Lara Means

1) Opening crawl states that Darth Vader is searching everywhere for young Skywalker.

2) Vader line before he arrives at Hoth "The rebels are there and im sure Skywalker is with them."

3) Vader knows Luke's name.

So, the "How is that possible?" line is utter crap unless he is lying right at the face of his master.

bboisvert

The opening crawl and first scene of the film has Vader sending out thousands of probe droids throughout the galaxy, because he is "obsessed" with finding young Skywalker. He *does* know that he has a son at the time this line is uttered.

JONA99

I thought I'd read somewhere, perhaps even on this very thread, that the Skywalker reference in the opening crawl, and Vader's "I'm sure Skywalker is with them" line, have been removed.

Don't shoot the messenger, but I bet that's the case.

Kal-El

Well, the problems are a by-product of the over-analysis of the additional lines which I was talking about and don't really want to do, so I wouldn't say he's wrong, but why watch a movie if you're just going to nitpick each and every bit in it? Just like his and Terrell's debate on the "planet" in the Yavin IV fleet take off scene. Was it really that big of a deal? Does one really watch Star Wars and look for "shots" and how good they are? Because I sure as heck don't. I want a nice space adventure to get lost in. Maybe if it was a Fincher or Sodergergh film, then I'd really be on the look out for the cinematography but for these films, it's not something I'm thinking about going in.

bboisvert

I guess you just look at this film differently than I do then... I personally think that the original trilogy (especially ESB) is as important -- hell, more so -- than anything by Fincher, et al. I think that ESB is easily one of the greatest films of the 1980s.

And for Lucas to go out of his way to insert a line that makes absolutely no freaking sense in a scene that didn't need the change to begin with... well, I think that is certainly worthy of both comment and a bit of analysis.

Feathers McGraw

Just watched the laserdisk version of Star Wars for the first time in years. And the one thought that comes to mind after it all is:

All these changes are just so damn unnecessary.

The original version looks great. There wasn't one thing I thought needed changing. Yes, the speeder shadow looks better in the new version, but only when you compare them side by side. When you watch the original alone, it's fine.

The majority of these "fixes" may not hurt anything, but there simply was no need for them. The original film wasn't flawed.

Rivero

Oh my God. How can any SW fan in his right mind be ok with this? Seriously?? How can you possibly defend this?

Terrell

I can defend it easily. Because those two references are still in the Empire Strikes Back. They have not been removed.

You're going to have a brain hemorrhage if you don't calm down Rivero. You're going nuts over stuff that hasn't even been changed.

Let's not get crazy here. There are a number of flawed, bad looking shots in the original films. Doesn't hurt to fix them.

- Vader's and Ben's lightsaber during the duel in ANH looked like sticks

- The Rancor sequence in ROTJ had awful matte lines and looked pasted on

- There were tons of matte lines in all 3 films

- Some of the taun-taun shots were dodgy

and on and on and on. I could keep on going, but you get the point. You can argue that they were a product of their time. But you can't argue there weren't any flawed or dodgy looking shots in the originals.

emhello

I can't wait to see these new films! It will be like getting 3 brand new movies!

Lara Means

If Lucas only made these kinda changes then nobody would give a shit and there would be no bitching.

Artman

Anyone (terrell?) notice those DVD pics show more on the sides? (around 20% more in all) I compared them to my WS VHS.

Terrell

Hmm, I haven't noticed Artman. They look like they're framed correctly to me, but I haven't compared them.

Here are two comparison pics!




Hmmm..........

Lara Means

No difference.

Artman

I think that's a shot from the laserdisc, which i've never seen. So maybe we've been getting shafted on VHS the whole time?

I've also noticed a bit more image on top as well. I don't have a VHS pic handy so, I guess I can't prove it...

spizz

http://photobucket.com/albums/v296/tk007/OT_DVD_Caps/

Rivero

Jabba looks like a golden nutsack in that close-up pic.

Rivero

Yes, so by that rationale you'd probably be ok with an updated version of 2001: A Space Odyssey with all new digital effects and a better-looking StarChild. Maybe Ray Harryhausen can ok an update of the effects in the films he worked on. They could replace the skeletons in Jason and the Argonauts and the Cyclops in Sinbad with brand-new CGI versions. Lang's Metropolis? Needs SERIOUS fixing, a complete overhaul.

mzupeman2

So what is the problem with the fixing of the lightsabers though? What exactly has been done to that, that is makign people upset?

Spiderbite

Exactly!

Why are there so many apologists for Lucas?

Qui Gon Jim

GOOD CHRIST! Here we go again WITH THE SAME ARGUMENT FOR THE 10 MILLIONTH F'N TIME!

God damn it give it a rest! None of us think all the changes are good, but bitching endlessly about them won't do anyone any good.

This thread is not called: "Star Wars DVDs: Artistic Merit?" This thread is to share info on the new scenes in the DVDs. Not to talk about the fundamentals of making said changes. If you disagree with any change to any movie for any reason, WHY GET INVOLVED IN A DISCUSSION ABOUT CHANGES TO A MOVIE?????? OH YEAH! To piss off those discussing it. Troll.


As far as the diologue change, it does seem to create problems rather than solve them. I think the underlying theme that Lucas doesn't get across really well is that Vader is conspiring behind the Emperor's back. Perhaps this scene the Emperor is basically measuring Vader's reply, trying to see what his reaction will be to the revelation. Plus it can be argued that Vader assumes that Obi-Wan was aiding the force-adept that destroyed the Death Star. Heck maybe "Skywalker" is the "Smith" of the Star Wars universe

Deadman31

The problem is this. I think we all know that Lucas is full of crap about"original visions" and so forth. We accept it, because we have no way of proving what he originally wanted to do with these movies. Thats fine. If he is going to keep making changes, why can't he change things back that don't work? There is no way in the world that he can't see how stupid some of these changes are. Personally, I think he either has some serious issues about what the OT did to his life or he is going senile. I just pray that he doesnt decide to do episodes 7-9, because then he could really destroy the OT.

rennervision

How about the whole freakin' plot of ESB is now moot? During the entire movie Vader is pursuing the Millenium Falcon in order to use Luke's friends as bait and set a trap for him. How can he do this if he doesn't know he has a son???

GuessWho

We didn't know he had a son either till the very end, yet the movie made perfect sense to us all along up to that point anyway.

Luke = the guy who blew up his Death Star. That's enough motivation itself to hunt him and use his friends as bait.

El-Kabong

Look, you are not buying the god damned movies - so why the F do you gotta keep crapping all over the place. GO AWAY!

Christ, some people.

chanster

I never knew that you can only discuss DVDs only if you intend to buy them.