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DVD Talk Forum (https://forum.dvdtalk.com/)
-   Comic Book Talk (https://forum.dvdtalk.com/comic-book-talk-57/)
-   -   DC UNIVERSE Reboots in September, Same Day Digital Linewide (https://forum.dvdtalk.com/comic-book-talk/591381-dc-universe-reboots-september-same-day-digital-linewide.html)

fujishig 09-13-12 05:38 PM
Re: DC UNIVERSE Reboots in September, Same Day Digital Linewide
 
Originally Posted by stingermck (Post 11383328)
I only read the first few and agree it was crap. My New Teen Titans Omnibus and the upcoming Johns Omnibus is all the Titans I need. It was unfortunate that the title was really coming around to being great again right when 52 hit.
A man after my own heart. I suffered through that awful Felicia Henderson run of Titans, and just when Nicola Scott and J.T. Krul were washing the bad taste out of my mouth, new 52 happens. I thought it was just my prejudice that made me want to reject what looked like an 80's Image comic, but the writing is also terrible. I started glossing over the words and skimming the book near the end just to get through it. Though the Red Robin and Wondergirl designs, which I hated at first, were growing on me.

Though I've resisted the NTT Omni because of price,and because I've heard the DC Omnibus bindings are terrible. Are they worth it?

stingermck 09-14-12 12:13 PM
Re: DC UNIVERSE Reboots in September, Same Day Digital Linewide
 
I have Vol 1 & 2 of NTT Omnibus and I they they are great. I had 1-4 of the Archives, but I assumed those would not continue with the Omni's coming out. I didnt notice anything wrong with the binding, but like any omni, they are huge to read. #3 comes out next year and looks like it collects the Baxter series

Patman 09-21-12 09:32 PM
Re: DC UNIVERSE Reboots in September, Same Day Digital Linewide
 
I think I'm down to about 10 of the New52 DC titles, with maybe a handful of other titles now.

kgrogers1979 09-27-12 06:52 AM
Re: DC UNIVERSE Reboots in September, Same Day Digital Linewide
 
Has anyone read Teen Titans #0 yet? Dear god that was horrible. Giving it a zero out of ten would even be too high of a score.

Spoiler:
We have all heard the rumors that in the new 52 Tim was never actually a Robin but rather he started as Red Robin. Well that's true, but that isn't nearly as bad as some of the other shit in this issue. Pre-52 Tim was a great detective rivaling Bruce himself. The new 52 Tim is a fucking idiot.

Tim is trying to figure out Batman's identity, and unlike pre-52 where he actually did, here Bruce knew about Tim from the beginning and so Bruce was feeding him false clues. Tim never figures it out, and so Batman tells him he doesn't have what it takes to become his partner.

Then to regain Batman's attention and prove his worth, Tim comes up with a "brilliant" plan to steal money from Penguin. Penguin sends his henchmen to kill Tim and his family, but Batman arrives just in time to save them.

Tim's parents are then placed in witness protection, and they tell Batman that they don't want Tim to have to live his life in anonymity and in constant fear of Penguin finding them, so they ask Batman to take Tim in as his partner. Batman reluctantly agrees, and so Tim becomes <s>Robin</s> Red Robin.

Tim is a major fucking idiot, and he completely ruins his parents' lives, and he still gets rewarded with what he wanted all along: to become Batman's partner.

The final page then reveals that his new name given to him by witness protection is Drake. So Drake was never actually his real name. His real name was never mentioned throughout the issue.

This issue was just one huge steaming pile of shit.

stingermck 09-27-12 07:28 AM
Re: DC UNIVERSE Reboots in September, Same Day Digital Linewide
 
Originally Posted by kgrogers1979 (Post 11401471)
Has anyone read Teen Titans #0 yet? Dear god that was horrible. Giving it a zero out of ten would even be too high of a score.

Spoiler:
We have all heard the rumors that in the new 52 Tim was never actually a Robin but rather he started as Red Robin. Well that's true, but that isn't nearly as bad as some of the other shit in this issue. Pre-52 Tim was a great detective rivaling Bruce himself. The new 52 Tim is a fucking moron. He steals some money from Penguin, and then Penguin sends his henchmen to kill Tim and his family. Batman arrives in time to save them. Tim's parents are then placed in protective custody, but Tim goes along with Batman to become <s>Robin</s> Red Robin. The final page then reveals that his new name given to him by witness protection is Drake. So Drake was never actually his real name (his real name was never mentioned throughout the issue). This issue was just one huge steaming pile of shit.
Ouch. Almost as bad as Catwoman #0

Spoiler:
They go with the Batman Returns origin. Secretary pushed off a building, licked alive by cats. I shit you not. I couldn't believe what I was reading. And to make it worse, her bio at the end mentions she has no super powers. Seriously?

http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/j...ps65ba5fbb.jpg

fujishig 09-27-12 11:19 AM
Re: DC UNIVERSE Reboots in September, Same Day Digital Linewide
 
Originally Posted by kgrogers1979 (Post 11401471)
Has anyone read Teen Titans #0 yet? Dear god that was horrible. Giving it a zero out of ten would even be too high of a score.

Spoiler:
We have all heard the rumors that in the new 52 Tim was never actually a Robin but rather he started as Red Robin. Well that's true, but that isn't nearly as bad as some of the other shit in this issue. Pre-52 Tim was a great detective rivaling Bruce himself. The new 52 Tim is a fucking idiot.

Tim is trying to figure out Batman's identity, and unlike pre-52 where he actually did, here Bruce knew about Tim from the beginning and so Bruce was feeding him false clues. Tim never figures it out, and so Batman tells him he doesn't have what it takes to become his partner.

Then to regain Batman's attention and prove his worth, Tim comes up with a "brilliant" plan to steal money from Penguin. Penguin sends his henchmen to kill Tim and his family, but Batman arrives just in time to save them.

Tim's parents are then placed in witness protection, and they tell Batman that they don't want Tim to have to live his life in anonymity and in constant fear of Penguin finding them, so they ask Batman to take Tim in as his partner. Batman reluctantly agrees, and so Tim becomes <s>Robin</s> Red Robin.

Tim is a major fucking idiot, and he completely ruins his parents' lives, and he still gets rewarded with what he wanted all along: to become Batman's partner.

The final page then reveals that his new name given to him by witness protection is Drake. So Drake was never actually his real name. His real name was never mentioned throughout the issue.

This issue was just one huge steaming pile of shit.
Uh... so they don't want Tim to be in danger (why do they care if he's anonymous if it keeps him safe?), so they make him go into a job where he's in constant danger? What?

And isn't he tracked down by shady govt. agents in the very first issue of the series due to his constant internet chatting about young heroes or something? Way to risk the life of your family again.

So how many years has it been since Batman first started operating in this universe? Was Jason Todd still a Robin?

I know I'm really far behind on this but I finally picked up the first trade of Legion Lost, collecting issues 1-7, also by Fabian Nicieza, the writer of Teen Titans. I had collected the first four issues before I dropped the book and decided to wait for the collection, but this team has some of my favorite Legionnaires (Wildfire, Dawnstar, Gates, Timberwolf) and I've always liked Pete Woods. Those two factors alone raised this above Teen Titans (which was a really low bar to begin with) but after 7 issues I still didn't feel hooked. And then they start a crossover with Teen Titans and Superboy, just to introduce yet another team of young superheroes? Ugh.

Travis McClain 09-27-12 11:45 AM
Re: DC UNIVERSE Reboots in September, Same Day Digital Linewide
 
I'm glad I haven't even tried to follow those other books. It seems each month, someone does something haphazard to further demonstrate how little actual planning went into The New 52. That's one nice thing about Detective Comics through its first year: it was a Batman solo book, free from such distractions. There were throwaway references to activities in some of the other Bat-books, but those were obviously just meant to tease us into looking at those comics and they weren't at all relevant to the story at hand. If it gets caught up in all this nonsense with its new creative team, I'll quickly bail on it.

Thank God Gail Simone is still writing Batgirl.

stingermck 09-27-12 11:49 AM
Re: DC UNIVERSE Reboots in September, Same Day Digital Linewide
 
Originally Posted by MinLShaw (Post 11401819)
Thank God Gail Simone is still writing Batgirl.
Batgirl #0 was a good read. It was a good update to the sudden act of helping out, just no Killer Moth. Only thing I didn't like was her wearing a Robin mask like Silverstone did in Batman & Robin. They are really pushing a connection to (shitty) movies.

stingermck 09-27-12 11:51 AM
Re: DC UNIVERSE Reboots in September, Same Day Digital Linewide
 
Originally Posted by fujishig (Post 11401769)
So how many years has it been since Batman first started operating in this universe? Was Jason Todd still a Robin?
5-6 years. Batman #0 starts 6 years ago and Bruce does not have a costume yet. So he must have been going through Robin's like a son of a bitch.

Travis McClain 09-27-12 12:04 PM
Re: DC UNIVERSE Reboots in September, Same Day Digital Linewide
 
Originally Posted by stingermck (Post 11401830)
Batgirl #0 was a good read. It was a good update to the sudden act of helping out, just no Killer Moth. Only thing I didn't like was her wearing a Robin mask like Silverstone did in Batman & Robin. They are really pushing a connection to (shitty) movies.
I didn't mind it. Domino masks are so common that I didn't make any connection to Batman & Robin and anyway, I've developed this really bizarre Stockholm Syndrome relationship with that film in the last year or two so even if I had, I don't think I'd have minded.

My only real problem with the #0 issues is that in the case of Batgirl, it was a complete interruption of an ongoing story. It seems to me that DC didn't give writers sufficient advanced warning to properly integrate the #0 into the flow of the book overall.

kgrogers1979 09-27-12 02:09 PM
Re: DC UNIVERSE Reboots in September, Same Day Digital Linewide
 
Originally Posted by stingermck (Post 11401835)
5-6 years. Batman #0 starts 6 years ago and Bruce does not have a costume yet. So he must have been going through Robin's like a son of a bitch.
Yep. 4 Robins in 6 years basically. (Dick, Jason, Tim, and now Damian. Stephanie doesn't exist in the new52.) I guess technically Tim was never actually Robin though since he started as Red Robin and always has been Red Robin. The biggest unexplained mystery is how Bruce has a 10 year old son with Talia when he has only been Batman for at most 6 years. I was really hoping Batman & Robin #0 would explain that, but it didn't.

madcougar 09-27-12 02:50 PM
Re: DC UNIVERSE Reboots in September, Same Day Digital Linewide
 
Originally Posted by kgrogers1979 (Post 11401471)
Has anyone read Teen Titans #0 yet? Dear god that was horrible. Giving it a zero out of ten would even be too high of a score.

Spoiler:
We have all heard the rumors that in the new 52 Tim was never actually a Robin but rather he started as Red Robin. Well that's true, but that isn't nearly as bad as some of the other shit in this issue. Pre-52 Tim was a great detective rivaling Bruce himself. The new 52 Tim is a fucking idiot.

Tim is trying to figure out Batman's identity, and unlike pre-52 where he actually did, here Bruce knew about Tim from the beginning and so Bruce was feeding him false clues. Tim never figures it out, and so Batman tells him he doesn't have what it takes to become his partner.

Then to regain Batman's attention and prove his worth, Tim comes up with a "brilliant" plan to steal money from Penguin. Penguin sends his henchmen to kill Tim and his family, but Batman arrives just in time to save them.

Tim's parents are then placed in witness protection, and they tell Batman that they don't want Tim to have to live his life in anonymity and in constant fear of Penguin finding them, so they ask Batman to take Tim in as his partner. Batman reluctantly agrees, and so Tim becomes <s>Robin</s> Red Robin.

Tim is a major fucking idiot, and he completely ruins his parents' lives, and he still gets rewarded with what he wanted all along: to become Batman's partner.

The final page then reveals that his new name given to him by witness protection is Drake. So Drake was never actually his real name. His real name was never mentioned throughout the issue.

This issue was just one huge steaming pile of shit.
You know, if I'd known how poorly New 52 Tim Drake was going to fare, I wouldn't have gotten back into comics. I realized once I stopped collecting them, that I had a genuine affection for the character, rivaled only by Bruce Wayne/Batman. Why would you shit all over a character this way. I just don't get it.

stingermck 09-27-12 02:57 PM
Re: DC UNIVERSE Reboots in September, Same Day Digital Linewide
 
Because of Damian. Tim has always been my favorite Robin, but as soon as Damian was introduced I knew the writing was on the wall.

brayzie 09-27-12 04:42 PM
Re: DC UNIVERSE Reboots in September, Same Day Digital Linewide
 
Why even bother including Tim Drake if they have to shoehorn in his connection to Batman and he's pretty much only Tim Drake in name?

I guess the answer is that DC/Warner Bros has all these properties like Teen Titans (TM) and they to have them loosely tied to the cartoons and movies.

So they want to start from scratch with the New52 launch, but they can't mess with the storylines of their top sellers like Batman and Green Lantern, and yet they're forced to put out DC/WB owned properties to maintain the copyright, as well as launch pad for any future animated cartoons, live action films, toys, videogames, etc.

kgrogers1979 09-27-12 06:55 PM
Re: DC UNIVERSE Reboots in September, Same Day Digital Linewide
 
Originally Posted by brayzie (Post 11402242)
Why even bother including Tim Drake if they have to shoehorn in his connection to Batman and he's pretty much only Tim Drake in name?
Spoiler:
Its really not even him in name either since Drake is apparently the name given to him by Witness Protection.

The "real" Tim Drake is stuck in limbo with Stephanie Brown and Cassandra Cain.

PhantomStranger 09-27-12 07:59 PM
Re: DC UNIVERSE Reboots in September, Same Day Digital Linewide
 
Originally Posted by stingermck (Post 11402114)
Because of Damian. Tim has always been my favorite Robin, but as soon as Damian was introduced I knew the writing was on the wall.
+1
Tim Drake's place in the Batman mythos is being replaced by Damian. If the character wasn't so popular, I doubt Tim Drake even survives the jump to the new DCU.

It's not like DC is going to expunge Damian from continuity anytime soon.

Dragon Tattoo 09-27-12 10:02 PM
Re: DC UNIVERSE Reboots in September, Same Day Digital Linewide
 
I guess I should be glad Cassandra didn't make it into this trainwreck.

kgrogers1979 09-27-12 10:39 PM
Re: DC UNIVERSE Reboots in September, Same Day Digital Linewide
 
Interview from Lobdell regarding the disaster that is Teen Titans #0:

http://www.comicbookresources.com/?p...ticle&id=41229

Lobdell says that Tim is unique in that he is the only one to become a Robin by choice and not as a result of some tragedy. Um what? So having Penguin nearly kill you and your family and being forced into Witness Protection for the rest of your life isn't a tragedy?

Also apparently the thing about Drake not being his real name was an editorial decision. It wouldn't surprise me at this point if they decide to reveal his real name is Tim John Blake or something equally stupid.

Lobdell also says Tim's parents will be back in the near future and hints that Tim won't escape the upcoming Joker story "Death of the Family" unscathed. Ten bucks says Joker is going to kill his parents. Hell, at this point I don't even care if Joker kills Tim too because this isn't even close to the same Tim I grew up reading.

fujishig 09-27-12 11:07 PM
Re: DC UNIVERSE Reboots in September, Same Day Digital Linewide
 
Originally Posted by PhantomStranger (Post 11402459)
+1
Tim Drake's place in the Batman mythos is being replaced by Damian. If the character wasn't so popular, I doubt Tim Drake even survives the jump to the new DCU.

It's not like DC is going to expunge Damian from continuity anytime soon.
Wait... weren't Wally West and to a lesser extent, Donna Troy pretty popular? I guess if you're going to crap all over the name Teen Titans, better that they aren't around. Is Garth still around, or was he wiped out in the new 52, or is he still dead because some parts of Blackest Night are still in continuity? There never was an original or New Teen Titans, in this universe, right?

I apologize to Fabien Nicieza for thinking before that he was the one writing Teen Titans. Got him confused with Lobdell, maybe because DC seemed to build this whole universe around writers and artists of Marvel X-books in the early 90s. Which I guess is ok because they cribbed Flashpoint from AoA and then Heroes Reborn'd the whole universe.

reubs82 09-28-12 12:39 PM
Re: DC UNIVERSE Reboots in September, Same Day Digital Linewide
 
I've never read any of the Tim Drake stuff, but I know he had a huge role in the post-Bruce Wayne pre-Flashpoint return with his own series, right?

Lobdell also says that Tim's the only member of the extended Bat-family "who had truly loving and supportive parents" but isn't that BS? Isn't that what makes the Dick Grayson character so great because he had parents who loved him and supported him? I know that Nightwing #0 shows some tension, but I didn't chalk that up to non-loving or non-supportive. Am I missing something here?

stingermck 09-28-12 12:52 PM
Re: DC UNIVERSE Reboots in September, Same Day Digital Linewide
 
Im starting to wish DC didnt do these 0 issues. So many sharks jumping around.

fujishig 09-28-12 02:29 PM
Re: DC UNIVERSE Reboots in September, Same Day Digital Linewide
 
Originally Posted by reubs82 (Post 11403316)
I've never read any of the Tim Drake stuff, but I know he had a huge role in the post-Bruce Wayne pre-Flashpoint return with his own series, right?

Lobdell also says that Tim's the only member of the extended Bat-family "who had truly loving and supportive parents" but isn't that BS? Isn't that what makes the Dick Grayson character so great because he had parents who loved him and supported him? I know that Nightwing #0 shows some tension, but I didn't chalk that up to non-loving or non-supportive. Am I missing something here?
I'm thinking he meant "loving and supporting parents... who were around when he decided to take up the Robin mantle."

brayzie 09-28-12 03:49 PM
Re: DC UNIVERSE Reboots in September, Same Day Digital Linewide
 
It's amazing how they rebooted their comics line and still manage to make it confusing, even for the regular readers.

Navinabob 09-28-12 05:53 PM
Re: DC UNIVERSE Reboots in September, Same Day Digital Linewide
 
This Robin stuff is confusing. Is there a Nightwing? How old is he supposed to be? How long did he train with Batman and was Batman even experienced enough to train him then?

boredsilly 09-28-12 06:02 PM
Re: DC UNIVERSE Reboots in September, Same Day Digital Linewide
 
Seems like with the new 52, you shouldn't pull the thread too much, else things begin to fall apart.

I'm actually amazed that Damian is still around. Comics are so resistant to change, that I think it's a minor miracle that Bruce Wayne, the guy who isn't even allowed to have a serious love interest for any real length of time, has a child running around. I give DC props for sticking with this.

Recently read Suicide Squad. I was pleasantly surprised with that book. I wish the art was better, and I wish Deadshot didn't suffer this awful redesign (he's almost as bad as Midnighter's new look), but outside of that the book is solid.


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