You do realize that 59,000 signatures (some of which are undoubtedly faked) is a drop in the bucket, right?

59,000 Internet signatures is exactly what I would call a "handful of fanboys" when compared to the likely 2 million copies of this set that will fly off the shelves in the first week.

(Not that I disagree with the 'fanboys'... I want the OT too. But I'm not blind to the fact that most people are unaware of any major changes and/or don't give a shit.)

Don't kid yourself. Lucas will make a killing on this DVD, and the vast majority of Star Wars fans who claim they won't buy this DVD, will buy it. Some probably won't. But they will be a small drop in a huge bucket. Most will, regardless of all the denials.

Just look a the preorder listson a number of DVD sites. I saw a quote by one industry expert that said preorders for this title are the biggest they've ever seen. Amazon said it's their highest selling preorder ever.

But he doesn't do it for the money! He does it to fund the Web site!!!!

*Snicker*

59,079 barely fills a football stadium. Big deal! That's NOTHING compared to the millions and millions of units that will be sold world wide. And 85% of those people who buy it will not care if Luke line to R2 on Dagobah about not tasting good is changed, or that the Death Star has a 'Praxis ring" from it's explosion.

You overestimate your importance.

Um, no! DVD money doesn't go to that. Although I know you're trying to be a smartass. But I am right and you are wrong, which is not unusual.

This is the ultimate distillation of this argument.

Say this thing sells 6 million copies. Even if every single signature was unique (and let's face it they are not legit) then we are talking 1%. 1%. That is like a molecule in the bucket.

Those that are POed are NOT the majority, not by a longshot. Thing is you complainers bitch and to make your argument stick, you say "most" people hate Lucas and want the OT. I would say that "most" people don't give a shit, don't think Lucas raped their childhoods, etc etc. The vocal internet whiners are probably less than 1% of the audience for this thing so I think that GL is right not to listen to them.

I wish that the original cuts were available, but they aren't I can't change it so I move on and have faith that in the end when the big box set is released that the original cuts will be in it.

Have ANY of those internet petitions EVER worked?

Yes, a petition was directly responsible for the widescreen SE edition of Willy Wonka. In fact, the success of it is what led to all of these other petitions --- which, indeed, have failed since.

Think about this guys. I did the other day...

One of the major things about EP3 will be the fans waiting to see Anakin all burnt up and ripped to shreds.

EP6 is on DVD in Sept. Way before EP3 is out.

If this change is true, then we will see Anakin all burnt up and everything much earlier than we should. It will almost make what we see in EP3 seem, "not as important or shocking".

Plus...Vader HAS aged no matter what. He won't be a 25 year old Vader dying with his 25 year old son Luke. They will have to have aged him. And judging by that "fake pic" of Anakin's ghost being changed...I think it's even more fake.

Luke won't be looking at the ghost of his 25 year old father. If anything, he'll have to be aged like 20+ years.

So either Lucas is a total moron, or I just proved that the Anakin changes aren't gonna happen.

IF ANYTHING...perhaps change the voice of Shaw so it's Anakins, but aged...cause was it just me or did Anakin sound very very British?

Anyways...ugh.

The problem is worse when these films are viewed in a chronological order. The so-called "Ep III" will reveal many of the important surprises in Eps. IV-VI.

59,000 internet signatures for a petition is pretty substantial. Consider that not everyone who would sign the petition may have ever even seen that site, and you can estimate that for every person who signed at least ten other people didn't.

Half a million people petitioning for a DVD is a LOT of people.

Considering that even the best-selling DVDs rarely sell more than 4 million copies - now that's 17.5% loss in sales (provided everyone who signed the petition won't buy the upcoming DVDs).

That's pretty significant.

In any case, I signed the petition - I do want the Original films on DVD, but I am also buying this set. I'll buy one copy of the remastered cartoon version and one copy of the Original Trilogy. I bought both versions of the Lord of the Rings films. There aren't many films I'd buy multiple copies of, but the Star Wars trilogy is one of them.

And of course, there are many many more folks out there who won't be buying the upcoming DVD, but haven't signed the petition. They may not believe in petitions, they may not know about it, they may not care. That 60,000 in no way represents the "maximum" number of people who feel strongly about this issue.

I'm anxious to hear the final previews. If Lucas undoes the most egegious changes he made in '97, then I'll be buying. If not, I'll pass, and wait until he offers a worthy version to buy.

And no, I won't be changing my mind. I don't buy cropped full screen crap saying "I can't change it, it's all they have" so I'll just buy whatever shit they produce. I don't buy colourised b&w classics because they're the only version available.

All that does is prove them right. "See, nobody wants widescreen at home!" Don't buy the crap, and let the companies know *why* you're not buying it.

I repeat: he isn't in it for the fame because if he released the OT he would have people kissing his feet and we wouldn't have websites againts him and loads of threads on several forums all against him.

Lucas is just like Disney, they don't give you the choice, if someone wants the true original Lion King on dvd, you can't get it. Maybe that's where Lucas learned, from Eisner.

I swear, what a bunch of whinners. What is it with you people who don't understand that for the unaltered original versions to be released on DVD, they too would have to go through some MAJOR restoration. And this could not be done with the current SE+ prints, because several scenes have been altered in some way, ie. bluescreen artifacts cleaned up, CG effects added, et al. So they'd have to go back to the pre-'97 SE prints to do this restoration. Now I don't know about you, but I doubt neither Lowry Digital or Lucas wants to spend the time or money in restoring/remastering those old prints. They were in pretty bad shape then (in '97) so I can safely assume they'd be in worse shape today.

It's just not worth it, in a practical sense and monetary sense to restore and release the unaltered versions on DVD or any future format. I know I wouldn't waste the time and money to do it just so that 100% of all Star Wars fans could have what they consider the true versions. Quite frankly I applaud Lucas for doing what he's doing. I applaud his drive for perfection (in his opinion) on his "babies". I would too. Besides, Lucas has been on record saying that the '97 SEs were "work in progress".

OK, well anyway, one of the enhancements I wish they make is a CGI replacement for the tenticle that grabs C3-PO in Jabba's Palace's dungeon. The one in the original film is so mechanical and fake looking that it ruins the scene.

Also, I hope they give us a CG trash compactor monster. The little hairy eye tenticle is just too fake, and seriously needs to be updated.

I know that Lucas restored the original version before editing them to the SE's. All this talk of "The originals are gone, deteriorated, etc... is crap. Now I believe that they haven't gone through the newest restoration, but believe me, Lucas has a very nice copy of the original trilogy somewhere.

You really need to cool it. I mean seriously, going in and calling people whiners about asking for movies to be released.

Whenever these threads get intense, its always the people that are pro-Lucas or whatever who start calling others whiners.

Pretty sad.

Well said.

We all know we're going to buy the set when it comes out, no matter how much bitching we do before-hand...

And then we'll buy the re-releases and the "Original" Trilogy sets when those come out... (You all know Luca$ will get around to them)

My only opinion on the whole issue is the same on I had from the start... If it's not broke, don't f//k with it.

Okay, people aren't upset because Lucas has made changes to the OT.

People are pissed because he's REPLACING the original versions with the bastardized versions. The folks here wouldn't be pissed off about the changes IF HE WAS STILL KEEPING THE ORIGINAL VERSIONS AVAILABLE. It just comes off as egotistical bullshit on his part.

Whether George Lucas likes it or not, the original films are classics. They were seen and loved by millions and millions of people in their original forms. They represented a lot of hard work by a lot of people to make some truly ground-breaking special effects. They should at least be preserved in some form -- with warts and all -- for posterity, if not a web full of rabid bitching fanboys.

Nobody would be bitching if Lucas wasn't being a dick about it.

Um, not quite. The originals were digitally scanned into the computers to make digital copies so they could then make the SEs. But those copies were hacked up and made into SEs. No ful restoration was done. The film stock is in pretty bad shape, and would still need a massive restoration if they were to be released on DVD. It can be done, but to put the originals on DVD would require a hell of a lot of work. Don't assume they could just slap them on some DVDs and ship them out.

As for whether the originals exist, of course they do. But they aren't very good shape at all.

The originals will get released sooner or later, so relax.

Well, the originals were broke in a couple of areas, and had one or two continuity errors. One being the two different emperors. That needed to be fix. There is quite a bit of shots that also really needed to be fixed, like the terrible looking lightsabers in ANH, or the horribly composited Rancor scene. They might not be broken as films, but they were too broken just to up and release on DVD.

Star Wars is considered one of the greates milestones in special effects. What the hell is so special about those effects if we can't SEE THEM THEY WAY THEY WERE. So someone who doesn't know would think, no wonder its a milestone, look at those amazing lightsabers!!

Lucas keeps EVERYTHING. Ever see footage of the Lucas Archives warehouse? While the originals may not be restored, with his resources and money, it would be a drop in the hat for him. He could even release them as some separate "Star Wars Original Archive" package and make a killing.


Exactly. Too bad he isn't like his buddy Spielberg who knows how to release the original and SE (ala E.T.) I'm glad Spielberg still greatly respects the original and wants fans to remember it (even forcing Universal to include it on the regular and gift set dvd).


Why so confident? What evidence do you have?


The reality is this: there will always be TWO DIFFERENT STAR WARS TRILOGIES. These will NEVER blend seamlessly as Lucas delusionally thinks. They will always appear vastly different for a number of reasons -- most of which are quite obvious.

The laserdiscs still look pretty good to me.

Maybe Spielberg doesn't have the same pull with Columbia. You can't see the original cut of Close Encounters on DVD.

The difference between Spielberg's E.T. release and Lucas' Star Wars is that the revised E.T. had been politically corrected-ized, while Lucas' Star Wars has just been updated.

Now as for "bastardizing" Star Wars, by what on Naboo do you mean by that? That some f/x have been changed or that Greedo shoots first?

State of the art f/x at the time or not, some are still extremely dated to today's standards. You know I could understand the fanboy reasoning a bit more if there was never a prequal trilogy made, but there has been. And to have the latter half of this saga looking 25+ years older in terms of visuals, just doesn't do much for those who wish to watch the saga in chronological order.

You folks speak of, "Well, generations from now won't be able to experience the classic look of the [unaltered] originals." Well, quite frankly, it's these future generations are who I am concerned about to. To me, if left unaltered, I can see future generations asking, "Dadda, why does Parts 4 thru 6 look so different?"

Quite frankly, I believe that all you fanboys are using your own personal wishes in a selfish way so that for somehow your childhood doesn't get raped. Think about future generations.

Do you want a consistant looking saga or one that obviously looks like it's been shot 20 years apart but in reverse order? I'll take a consistant looking saga anyday.

Now with all my pro-SE change posts, you may all have me targeted as a young'en who missed the original theatrical runs and who has only seen the SEs. Well, I'm not. I'm 30. I saw the original Star Wars in the theater twice when I was just 3 years old. Grew up through the early '80s as a big Star Wars fan. Had a decent collection of the original Kenner figures, and even bought a ton of the Power of the Force figures in the late '90s. However through the years while watching the films, I have always wished [Lucas] could go back and enhance and/or fix some things. Blue screen boxes was one of them. Bad composite shots like the Rancor scene. And the white light saber f/x in ANH. Did I like the changes in the SEs? For the most part, YES. Did I dislike some, oh maybe a few, but I thought they didn't go far enough with some of them. This is one of the reasons why I'm hoping that this 2004 release will fix. There were many things that I'm hoping were fixed and/or enhanced for this release.