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horror films by year starting 1895 - wiki breakdown by decade then year
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The official Xbox 360 thread - the console of choice on nuclear submarines
08-30-10, 01:10 PM
#1401
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hasn't it been $50 a year since it launched 8 years ago?
08-30-10, 01:14 PM
#1402
DVD Talk Hero
re: The official Xbox 360 thread - the console of choice on nuclear submarines
You know what's great about MS softening the blow by offering a year for $40? They're basically subsidizing the next two years for people. Oh, they'll buy the $40 one now, but when then go to spend $60 next year, they'll forget all about how it would have cost the same at $50/year for two years.
Really, Microsoft would have been better off charging $100 for those same two years up front.
Really, Microsoft would have been better off charging $100 for those same two years up front.
08-30-10, 01:16 PM
#1403
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re: The official Xbox 360 thread - the console of choice on nuclear submarines
The point is not that they should stick to the $50 price point forever. The point is that they should clearly communicate the thinking and reasoning behind the change. They did a terrible job explaining why the price is changing now. Without such an explanation, it just feels like they are bumping up the price because they feel that they can get away with it.
08-30-10, 01:22 PM
#1404
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re: The official Xbox 360 thread - the console of choice on nuclear submarines
The point is not that they should stick to the $50 price point forever. The point is that they should clearly communicate the thinking and reasoning behind the change. They did a terrible job explaining why the price is changing now. Without such an explanation, it just feels like they are bumping up the price because they feel that they can get away with it.
08-30-10, 01:30 PM
#1405
DVD Talk Hero
re: The official Xbox 360 thread - the console of choice on nuclear submarines
I just posted this on another forum and I think it bears repeating here:
I'm gonna have to go ahead and call this statement out. The fact is it costs a lot of money to house server farms. From the 24/7 99.99999% uptime, full support staff, utilities, facilities, data-warehousing, etc, etc.
Also, every week more and more games come out. More and more people buy Xboxes. And more and more people join XBL. Every new person and new game adds to the load. Increased load means increased demand on those servers. How do you alleviate load? Scaling. You have to expand those server farms. You have to continually improve the back-end to keep the users from noticing the extra impact.
It's an amazing technical feat and the cost is totally justified, they're just not coming out and saying all of this because, really, people don't understand what they're paying for nor would they think it's necessary because "It works fine right now, you don't need more!" Well, yes, they do.
Also, every week more and more games come out. More and more people buy Xboxes. And more and more people join XBL. Every new person and new game adds to the load. Increased load means increased demand on those servers. How do you alleviate load? Scaling. You have to expand those server farms. You have to continually improve the back-end to keep the users from noticing the extra impact.
It's an amazing technical feat and the cost is totally justified, they're just not coming out and saying all of this because, really, people don't understand what they're paying for nor would they think it's necessary because "It works fine right now, you don't need more!" Well, yes, they do.
08-30-10, 01:30 PM
#1406
DVD Talk Legend
08-30-10, 01:31 PM
#1407
DVD Talk Legend
Thread Starter
08-30-10, 01:32 PM
#1408
DVD Talk Legend
08-30-10, 01:34 PM
#1409
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re: The official Xbox 360 thread - the console of choice on nuclear submarines
Why so people could go "FUCK ESPN! I WON'T USE IT!"? See previous posts. No matter what they pointed to as the reasoning people would just focus their ire on that particular thing. I actually love that they didn't say why or try to explain it off as part of other services. It's left everybody just bitching about it in general and saying retarded shit like "I'm canceling!" or "PS3 here I come!" all of which will never happen from the majority of folks. But they have nothing to react to other than generalities of the Xbox Live service and Microsoft.
08-30-10, 01:35 PM
#1410
DVD Talk Hero
08-30-10, 01:36 PM
#1411
DVD Talk Hero
08-30-10, 01:37 PM
#1412
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re: The official Xbox 360 thread - the console of choice on nuclear submarines
If they can't justify the price increase, then they deserve to have everybody bitching at them. They don't have to point to one specific thing - just feed us some B.S. about the cost of maintenance going up, or "new features and services" coming soon. But the Major Nelson announcement has nothing. If you don't see that as bad business, I don't know what to tell you.
08-30-10, 01:38 PM
#1413
DVD Talk Legend
re: The official Xbox 360 thread - the console of choice on nuclear submarines
08-30-10, 01:39 PM
#1414
DVD Talk Legend
re: The official Xbox 360 thread - the console of choice on nuclear submarines
a) Actual game servers aren't hosted by MS. Most of the bandwidth and processing is offloaded to users and users' Xbox 360s.
b) Server farms get cheaper (per user) as more people join. The cost per user is going down, not up. The new users coming on are paying their yearly fee too; it isn't like they're coming on for free.
c) Computing power continues to go up and up. MS gets more server bang for their buck now than they did when the service started.
08-30-10, 01:40 PM
#1415
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re: The official Xbox 360 thread - the console of choice on nuclear submarines
Agreed, 99% of the people complaining now would still be complaining anyway. But I'm shocked that a company with as much history as Microsoft would completely bungle a fairly simple business principle like that.
08-30-10, 01:43 PM
#1416
DVD Talk Hero
re: The official Xbox 360 thread - the console of choice on nuclear submarines
I don't know how matchmaking or TrueSkill or social play are implemented. I don't know where the server ends and the host(s) begin. I don't know where Microsoft's servers end and the developers' begin.
I don't know. Do you? Does anyone? My point is, strictly technically speaking, there's a lot of shit going on behind the scenes and for some dude to say it's completely unjustified is not thinking of what it takes to make a service like that run.
08-30-10, 01:46 PM
#1417
DVD Talk Hero
re: The official Xbox 360 thread - the console of choice on nuclear submarines
That is pretty wrong considering that
a) Actual game servers aren't hosted by MS. Most of the bandwidth and processing is offloaded to users and users' Xbox 360s.
b) Server farms get cheaper (per user) as more people join. The cost per user is going down, not up. The new users coming on are paying their yearly fee too; it isn't like they're coming on for free.
c) Computing power continues to go up and up. MS gets more server bang for their buck now than they did when the service started.
a) Actual game servers aren't hosted by MS. Most of the bandwidth and processing is offloaded to users and users' Xbox 360s.
b) Server farms get cheaper (per user) as more people join. The cost per user is going down, not up. The new users coming on are paying their yearly fee too; it isn't like they're coming on for free.
c) Computing power continues to go up and up. MS gets more server bang for their buck now than they did when the service started.
There's one dude with his feet up at a desk watching a dashboard and pushing a button every 108 minutes to keep it all working smoothly?
08-30-10, 01:47 PM
#1418
DVD Talk Legend
re: The official Xbox 360 thread - the console of choice on nuclear submarines
Oh and I forgot....
d) The game companies are footing some/most(?) of the bill for game-specific server functions that aren't done on 360s. This is why, for example, EA has shut down servers for dozens of games.
d) The game companies are footing some/most(?) of the bill for game-specific server functions that aren't done on 360s. This is why, for example, EA has shut down servers for dozens of games.
08-30-10, 01:48 PM
#1419
DVD Talk Legend
08-30-10, 01:49 PM
#1421
DVD Talk Legend
08-30-10, 01:51 PM
#1422
DVD Talk Hero
re: The official Xbox 360 thread - the console of choice on nuclear submarines
And all I'm saying is that over the last 7 or 8 years, the sheer amount of stuff they do directly support has increased significantly. If they want 2.74 cents more a day from me, well, I think I can scrounge that up.
08-30-10, 01:52 PM
#1423
DVD Talk Legend
re: The official Xbox 360 thread - the console of choice on nuclear submarines
I do know everybody else offers this service for free.
Clearly there's a disconnect in what Microsoft is offering for $60 a month.
08-30-10, 02:05 PM
#1425
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re: The official Xbox 360 thread - the console of choice on nuclear submarines
I don't mind the increase. I'm also covered until 2013 and would probably buy more cards if they are around $30.
I also think that PSN+ somehow helped Microsoft for this increase. PSN+, ESPN, etc.
And please, Xbox Live is not a web service where most of the points apply about reducing costs over time. This is a custom system that has been heavily modified over time. If you have worked in any IT project you know how hard is to deploy new versions in a live application and all the costs included in that.
I also think that PSN+ somehow helped Microsoft for this increase. PSN+, ESPN, etc.
And please, Xbox Live is not a web service where most of the points apply about reducing costs over time. This is a custom system that has been heavily modified over time. If you have worked in any IT project you know how hard is to deploy new versions in a live application and all the costs included in that.
