someone else has mentioned would increase the number of posts.

Whoever talked about those wanting Sports to stay in other are just being lazy hit it exactly for me. For example, I used to participate in music threads all the time, but now that they were moved to its own forum, I think I've checked there once to participate in a Rush thread. "Other" is so big that I simply don't have time to jump to other forums as well. But I think if sports got its own forum, I'd venture over often.

Consider this: DVDTalk forums seem to be about DVDs and other media (not news, but medium plural). Sports isn't a medium. So you're setting a bad precedent perhaps.

As for having to combine topics into one thread, I don't mind it that much.

The biggest benefit I can see, and the only real positive I can see is that we can have many more threads about lesser items. There are many times I want to start a sports thread, but then I don't because I 1) don't want to clutter, and 2) don't know if enough people will care to justify having a separate thread. If I think it'll only get 1 or 2 responses, I don't bother. Plus in a sports forum, those types of threads won't be on page 4 in 2 hours...

So I vote in favor of a forum.

Never saw that poll though (I actually link straight to the *other* forum, not just the list of forums)...

It's been a while since I've thought of this, but I still don't think I'm in favor of a separate forum for sports.

There are plenty of sports boards out there....I go to the Other sports threads during certain events, because I know certain people will be there.....you can count them on two hands. But then I love it when someone completely surprises you by posting their team/opinion/affiliation..... that's what makes it great.

I initially was against a separate music forum, but I'm OK with it now....I know my threads will be there for days, maybe months. There is not a sense of urgency with music as there is with a sports thread. But the thing that bothers me with the music forum is that DTSC and I are the only regular otter posters there.

I don't think "laziness" really has much to do with it. If being lazy is not wanting to move the mouse an extra inch or two, you've got issues, and probably need your own little forum waaaaaaay outside dvdtalk.

Sports is a subject of interest, the same as "This chick is hot", or "Please help me with my relationship." I really don't care to see the forums fractured any further. Other is a realitively rapid-fire forum, where I know that I will find something of interest every time I enter....it keeps me coming back. Honestly, I click on the DVD talk forum once every couple of weeks or so, and I get caught up in about ten minutes. (Geoff, I still purchase through this site )

Do these need their own forums?:
Ebay question
Relationship help
Girlies in thongs
Political
Tax questions
Letters to the editor
jokes

It's not enought to make me leave, but it's my opinion, nonetheless.

There are currently seven sports related topics on the first page alone. I know this can change quickly but there is always numerous sports threads going.

Look what made the other fun was the daily banter about any topic. Its fun to chat with other regulars there - for me that is what the other is. If we strip off every topic in its own forum we have no need for the other forum. THis could be fine also but I think this is a minority view if you asked just this question in the other.

i agree that the more we take out of other, the less fun it will be.. but its not like we dont still have millions of other things we talk about in there.. there is no doubt that point is valid..

but the arguement is.. that as membership has grown.. more and more people are participating in the sports threads.. and Im pretty sure that most of them are not satisfied with the idea that the number of sports topics should be limited to keep from overrunning the forum.. or worry that lesser sports topics wont get any attention before sliding off the front page in the busy other forum..

Just to reiterate. Membership has grown significantly! More and more people are venturing into other, and they are very willing to start threads.

I don't think that the argument stands that other will dwindle. Specific topics will cease to exist there, yes, but an influx of threads will STILL happen. I highly doubt other will slow down, although, I do think slowing down a bit would be helpful for other. Right now it's far to crammed.

exactly.. with there currently being almost 150,000 posts in other.. even after cleaning out the forums.. I dont think anyone has to worry about that forum slowing down at all..
other is one of the few forums where you can sit there and hit refresh all day long, and on every refresh, there will be at least one new post (sunday mornings excluded of course )

I believe DarkElf stated this already, but just as a reminder, the greatest resistance to creating a Sports forum is a desire to not have too many forums, and to not dilute the focus of the site too much.

Now before everyone starts shouting Book Talk , remember that that forum was started quite a long time ago when we didn't have as many forums. I think Video Game Talk was created at the same time, but it was more inspired by a side project Geoff had already been working on. TV and Music talk have since been added, but in a site that concentrates on DVD, movies and home theater, these two fit in with our general subject matter, or future subject matter (HDTV for example and Music Talk started out as a DVD Audio forum).

So it's not that a Sports Forum wouldn't be able to generate enough interest...it's more a concern that it would detract from the focus of the site.

But Geoff is always willing to listen and this is a member driven site. So you might want to consider creating a poll in Other to see what the level of interest in a Sports forum is.

thats a valid point.. and i understand exactly what your saying

but here is the thing... we have so many members that enjoy posting in the sports threads.. and we feel like we should try to restrict the posts to large threads rather then many smaller more specific threads.. both to keep from having the other forum overrun with sports chatter, and to keep from having the smaller sports threads disappear before they are even really addressed.
I know this is moving more away from what this site was originally created for..
Sure, we could go to other sites and use their sports forums.. but over the years of being members here.. we have really developed bonds with alot of the dvdtalk members (and not in a jules winfield way ).. so we would much rather keep all the discussion at this site, but at the same time, would like more freedom to stretch out and discuss all the different sports related topics

if this is too far away from the plan geoff would like to keep in order.. then I guess Ill accept and understand his decision. I just ask that it gets the consideration that it deserves.. Looking in the other forum on a daily basis, I dont think there is any doubt that there would be enough traffic to warrant a sports forum, especially if we were given the freedom to spread out the topics more.

David - What about making a sports forum a sub forum of other? Then it wouldn't be its own forum perse, but it would accomplish the same purpose.

BOOK TALK!!!

Sorry ... it's the most compelling argument in favor of a Sports Forum, so I can't ignore it.

das

I would love to see a Sports Forum