PopcornTreeCt

I'm just going from personal experience. Last generation I had a PS2 and an Xbox and hardly played both of them. This generation I'm playing the hell out of 360 and some PS3. I'm sure that it's not all attributed to graphics as Live gets me to play a whole lot.

SteveOVig

I think it's quite easy for me to say that this generation further proves that good graphics are the only factor most mainstream gamers give a damn about. I hear all these people comparing the Wii to the Gamecube and I think it's ridiculous. Just because the Wii can't do BS HD (like anyone owns an HDTV these days, especially casual gamers) or just because the console can't do visuals like the PS3 or Xbox. The Wii's graphics are still damn good but people still continue to bitch. People are talking about how Nintendo doesn't play to the hardcore gamers anymore. Quite frankly, I consider myself a hardcore gamer, and the Wii is the only system I have fun playing. I can count the number of games that interest me on both the PS3 and the Xbox on one hand. Yet, I can count a ton of games that interest me on the Wii coming from Nintendo.

I don't know, maybe I'm a different breed of hardcore gamer than a lot of other people. I don't want crappy interactive movies with stupid lead characters, like most of the PS3 and Xbox games I see. As I see it, most of those games aren't very deep at all but get put in the deep category because they're 1,000 hours long. Of course, they're usually that long due to crappy additions to games that don't make sense, etc. On the Wii side of things, I'm really looking forward to playing Ghost Squad, RE:UC, Nights, and the Wii Zapper, along with playing my copy of Mario Galaxy.

I just think that the criticism of the Wii is unfair. I've thoroughly enjoyed my Wii since I got it earlier this year and anticipate playing many more fun games.

fumanstan

Heh, it's funny to see you complain that games are too long and filled with fluff when the bigger complaint these days is that games are too short.

Drop

If everyone had HDTVs than the Wii would've had no choice but to be High-Def, so it's an irrelevant point.

Superboy

True. Converting to HD is a HUGE step for most people. They still watch TV on old CRTs that will probably last another 10-15 years before they see any loss in picture quality whatsoever. I should know, I used to sell them.

CreatureX

It's funny to see people complain that the Wii is not HD, when a lot of the big games on Xbox 360 and PS3 are not true HD either.

Halo 3 not HD

Call of Duty 4 not HD

darkside

That's okay, most of the people telling me how amazing Gears of War and Halo 3 looked were playing those games on standard def TVs.

tonyc3742

I have an HDTV, and while good games that look great are excellent (BioShock was indeed beautiful), I'd rather play a fun game that's SD than a crappy game that looks great. I got the Wii in February, and for a while played the crap out of it. However, I don't think I've even turned it on in two months or so, since I got my 360. Some of that might be 'new toy' syndrome, making me focus on the newer 360, since I've never had two "new" consoles at the same time, and some may be that the Wii games I got just don't have longevity, or the addictiveness that some of my 360 games have. Though the Wii is marketed as the 'casual gamer' console, there's plenty of room for casual gamers, cheap, on the 360 with XBLA and the demos you can download.
I am sick of hearing about "hardcore gamers" and all the gamercred resentment of the Wii. Each console is doing something different this gen--Wii, motion controls and 'casual' market, PS3, HD, the entertainment aspect and Home, 360, HD, XBLA and Live, and they're seeing varying levels of success. I think there's room in the market for all three, sometimes even in the same household (I haven't encountered very many "young child" games on 360, but there's many on the Wii that would be suitable). To me the 'hardcore' arguments seem to boil down to two things: first, "give me a game featuring the characters I grew up with, forget all your newfangled inclusionary tactics", or second, "we don't want all these soccer moms and little kids playing our game system, we've supported them for years". I can see a bit of that, because if the soccer moms keep buying Minigames 24, someone will keep making them, but while Nintendo's trying to make money in that market (they are a business after all), hopefully they're not stupid enough to just write off Mario and Smash and Metroid fans. However, they realize those fans are fans, and are probably willing to be more patient between releases, so Nintendo is trying to pull in as many of the 'soccer moms' as possible. Plus, the 'hardcore' gamer is more likely to be a more competitive shopper and try to find deals or buy/trade used games, whereas Jane Doe is more likely to go to Walmart and pick up a brand new game, which is better for Nintendo.

An interesting point was mentioned earlier about HD being a major revolution in gaming. Here are some other "revolutions" this gen (and to an extent the previous one) has brought us:
* HD or near-HD graphic capabilities
* motion sensing a la Wii (still waiting for "true" motion sensing)
* wireless controllers virtually standard
* HD
* DD/in-game multichannel audio
* "media center' functionality of a console
* free and pay DLC (this is a good and a bad thing)
* proof that people will pay nontrivial sums of money for heavily-DRMed DLC and microtransactions (again good and bad thing)
I'm sure there's more.
Of those, I think graphics is the least 'revolutionary'. Wireless controllers makes gaming much easier, especially in today's environment of larger home theater rooms (then again, this one, like graphics, might not be "revolutionary" but "evolutionary", it had to happen given the evolution and acceptance of gaming and integration into the home theater instead of the "basement tv"). I personally think in-game multichannel audio is one of the more impressive though subtle advances, though motion sensing controls is definitely one of the more visible advances.

If everyone was HD, then the Wii would have had to support HD; but then the cost and price might be higher, which would likely affect sales, which means the Wii might not be doing as well as it is with "soccer moms". If the Wii was HD, and nothing else changed, the whole dynamic of this gen might be different.

Wii naysayers bring up the lower attach rate as a negative, as a reason the 360 or PS3 is "doing better". However, I don't think that's a very strong argument. First, I'd bet a higher percentage of Wii games are bought new and for full price (Halo 3 notwithstanding). Second, I would think that for most Wii games, especially some of the shovelware third party, development costs are relatively low, so per-game profit should be higher. And if Nintendo is making money on the console itself, they don't need a high attach rate to "break even" like other console manufacturers using the Gillette method. Plus, if they've sold more consoles (not sure where the numbers are now), they can afford a lower attach rate.

Anyway, I think the Wii is doing well with what it's trying to do, make gaming mainstream. Whether that's "good" or "bad" for the industry long-term remains to be seen.

fumanstan

To be fair, they're still a lot better graphically then anything on the Wii I'd say people mentioning the lack of HD on the Wii is more a statement towards the graphical ability of the Wii rather then specifically saying "true HD"

Giantrobo

It's too bad this thread fell into the HD gaming debate.

msdmoney

I've only had the Wii since July and I love it so far. I think it is really starting to grow into its controls with game like SMG, and in one year it definitely has had a solid lineup of quality games. I really enjoyed Zelda and Rayman Raving Rabbids, and I am enjoying Zack & Wiki so far. Super Mario Galaxy continues to amaze me, it consistently redefines what makes a platformer. It just shows why Nintendo can continue to sell Mario games, it's fresher and newer than 99% of games out there, despite being a Mario game.

Red Steel was awful, absolutely atrocious, but I don't think that is the Wii's fault, it needed more development time.

I think the problem is, for people that bought around launch, they immediately wrote off the Wii as a gimmick/fad when the post launch drought hit earlier this year. The DS went through the same phase, so did the 360, but for some reason everyone forgot about that period that every console goes through.

Even though everyone else has already weighed in on this, I'll give my two cents. I don't think hd graphics sell a gaming system to your average consumer even those with hdtv's. I think the reason the wii is selling and the other systems aren't (as much) is accessibility. For most consumers that is the biggest barrier to entry with gaming systems, the controls are just too complicated and unintuitive. It takes a lot to persuade a nongamer to try a game. Your average nongamer is just going to get frustrated with the learning curve playing Halo, Gears of War, etc. before they even have a chance to get immersed in the hd experience. With Wii sports they can be playing and having fun within minutes, in addition to creating their Mii. Anecdotaly I have numerous nongaming friends/family including my girlfriends parents and a nongaming friend, both with hdtv's, pick up the Wii because they can actualy participate.

I have the same complaint, I think value is too often only associated with a games length without regard to whether the game merits that length. For most games I think there is a lot of filler that could be removed.

superdeluxe

Honestly? I got my Wii last feburary, Played the CRAP out of Wii Sports and Zelda for awhile. Then basically it gathered dust for about 3 months. Then I played some old Gamecubes on the Wii, but that last only another 1-2 months. Until Guitar Hero III came out, I really didnt touch the Wii for 3-4 months again. But then I've pretty much been playing it non-stop since then. Now I am on a guitar hero vacation because of super mario galaxy..and those two games should give me more than enough gaming until Super Smash brothers brawl comes along.

So 3-4 months ago, I thought the Wii was kind of a bad investment, i mean other than when we have guests come over for wii sports..when its just myself around..I never touched it for long stretches.

Goat3001

I have an HDTV and I don't own a PS3 or 360. I don't plan on getting a PS3 until a few good sports games come out. I don't plan on getting a 360 at all.

tpc

I bought the Wii on day one, after camping out. Personally, I've never regretted the purchase, but I probably don't game as often as most of you. I also own a 360 and a DS that I play alot, but I really only get into maybe 1 game a month.

On the Wii, I've beaten Zelda, Spent a lot of time with Rayman Raving Rabbids, Super Paper Mario, Metroid, and Wii Sports, as well as had some fun nostalgia trips via the Virtual Console. I've also played some crap, like whichever version of Call of Duty launched with it, and Madden 08, which while I can see its charms, just wasn't my thing.

It's still lacking in online play, but I'm not into that very much. There's still a library of great games (or so I hear) out there that I've not had time to get to. I've never played RE4, so I'm looking forward to that, Galaxy of course, and I'm intrigued by Zack and Wiki.

Interspersed with the other systems, I've got no regrets. However, if it were my only system, and I played more, I could totally see how the criticisms would be valid.

SmackDaddy

Well, for me the Wii is a really big hit. I have a Wii, 360 and a gaming PC. The 360 gets the least use, the Wii the most.

Plus, any game system that can get my 70 year old mom playing a video game is pretty awesome. She bowled a 170 (with 3 strikes) her first game!! Plus we won the mother/son Thanksgiving bowling shoot-out!

RayChuang

I can say that the biggest reason why the Wii has sold very well is the fact that the game controller forces you do to more "natural" arm motion to play the game. That's what makes Wii Sports so much fun to play. Just wait until you try Soulcalibur Legends--you move the Wii controller like you're wielding a real sword.

I do think that within a year Nintendo will do a "hardware refresh" for the Wii with a higher-end model that adds HDTV support and hard disk storage so MMORPG (massive-multiplayer online role-playing gaming) becames possible.

dvdsteve2000

I would honestly (maybe) be more into the Wii if they released a standard controller. I work 10 hour days, I want to sit my ass down to play a video game, not wail around like an epileptic 10 year old.

MadonnasManOne

The Wii remote doesn't require anyone to "wail around like an epileptic 10 year old."

fumanstan

Yes, but for some games it's certainly more fun. You can sit on the couch and flick your wrist for Wii Bowling but it's more fun to stand up and make actual bowling motions.

But i agree, i'm surprised people still make that complaint about the Wii. It's pretty stupid that people still assume so.

Groucho

Based on what? I don't see either happening within a year.Maybe you should try playing it before you criticize. And maybe you should read up on this forum's rules about console bashing.

CreatureX

Yes they blow away anything seen on the Wii. But the point is that before the Wii was released, Nintendo told us that the Wii would not be an HD machine and that it would only be slightly more powerful than the Gamecube. It was not some surprise Nintendo revealed after we bought the system.

MS and Sony on the other hand, they went on and on about bringing gaming into the HD era, how their systems cost so much because of all the power they possess. But then they release their games and they're not even HD?

It seems the companies people should be complaining about should be MS and Sony for not living up to their "HD era" promise. I know I would be pissed if I bought one of their expensive systems based on their lies.

With the Wii, I already knew what to expect with my purchase. And Nintendo has delivered everything they said they would.

Giantrobo

I know what you're trying to say but come on man.

dvdsteve2000

I bought a Wii on release day so believe me, I've played it, and how is saying "I would honestly (maybe) be more into the Wii if they released a standard controller. I work 10 hour days, I want to sit my ass down to play a video game, not wail around like an epileptic 10 year old." console bashing?

I knew not to post in this thread. The title should be changed from Nintendo: Wiiflections on the year" to "Let's praise the Wii", because obviously any criticism surely doesn't belong in this thread. I've owned the Wii for as long as it has been possible to own, and while I would love to go off on a rant about why I really don't like the Wii, I kept my comments civil. The 'epileptic 10 year old' comment was made in my house while my wife & I were watching my son trying to pump up a power meter on the strength-test game on Carnival Games. I apologize that I took a stab at humor, and maybe if you'd have seen my son at that time you would understand the comment.

[Rodney Dangerfield voice]I tell ya, tough crowd![/Rodney Dangerfield voice]

tonyc3742

Has NIntendo expressed an interest in MMORPGs? I would think from their resistance to making online gaming easy, and their professed desire to protect the children, they wouldn't want to support MMORPGs.

Some games are more flail-centric than others; sometimes I don't mind flailing, and other times I want to be lazy on the couch.

Jeremy517

The only thing I stand for is Wii Sports bowling. I don't stand for any of my other games or for any of the other sports in Wii Sports. If you are complaining about having to stand, then play the other 90% of Wii games that don't require you to stand.