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-   -   4th Annual Criterion Challenge (https://forum.dvdtalk.com/dvd-talk/603836-4th-annual-criterion-challenge.html)

Trevor 09-05-12 10:20 AM

Re: 4th Annual Criterion Challenge
 
^ I envy your FTV of The Vanishing. That film really disturbed me.

Sondheim 09-05-12 11:24 AM

Re: 4th Annual Criterion Challenge
 

Originally Posted by Tommy Bunz (Post 11371808)
If you enjoyed this you should check out the Russian WWII movies Come And See and Stalingrad. Both really great and really really grim.

Can't say I enjoyed Kanal, but it was definitely a really powerful film. I've seen Come and See (and agree that it's extremely grim), but I haven't seen Stalingrad. Thanks for the recommendation (though I'll probably have to wait until I'm feeling really cheerful to watch it.)

rocket1312 09-05-12 03:08 PM

Re: 4th Annual Criterion Challenge
 
ugh...I just spent the last 40 minutes typing out a long post about the first three films I watched and it's gone because the site logged me out while I was still composing. There's no way I'm re-writing it so here is the Cliff Notes (is that reference even remotely relevant anymore?) version...

- I rarely post despite being a member for 10 years and this is my first challenge.

- Rebecca is great. First time watching and I'm in love with Joan Fontaine (or at least the Joan Fontaine from 1940).

- Notorious is a film I didn't love on first viewing years ago but revisiting it has changed my mind. Some of the most twisted psychology in any of Hitchcock's ouvre.

- Stagecoach - I'm pretty apathetic towards westerns but this is a great film. See Tag Gallagher's visual essay on the Criterion disc. Says way more than I ever could.

- Anyone who doesn't like This is Spinal Tap is crazy.

That pretty much covers all the major points. I'll go back into my hole now.

Trevor 09-05-12 03:29 PM

Re: 4th Annual Criterion Challenge
 
Welcome to Challenges rocket1312! I hope you continue posting.

Ash Ketchum 09-05-12 03:34 PM

Re: 4th Annual Criterion Challenge
 

Originally Posted by rocket1312 (Post 11372383)
ugh...I just spent the last 40 minutes typing out a long post about the first three films I watched and it's gone because the site logged me out while I was still composing. There's no way I'm re-writing it so here is the Cliff Notes (is that reference even remotely relevant anymore?) version...

- I rarely post despite being a member for 10 years and this is my first challenge.

- Rebecca is great. First time watching and I'm in love with Joan Fontaine (or at least the Joan Fontaine from 1940).

- Notorious is a film I didn't love on first viewing years ago but revisiting it has changed my mind. Some of the most twisted psychology in any of Hitchcock's ouvre.

- Stagecoach - I'm pretty apathetic towards westerns but this is a great film. See Tag Gallagher's visual essay on the Criterion disc. Says way more than I ever could.

- Anyone who doesn't like This is Spinal Tap is crazy.

That pretty much covers all the major points. I'll go back into my hole now.

REBECCA and NOTORIOUS are both Hitchcock films I appreciated more when I got older.

Welcome to the World of the Challenges!

xizor42 09-05-12 04:18 PM

Re: 4th Annual Criterion Challenge
 
If you are looking for supplemental material for The Vanishing you could always check out the American remake. It was oddly enough done by the same director.

The Man with the Golden Doujinshi 09-05-12 05:14 PM

Re: 4th Annual Criterion Challenge
 
potential spoiler alert

It didn't take long but I'm getting tired of the formula where you have the indie movie that doesn't have many plot devices, so nothing really happens until the end where everything collides at the end where the payoff is a scene that is supposed to be disturbing, or a dark comedic moment, through violence, sexuality, or both. Then I have something like Life During Wartime, which I'm currently in the middle of and
Spoiler:
it blew it's load a little early by having the little kid saying faggot over and over when talking to his mom(hur hur real funny :rolleyes: ).


I also have Jeanne Dielman, 23 Quai du Commerce, 1080 Bruxelles on my plate and it sounds awful, beyond normal pretentiousness. When I see someone saying "Astonishing. I sat in silence for hours afterwards.", I can't help but to wonder what's wrong with that person. I just picture them finishing a movie and sitting on the couch, staring at the wall for hours. Someone else said mentioned a 30 minute dish washing scene. If that amazes anyone, there's something broken with them. I just don't get it. Based on what people said and the fact that it's nearly 3.5 hours of nothing, I cheated just now and looked it up on wikipedia to see if it was really that bad. This is exactly what I was describing earlier, only to a new extreme.

It's the sheer boredom of watching cars drive around in a circle for hours until there's finally a crash. The crash isn't all that exciting but it's impact is that much greater because you've put your brain into a slumber of boredom where anything, even a fly buzzing across your face, is instantly turned into the most exciting thing of all.

On the other end of the spectrum, I have Armageddon, which I equally hate.
My problem is that I'm trying to watch new stuff and the majority of it falls into that category. I know there's a few things left that are in the middle but the numbers of that stuff is so small unless I want to watch things I've already seen, which I want to avoid as much as possible.

At some point I'll realize I'm simply torturing myself for this challenge but my desire to watch new things is too strong. I haven't hit that one movie that breaks me yet.

rocket1312 09-05-12 07:55 PM

Re: 4th Annual Criterion Challenge
 

Originally Posted by Ash Ketchum (Post 11372422)
REBECCA and NOTORIOUS are both Hitchcock films I appreciated more when I got older.

Welcome to the World of the Challenges!

Thanks. I've wanted to do one of these for a while, but just never took the plunge.

As far as Notorious goes, I realize I'm not saying anything new, but the psychology and sexual politics at play is simply fascinating, and I can see why it might have more resonance as you get older. The resentment Devlin has for Alicia is at once contemptible, yet heartbreaking, and somehow bizarrely understandable. The film is still very relevant as a commentary on how our society perceives and judges female sexuality. Good stuff.

I'm thinking next up may be Powell & Pressburger's A Canterbury Tale. I've had it on my too watch pile for a long time. I also need to check out The 39 Steps and Three Colors Trilogy blu-rays I picked up during the B&N sale. Football season starting is really going to cut into movie time though.

CardiffGiant 09-05-12 07:58 PM

Re: 4th Annual Criterion Challenge
 

Originally Posted by rocket1312 (Post 11372383)
ugh...I just spent the last 40 minutes typing out a long post about the first three films I watched and it's gone because the site logged me out while I was still composing. There's no way I'm re-writing it so here is the Cliff Notes (is that reference even remotely relevant anymore?) version...

Bummer. That's happened to me a couple of times, mainly because of a sensitive track pad on a laptop I sometimes use.

Cliff Notes is still around in some versions...everyone seems to use SparkNotes now. SparkNotes even put out 8 minute animated videos for classics, I guess reading a summary of a book is just too damn difficult these days...


Originally Posted by rocket1312 (Post 11372383)
That pretty much covers all the major points. I'll go back into my hole now.

Ha! This really got me. I creeped on DVDTalk for about 5-6 years before getting an account and I was relatively quiet for a while until participating in the challenges and finding some genuinely nice people on here. Hopefully, you find that to be true as well...and, as Trevor said, "keep posting."

Dr. Mantle 09-05-12 07:59 PM

Re: 4th Annual Criterion Challenge
 
Second Film: The Life Aquatic with Steve Zissou(mine, DVD).

Jeff Goldblum seems like as obvious fit for Anderson's films. Why has he only been in one?

Dr. Mantle 09-05-12 10:41 PM

Re: 4th Annual Criterion Challenge
 
Third Film: Cronos (Netfilx rental, Blu).

Some filmmakers project their entire career in their first movie: Cronos is a genre film on the surface, but really it's about familial relationships. The story involves some kind of legend or mythology. A non-traditional leading character. Lots of prosthetic effects. Intricate set design.

Why So Blu? 09-06-12 12:57 AM

Re: 4th Annual Criterion Challenge
 

Originally Posted by Dr. Mantle (Post 11372897)
Third Film: Cronos (Netfilx rental, Blu).

Some filmmakers project their entire career in their first movie: Cronos is a genre film on the surface, but really it's about familial relationships. The story involves some kind of legend or mythology. A non-traditional leading character. Lots of prosthetic effects. Intricate set design.

Cronos is a Gothic masterpiece.

Travis McClain 09-06-12 02:25 AM

Re: 4th Annual Criterion Challenge
 

Originally Posted by Trevor (Post 11371970)
^ I envy your FTV of The Vanishing. That film really disturbed me.

I just finished reviewing it (see below), but the short version is that I thought it was very well done and completely captivating.


Originally Posted by rocket1312 (Post 11372383)
ugh...I just spent the last 40 minutes typing out a long post about the first three films I watched and it's gone because the site logged me out while I was still composing. There's no way I'm re-writing it so here is the Cliff Notes (is that reference even remotely relevant anymore?) version...

Ugh! That sucks!


- I rarely post despite being a member for 10 years and this is my first challenge.
Yay!


- Stagecoach - I'm pretty apathetic towards westerns but this is a great film. See Tag Gallagher's visual essay on the Criterion disc. Says way more than I ever could.
I streamed just the film, but I'll see about getting my grubby paws on that visual essay. I just checked HuluPlus, and as of right now it's not one of the streaming bonus features. I know my local library has it on DVD, but I can't recall if it's The Criterion Collection release that they have.


- Anyone who doesn't like This is Spinal Tap is crazy.
Well, I was treated at a mental health facility last October so I can't refute this.


Originally Posted by xizor42 (Post 11372471)
If you are looking for supplemental material for The Vanishing you could always check out the American remake. It was oddly enough done by the same director.

I saw some remarks about the remake on iCheckMovies.com, as well as on the Criterion.com page. It seems that the remake features a particularly unlikable tacked-on ending that is so nauseating people can't even finish watching the film. Given that the most important question put to Rex in the final act of the film is, "You've come this far, can you walk away now?" I find it a bit ironic that people would complain about not wanting to finish watching the remake once they got to that point.


Originally Posted by Dr. Mantle (Post 11372720)
Second Film: The Life Aquatic with Steve Zissou(mine, DVD).

Dammit. My wife took my copy of the 2-disc Criterion release. I gorged on its bonus content in the 2010 challenge, and if you've not delved into that stuff I highly recommend it. Some of it's self-congratulatory banality (the commentary with Anderson and Noah Baumbach was particularly off-putting), but some of the stuff is genuinely terrific.


Jeff Goldblum seems like as obvious fit for Anderson's films. Why has he only been in one?
You make an excellent argument, though I would say that in that specific film the scene-stealer is clearly Willem Dafoe. That was the funniest performance of his I've seen yet, second only to Shadow of the Vampire.

Travis McClain 09-06-12 02:34 AM

Re: 4th Annual Criterion Challenge
 
Oh, right! My review of Spoorloos [The Vanishing]. Per usual, it's on Letterboxd and...

SPOILER ALERT FOR ANYONE READING E-MAILS

Spoiler:
This was one of two Criterion Collection DVDs I checked out from the Oldham County Public Library yesterday, selected specifically for this month's DVD Talk Criterion Challenge. The only bonus feature to be found is the original theatrical trailer, which has a rather disturbingly lighthearted tone. A recurring point of discussion in my movie circles is the giveaway trailer, so thoroughly summarizing the film that the audience finds little surprise. The aforementioned theatrical trailer for this film is guilty of being very forthright about the story, but this is an instance where there are some extenuating circumstances.

Based upon a novel in turn inspired by an urban legend, <I>Spoorloos</I> [<I>The Vanishing</I>] begins already somewhat behind the 8 ball. We know from its very premise - traveling woman disappears, man searches for her - there are only a few possible outcomes. It's like a "Choose Your Own Adventure" with, like, three final chapters.

Yet what director George Sluizer's film manages to do is concede the obvious and dares us to come out from behind our presumptuous cynicism and answer the question, "Do you <I>really</I> want to know what happened to Saskia?" As Kim Newman put it in her <a href=http://www.criterion.com/current/posts/136-the-vanishing>2001 essay</a>, "Rex’s revelation also indicts the audience’s culpability—after all, we too want above all to learn the answer, even if it is truly appalling."

We're not tag-along detectives, seeking to help Rex find Saskia. We're sadistic voyeurs, enthralled by the brazenness of Raymond Lermorne in much the same way that our interest in Patrick Bateman supersedes any sympathy we may have for his victims in <I>American Psycho</I>. The truly interesting villains don't even see themselves as villainous, which is part of Raymond's intrigue. His rationale for abducting Saskia is dazzling: he wishes to prove that his moment of heroism would eclipse the darkest act he could think of performing, to test the absolute value of his goodness. It's the kind of intellectual exercise that, on paper, holds a lot of genuine interest. Thankfully, of those capable of appreciating the academic value of such hypothesis, scant few would ever consider actually trying to apply their curiosities.

And that's really where <I>Spoorloos</I> finds its place. The film allows us to vicariously go in places our own values would discourage us from exploring. We're not here to ask how, in Rex's position we might handle the abduction of our loved one (though I do appreciate that the film shies away from making Rex out to be a righteous avenger, as has become the fetish in contemporary cinema best personified by <I>Taken</I>). No, Rex exists solely so that Raymond has a proxy for confessing and explaining everything to us.

<I>Spoorloos</I> is not a film of the escalating depravity that characterizes <I>American Psycho</I>, but Raymond and Patrick are clearly kindred spirits. Patrick is more outrageous of the two, certainly, but there's something about Raymond that suggests he may operate on a "higher" level. His actions, after all, are couched in an admittedly repulsive philosophical argument about the nature of man's goodness, whereas Patrick kills more to test whether anyone in society is paying the slightest attention to what he does. There's that specific moment when Raymond dismisses the appeal of abducting prostitutes: they're willing to get into his car, and no one will miss them. There's insufficient challenge to the act of abduction, then, that prevents him from truly exploring the depths of his darkness as he needs to do. Patrick, of course, makes no such discrimination and indeed, favors prostitutes and other victims who will not be missed.

On a lighter note, I kept thinking the whole time that Bernard-Pierre Donnadieu (Raymond) bore a strong physical resemblance to Major League Baseball pitcher Eric Gagne and also to a former classmate I never liked. In some shots, Gene Bervoets reminded me of Christopher MacDonald.

Spoorloos [The Vanishing]
-X- 1980s (1988)
-X- Languages (French, Dutch)
-X- Themes (Originals, Scary Movies, Suspense)
-X- Spine Range #101-150 (#133)
-X- Read an Essay - The Vanishing by Kim Newman

rocket1312 09-06-12 10:31 AM

Re: 4th Annual Criterion Challenge
 
So I went to my dvd shelf last night to grab something to watch and despite every intention to put in A Canterbury Tale, I noticed my unwatched Lola Montes blu-ray that's been sitting there since last November. It was a blind buy for me and, generally speaking, a good number of my Criterions are blind buys. However, I know my tastes well enough and I usually do pretty thorough research so I am very rarely disappointed. I can't say I was disappointed in Lola Montes because I didn't even finish it. I fell asleep at around the 45 minute mark. Mostly it was my own fault for starting something too late, but of what I saw, nothing really grabbed me outside of the beautiful visuals. I'll certainly revisit it at some point in the next couple of weeks, but does anyone have anything to say about this one to get me excited about it?

The Man with the Golden Doujinshi 09-06-12 11:18 AM

Re: 4th Annual Criterion Challenge
 

Originally Posted by MinLShaw (Post 11373040)
I saw some remarks about the remake on iCheckMovies.com, as well as on the Criterion.com page. It seems that the remake features a particularly unlikable tacked-on ending that is so nauseating people can't even finish watching the film. Given that the most important question put to Rex in the final act of the film is, "You've come this far, can you walk away now?" I find it a bit ironic that people would complain about not wanting to finish watching the remake once they got to that point.

The question is, if the ending is so awful that they turned it off, how did they see the ending? I've seen it and I can see the complaint about it but the people that go into rages are the ones that complain when a remake diverts from the original at all. Same deal if a film diverts from a book but later on there's another film, based on the same book but it stays truer to the book. Then they'll all claim the new one is better, even if it isn't out yet.

Last night I started Secret of the Grain, which is good so far and later today at work, I'm going to start Ride with the Devil.

Greg MacGuffin 09-06-12 01:51 PM

Re: 4th Annual Criterion Challenge
 

Originally Posted by rocket1312 (Post 11373315)
So I went to my dvd shelf last night to grab something to watch and despite every intention to put in A Canterbury Tale, I noticed my unwatched Lola Montes blu-ray that's been sitting there since last November. It was a blind buy for me and, generally speaking, a good number of my Criterions are blind buys. However, I know my tastes well enough and I usually do pretty thorough research so I am very rarely disappointed. I can't say I was disappointed in Lola Montes because I didn't even finish it. I fell asleep at around the 45 minute mark. Mostly it was my own fault for starting something too late, but of what I saw, nothing really grabbed me outside of the beautiful visuals. I'll certainly revisit it at some point in the next couple of weeks, but does anyone have anything to say about this one to get me excited about it?

I watched Lola Montes several years ago, but it was a really crappy DVD that Fox Lorber released, before Criterion got a hold of it. It wasn't really my thing, but some of that might have been because of the subpar presentation. More recently, I've also seen Earrings of Madame de..., which is also by Max Ophuls and wasn't crazy about that either.

I normally like slow, restrained films, but these two just didn't do it for me. I might revisit them at some point, as I've found that my tastes can change pretty drastically over the years. :shrug: Maybe I just wasn't mature or patient enough at the time.

shadokitty 09-06-12 09:30 PM

Re: 4th Annual Criterion Challenge
 
After getting off to a rather slow start on the challenge, I finally watched my first movie tonight. Monty Python's Life of Brian, one of the two movies I own which are the actual criterion collection editions, the other being Robocop.

Dr. Mantle 09-06-12 11:50 PM

Re: 4th Annual Criterion Challenge
 
Fourth Film: Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas (mine, Blu).

This might be the most fucked up movie ever made by a major studio with mainstream talent. How did this even get released? There's no story, every scene is from the perspective of two guys who are never sober, and every setting is dirty and filthy and broken.

I saw this film on the big screen back in '98 and that scene with Ellen Barkin in the diner really scared the shit out of me. While Benecio Del Toro doesn't really do anything, you realize that someone who maintains a professional career is also capable of cutting someone's throat if he's in just the right mood.

One moment I liked was the part where Del Toro is puking (in the bathroom, not the car) and it actually sounds correct, i.e. gagging sounds and NO COUGHING. Maybe some people do that in real life, but I can't recall a time when I coughed while puking. And it always annoys me in movies when a character pukes and they just make a bunch of shallow coughing sounds.


Originally Posted by MinLShaw (Post 11373040)
Dammit. My wife took my copy of the 2-disc Criterion release. I gorged on its bonus content in the 2010 challenge, and if you've not delved into that stuff I highly recommend it. Some of it's self-congratulatory banality (the commentary with Anderson and Noah Baumbach was particularly off-putting), but some of the stuff is genuinely terrific.

I was considering Life Aquatic or Fear and Loathing for watching every part of a disc.

And for anyone who plans to watch Cronos, be sure you check out the awesome short Geometria, and the Bleak House feature. Guillermo takes you through his house full of movie memorabilia, first edition books, hand painted models (including one he was working on during the Hobbit), and everything other thing that could make a geek lose their shit.

Giles 09-07-12 05:12 PM

Re: 4th Annual Criterion Challenge
 
question: does one have to watch Pedro Costa's trilogy of films in sequence for it to make sense? (or are they stand alone films)

shadokitty 09-07-12 09:04 PM

Re: 4th Annual Criterion Challenge
 
For my second movie, I delved into Hulu's Criterion movies, and came up with a rather good first time view that way. Samaritan Zatoichi.

CardiffGiant 09-07-12 09:32 PM

Re: 4th Annual Criterion Challenge
 
I've been working my way through The Complete Jean Vigo and I watched The Magician; happy with both of those viewings. Reviews are in my list.

I've noticed more titles on Hulu (free) than those few that I've been mentioning, so it's a good place to look if you are stuck looking for something to watch.

tellybox 09-07-12 11:49 PM

Re: 4th Annual Criterion Challenge
 

Originally Posted by MinLShaw (Post 11370299)
I was actually kind of underwhelmed by this one, too. I think in this case, it was because I'd heard so much about it and what it was about that I didn't really find any surprises. It was pretty much just an execution of exactly what I already knew. I was kind of distracted, though, by fixating on the physical resemblance between Gary Cooper and Bill O'Reilly and of course then I got to thinking of how High Noon was called "the most un-American movie ever made" by John Wayne and the irony of associating anything to do with it with O'Reilly.

See, I went into it knowing little to nothing (I pictured it to be a cliche ridden western). It wasn't until after that I read about the John Wayne comments and such.

Have you ever revisited it, MinLShaw?

CardiffGiant 09-08-12 03:21 PM

Re: 4th Annual Criterion Challenge
 
I watched The Bank Dick and was disappointed by the first half and I really liked the second half. While writing my review for the challenge, I thought a little more closely about what transpired and ended up boosting my rating. Anyway, here's the review:

4. The Bank Dick (1940)*: The Bank Dick starts off as a borderline train-wreck of a film, but it gathers steam (and plot) in the second half. Most of the jokes are seriously dated and much of the physical comedy seems like thinly veiled ripoffs of Chaplin and Keaton, but as the film drew to a close, I was drawn in by the larger social message in all of it that seems like it would still be relevant today. A car chase scene is the highlight of the film; very well done, even by today's standards.

E-mail people: Spoiler Ahead!
Spoiler:
The way that wealth is obtained in The Bank Dick is solely on luck...and not just regular luck, but dumb luck...the dumbest luck and I wonder if the film was made today, if there would be heavy criticism levied at W.C. Fields for hating the wealthy. The conclusion seems very telling as it is a near mirror of the opening sequence in the home: the only difference are suits, a larger home, some servants, etc. Nothing has changed, no one has learned a lesson, they just happen to have come into money by the most accidental means. In the world W.C. Fields creates, you don't come into money through hard work, it literally falls into your drunken lap.
And, it happened again, I convinced myself of more stars once I started writing about it. 4/5

Trevor 09-08-12 08:08 PM

Re: 4th Annual Criterion Challenge
 
Wife at work and kid in bed, so I'll hopefully get a film or two in tonight.

Watched King Kong the other night, to get the laserdisc checklist mark, and hope to find time for all the BD supplements someday. I watched the missing spider pit part of the making-of documentary and was enthralled.


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