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Re: Lost -- "316" -- 2/18/09
According to Hawking, the island has always been moving yet Ben has been to Tunisia more than once and the bear made the trip. It's safe to say that Tunisia will always be the exit point. It makes sense because it's wide open desert and they're not likely to build anything out there to get in the way of the landing.
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Re: Lost -- "316" -- 2/18/09
I assume the exit point for the island can change, just as the entry mechanism does.
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Re: Lost -- "316" -- 2/18/09
Originally Posted by Flave
(Post 9279234)
Why not?
A friend of a friend of mine bought a 45' yacht in Alaska and sailed it home to New Zealand. It took him about six weeks. These yachts can easily do 10 knots and, if you're sailing round the clock, that's about 250 nautical miles per day. I guesstimate that a trip from UK to LA (via Panama) would be about 5000 nautical miles so at 10 knots this would take about 3 weeks. |
Re: Lost -- "316" -- 2/18/09
A few things I don't *think* I saw mentioned in the thread yet.
1) Ben said his mother taught him to read. His mother died in childbirth. Might have been a throwaway line, but struck me as weird. 2) John 3:16: "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish, but have everlasting life." John's suicide note: "I wish you had believed me." Locke as Jesus isn't new, but they are really pressing it now. |
Re: Lost -- "316" -- 2/18/09
Of course, do we know when Desmond was on that boat in relation to "now." It could have been any time in the last 3 years.
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Re: Lost -- "316" -- 2/18/09
Not any time as little Chuck is quite the toddler.
But it isn't clear exactly when he was at Widmore's getting the address in L.A. |
Re: Lost -- "316" -- 2/18/09
Originally Posted by DVD Josh
(Post 9279798)
A few things I don't *think* I saw mentioned in the thread yet.
1) Ben said his mother taught him to read. His mother died in childbirth. Might have been a throwaway line, but struck me as weird. |
Re: Lost -- "316" -- 2/18/09
Whatever, he saw his mother in the woods chasing the bunny. Maybe she had some hooked on phonics stuff out there.
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Re: Lost -- "316" -- 2/18/09
Originally Posted by DVD Josh
(Post 9279798)
A few things I don't *think* I saw mentioned in the thread yet.
1) Ben said his mother taught him to read. His mother died in childbirth. Might have been a throwaway line, but struck me as weird. 2) John 3:16: "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish, but have everlasting life." John's suicide note: "I wish you had believed me." Locke as Jesus isn't new, but they are really pressing it now. |
Re: Lost -- "316" -- 2/18/09
Sorry guys :(
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Re: Lost -- "316" -- 2/18/09
Originally Posted by cracksky
(Post 9279611)
According to Hawking, the island has always been moving yet Ben has been to Tunisia more than once and the bear made the trip. It's safe to say that Tunisia will always be the exit point. It makes sense because it's wide open desert and they're not likely to build anything out there to get in the way of the landing.
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Re: Lost -- "316" -- 2/18/09
Originally Posted by Draven
(Post 9279253)
Because she was acting like whatever she did was horrible and seemed to be in a fragile state. I would be concerned enough in that situation to demand to know what she had done to my nephew, and not immediately jumped in the sack with her.
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Re: Lost -- "316" -- 2/18/09
I believe the reason Kate doesn't want Jack to ask her about what happened to Aaron anymore is because she gave him to Sawyer's daughter's Mom, Cassidy in Albuquerque. Sawyer told Kate he had a daughter before jumping from the helicopter and now she's had three years to track her down. I bet it was quite a surprise when she found Cassidy there whom she had previously bonded with over visiting her own Mother while scamming the Feds. I'm sure she trusts her to keep Aaron safe.
Although, we all know that Aaron must be reunited with Claire. |
Re: Lost -- "316" -- 2/18/09
Makes you wonder with all this time jumping if it turns out Jack is actually Christian's father.
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Re: Lost -- "316" -- 2/18/09
no it doesn't
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Re: Lost -- "316" -- 2/18/09
Originally Posted by cracksky
(Post 9280456)
Although, we all know that Aaron must be reunited with Claire.
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Re: Lost -- "316" -- 2/18/09
Didnt the writers at one point say Claire wouldn't be back until next season?
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Re: Lost -- "316" -- 2/18/09
Originally Posted by Deadman31
(Post 9280797)
Didnt the writers at one point say Claire wouldn't be back until next season?
Spoiler:
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Re: Lost -- "316" -- 2/18/09
Originally Posted by tcoursen
(Post 9276776)
The whole plane thing was just odd.
They didn't sit next to each other or anything like that. Kate and Jack spent the night together the night before, but then on the plane they were not really talking. Hurley who they are all friends with they were not talking to. Lapidus sees all them and just keeps on flying the plane instead of just turning it around and saying F this. What's Frank supposed to do? Radio the tower and tell them he has to turn back because he knows his plane's going to crash on a wacky island with polar bears and smoke monsters? |
Re: Lost -- "316" -- 2/18/09
Originally Posted by DthRdrX
(Post 9280737)
I don't know if that is clear. Malkin told Claire she had to raise the kid prior to the crash, but she just walked away from Aaron when Christian showed up. We also have never found out if Claire is alive anymore or not. Remember Miles made a comment to her last season about it.
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Re: Lost -- "316" -- 2/18/09
Originally Posted by cracksky
(Post 9281103)
Claire was told she and she alone must raise Aaron. The psychic was so frightened by his vision that he bought her a plane ticket on a doomed flight instead of warning everyone on that flight. Aaron was counted as one of the O6 so he should have come back to the island on flight 316. After nearly 4 months, I'm sure Claire has probably forgotten about the prediction if she ever believed it.
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Re: Lost -- "316" -- 2/18/09
Originally Posted by DthRdrX
(Post 9278879)
BTW anyone find it odd that no one even bothered to ask Ben why it looks like he got the crap kicked out of him?
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Re: Lost -- "316" -- 2/18/09
Originally Posted by cracksky
(Post 9281103)
Claire was told she and she alone must raise Aaron. The psychic was so frightened by his vision that he bought her a plane ticket on a doomed flight instead of warning everyone on that flight. Aaron was counted as one of the O6 so he should have come back to the island on flight 316. After nearly 4 months, I'm sure Claire has probably forgotten about the prediction if she ever believed it.
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Re: Lost -- "316" -- 2/18/09
Originally Posted by pinata242
(Post 9279491)
I think the antipodal explanation worked just fine when it was simply "South Pacific -> Tunisia", but that's just what the internet used to justify it, right? That was never confirmed in the show.
Damon Lindelof: Alright, I've got a question for you Carlton. This is from Acejace. As an avid U.K. follower of Lost I would like to thank you for the quality entertainment that you've helped produce over the last four years, I can't wait to see what you've got in store for us over the next few seasons. My question is regarding antipodes, or the regions which lie on opposite sides of the globe. Um, if you put a needle through uh, Tunisia it ends up coming out in the South Pacific; Interestingly enough. Carlton Cuse: Hmmm... Damon Lindelof: So, as we know, Ben and possibly a DHARMA polar bear appear to have warped from the island to Tunisia. Unfortunately the bear's Bedouin ambushing skills weren't as up to scratch as Mister Linus's. However; does this mean that the transportation from or to the island via antipodal points on the globe is the Lost teleportation transport some sort of journey through the center of the earth? And if that's the case, could it also be possible that Yemi's light aircraft - this is the yellow drug smugglers' plane featured prominently in seasons one and two - Carlton Cuse: Right. Damon Lindelof: ... ended up going through this antipodal wormhole to the island on its way from Nigeria to Europe, via Tunisia? Anyway thanks again and continue the good work with the show, Jason. Carlton Cuse: Wow. That is an excellent question, and uh, I would say that the antipode part of that theory is very intriguing; however some of the conclusions derived regarding the application of antipode theory might not be exactly correct. Damon Lindelof: Good answer. Carlton Cuse: Ok. Damon Lindelof: Very thorough, and completely vague. Also, remember when Hawking was using the pendulum to find the island? She had a computer screen with a number of locations (marked by intersecting lines) on a world map: http://www.officiallost.com/index.ph...ach=3186;image What if the island only jumps amongst a fixed number of locations? Those locations being the ones Hawking had on this map. Also, as the questioner above brings up, they've never explained how a dinky little short-range airplane (the drug plane) flying out of Nigeria ends up on an island in the middle of the South Pacific. Maybe one of these positions is just off the coast of Nigeria (we can't see this on the map). So, could the island have been at this position when the Nigerian plane crashed on the island? And finally, here's an interesting interview snippet the guys did with EW: EW: Lost has always walked this balance between being a character-driven survival show that everyone can appreciate and being a sci-fi/fantasy show best appreciated by fans of that genre. This season, you’ve really pushed the sci-fi/fantasy angle. Does this approach come with risk? CARLTON CUSE: We’re trying to be bold. We realized we were going to shed some viewers by being more overtly [sci-fi] this season perhaps, but that we would reward the viewers who have stuck around for the turn in the show with some really good and interesting storytelling. DAMON LINDELOF: But the show has gotten to that point now where it had to let its freak flag fly. It kind of needed to begin to announce, “You wanna know what the island is? You wanna know why these people were brought to the island? You wanna know what their purpose in being brought there is? It might be a little weirder than you would’ve hoped.” In addition, there’s always been this risk of what happens when you start giving people answers. You know, once you start telling people who the last Cyclon is, they all start whining about it. Now, the one thing that we didn’t ever want to do was not give our audience the answers. At the same time, it was really important to us this significant part of our show — the history of The Island — through the first-person perspective of characters that the audience cares about. Hence, time travel. And that’s what informed our storytelling this year. We hope that once you’ve sort of swallowed the bitter pill of skipping through time, you’ll really like it. CC: I wouldn’t call it a bitter pill. I like to think of it as a good tasting piece of candy. DL: It’s like one of those Lemonheads — it’s really sour in your mouth at first, but if you leave it there for a minute… CC: It’s ultimately pretty sweet. DL: Either way, we hope the audience is patient enough to get to the tasty part, because we’re trying to bridge this gap of what happened between the time the Oceanic 6 left The Island — and when John Locke left The Island — to when the Oceanic 6 decide to come back. The audience got a sneak peek of what the resolution to all this is last season, which is that Locke is going to die. We’ve seen him in the coffin. We know that his death triggered Jack to want to jump off a bridge and catalyzed him to get everyone back together to go to the island. Now we’re bridging the remaining gaps. By the seventh episode of this year [i.e., by next week’s episode, “The Life and Death of Jeremy Bentham”], the audience will have all the pertinent data that bridges these events. And then we move into phase two of the season, and with phase two comes a new sense of sort of excitement and anxiety for us as writers because we’re changing the game again. CC: I think that each season of the show has had a different flavor to it, but we’re not going to deny [that sci-fi] is in the DNA of the show. Look, this is a genre show. We’re very happy that it has attracted a big audience, we pay a lot of attention to the character stories, but we are not running from the fact that it’s a genre show. I think, in the same way that when you get to the end of an Indiana Jones movie and someone’s face melts off, the journey from A to Z in Lost is going to require that it get weirder and more overtly genre as it goes along. When you start asking questions like “What is The Island?” and “What is the smoke monster?”, the answers to those questions are probably not completely rooted in natural science. DL: But honestly, the non-genre answer is just boring and not that interesting. How can Locke walk around on the island? The non-genre answer is his injury was primarily psychosomatic. He actually had the ability to walk for several years, but for some reason, crashing on the island psychologically freed him to walk again. That’s one answer to the mystery. If we gave that answer, people would throw their television sets out the window and then kill us. The actual answer is a genre answer, because if you’ve been in a wheelchair for four years and suddenly you’re doing jumping jacks, the natural world does not have a good response to that….Still, while this is indeed a genre show, we don’t feel like it’s weird or too science fictiony. I think if you think about a movie like Close Encounters Of The Third Kind, for some reason that doesn’t feel like it’s devoutly sci-fi because you’re treating it through this prism: “If Richard Dreyfuss really saw a UFO, and was sort of profoundly affected by it, what would happen? Let’s really treat this in a very real way.” We try to hold the show to the same standards. We don’t want to be putting out there a show that just gets weirder and weirder. We needed to do this story this year in order to set up where we need to go in Season 6, which although will still have genre elements, becomes much more grounded and character centric than it is this year. This year is a lot of setup, putting all the pieces on the chessboard where they need to be so that we can hopefully mate. And Carlton and I are mating right now. CC: Please, put that metaphor out there into the world. |
Re: Lost -- "316" -- 2/18/09
Originally Posted by JZ1276
(Post 9276523)
i still am confused why Eloise told Jack they had to try and re-create the original plane crash if she said there was already a window open for 36 hrs for them to get back to the island.
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Re: Lost -- "316" -- 2/18/09
Originally Posted by DthRdrX
(Post 9281129)
You think she 'forgot' about the man and his predictions after stating in one of her flashback episodes that she believed he knew the entire time that the plane would crash and they would be stuck there together?
The real problem with Aaron being off the island and three years older now is that even if he was brought back he had already been Raised By Another (Kate) for those three years and if he and Claire were reunited would she even recognize him or want him (since she was going to give him up for adoption before anyway). Side Note: Charlotte was born in 1979 so if everyone has traveled to the early 70's it'll be hard for Daniel to warn her. I'm guessing that when they flashed out of the plane they didn't end up in present day but in the mid to late 80's. Maybe '88 when Danielle arrives. Perhaps Kate, Jack, Jin & Hugo are there while Ben, Sayid, Sun & Frank landed in another time. |
Re: Lost -- "316" -- 2/18/09
there seems to be one episode worth of information missing here, regarding Hurley, Sayid and Kate's circumstances. Damon and Carlton did mention they wrote episodes 6/7 at the same time and "316" was written as the second part (episode 7), but they decided to air it as episode 6.
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Re: Lost -- "316" -- 2/18/09
Originally Posted by PopcornTreeCt
(Post 9280626)
Makes you wonder with all this time jumping if it turns out Jack is actually Christian's father.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...Philip_Fry.png |
Re: Lost -- "316" -- 2/18/09
I think it's hilarious that Daniel named his lab rat after his Mom, Eloise. :rotfl:
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Re: Lost -- "316" -- 2/18/09
Easily the best ep of the season.
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Re: Lost -- "316" -- 2/18/09
easily the worst episode of the season.
there was zero sense of wonder. i thought getting back to the island would be something spectacular, something detailed, spread out over a number of episodes. this was lousy writing. |
Re: Lost -- "316" -- 2/18/09
Originally Posted by GenPion
(Post 9281109)
I think this is an important plot-line, and a that Aaron is one of the show's big wild-cards. I don't know how, but something spooky is definitely going to happen with his character. Probably in season six I'd bet.
I'm starting to think Christian is the Devil. When Locke entered the cabin to get instructions from Jacob he found Christian sitting in the exact same chair, same position that Jacob was in when he said, 'Help Me,' to John previously. Perhaps Christian has found a way to take over Jacob maybe with the help of Claire. Jacob was trying to get through to Locke for help before but he didn't understand. With Christian in Jacob's chair he can now safely say anything to John and be believed. 'I can speak on His behalf.' He wanted John to move the island but I don't believe that's what Jacob wanted. Christian has been a bad dude while alive. How can we believe that he's so helpful on the island all of a sudden? Maybe Ben was right when he said they were they good guys. It's possibly a crazy theory but I was also thinking about when Christian visited Jack in the Hospital and the smoke alarm went off. Maybe the heat from Devil would trigger the alarm. Who knows. :) |
Re: Lost -- "316" -- 2/18/09
Christian has been a bad dude while alive. |
Re: Lost -- "316" -- 2/18/09
Originally Posted by cracksky
(Post 9281547)
As I said, it's been 4 months and they've all been through a lot in that time. Claire has been (rightly) focused on caring for Aaron as her priority on the island. Maybe she hasn't forgotten the prediction because she is raising him so all is well (she thinks).
The real problem with Aaron being off the island and three years older now is that even if he was brought back he had already been Raised By Another (Kate) for those three years and if he and Claire were reunited would she even recognize him or want him (since she was going to give him up for adoption before anyway). Side Note: Charlotte was born in 1979 so if everyone has traveled to the early 70's it'll be hard for Daniel to warn her. I'm guessing that when they flashed out of the plane they didn't end up in present day but in the mid to late 80's. Maybe '88 when Danielle arrives. Perhaps Kate, Jack, Jin & Hugo are there while Ben, Sayid, Sun & Frank landed in another time. |
Re: Lost -- "316" -- 2/18/09
Originally Posted by Michael Ballack
(Post 9282351)
A flawed human being, a bad father perhaps, but he wasn't a bad guy in the scenes we saw so far.
Now Ben and Widmore have both been shown to be "bad guys" as they've been linked to multiple murders if not worse. |
Re: Lost -- "316" -- 2/18/09
Originally Posted by siddd5
(Post 9282243)
easily the worst episode of the season.
Originally Posted by B.A.
(Post 9281959)
Easily the best ep of the season.
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Re: Lost -- "316" -- 2/18/09
Originally Posted by DthRdrX
(Post 9282618)
I agree. Jack turns him in for drinking on the job and being responsible for a patient's death, but Jack himself wanted to perform a surgery to that bridge crash victim while still drugged out of his mind. The only difference is Jack was stopped by the new chief of surgery before he could do anything. Christian hasn't been proven to be any worse than Jack at this point.
Originally Posted by DthRdrX
(Post 9282618)
Now Ben and Widmore have both been shown to be "bad guys" as they've been linked to multiple murders if not worse.
BTW I just happened to see this about an upcoming character and I'm so very happy that it's being covered Spoiler:
Spoiler:
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Re: Lost -- "316" -- 2/18/09
Originally Posted by EW Interview
DL: But honestly, the non-genre answer is just boring and not that interesting. How can Locke walk around on the island? The non-genre answer is his injury was primarily psychosomatic. He actually had the ability to walk for several years, but for some reason, crashing on the island psychologically freed him to walk again. That’s one answer to the mystery. If we gave that answer, people would throw their television sets out the window and then kill us. The actual answer is a genre answer, because if you’ve been in a wheelchair for four years and suddenly you’re doing jumping jacks, the natural world does not have a good response to that….Still, while this is indeed a genre show, we don’t feel like it’s weird or too science fictiony. I think if you think about a movie like Close Encounters Of The Third Kind, for some reason that doesn’t feel like it’s devoutly sci-fi because you’re treating it through this prism: “If Richard Dreyfuss really saw a UFO, and was sort of profoundly affected by it, what would happen? Let’s really treat this in a very real way.” We try to hold the show to the same standards. We don’t want to be putting out there a show that just gets weirder and weirder. We needed to do this story this year in order to set up where we need to go in Season 6, which although will still have genre elements, becomes much more grounded and character centric than it is this year. This year is a lot of setup, putting all the pieces on the chessboard where they need to be so that we can hopefully mate. And Carlton and I are mating right now.
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Re: Lost -- "316" -- 2/18/09
Originally Posted by cracksky
(Post 9282710)
Being a bad parent is one of the worst things that you can ever do in this life. You're better off not having any kids at all. The only reason Jack is the way he is is because of his father. When you're an alcoholic and a bad dad, well, that transcends generations and effects many lives.
Ben has threatened to kill many times or have his people kill for him many times but that has never happened. As far as I can recall, the only time he's actually killed anyone has been bad guys like Keamy (the freighter occupants can't be chalked up to him) and that was payback for his daughter's murder. Off-island Ben had Sayid kill for him but we don't know why those people were on a list. If they were associated with Widmore then they were bad guys. Ben may or may not have killed someone before boarding flight 316. Who else has Ben directly or indirectly killed? BTW I just happened to see this about an upcoming character and I'm so very happy that it's being covered Spoiler:
I havn't even mentioned any of Ben' methods such as what he did to Karl or his lies and manipulations. Widmore sent the freighter to kill everyone on the island, snapped that guys neck a few weeks ago, and we assume he was behind digging up dozens of bodies and planting them on a fake plane in the ocean for his own personal gain. He also treated Desmond like garbage. Obviously, Christian is no where near comparison with these two guys yet. Every character on the show is flawed in one way or another, but Ben and Widmore are on another level. |
Re: Lost -- "316" -- 2/18/09
Originally Posted by DthRdrX
(Post 9282895)
Jack is like he is because he can't control his anger. They even made a point to show Christian trying to teach young Jack about facing failure and trying to cope with it.
Originally Posted by DthRdrX
(Post 9282895)
Ben killed his father. Most of Dharma, directly or indirectly. Ordering the death of two of his own people as well as Charlie in the Looking Glass. Making the comment that he wants everyone on the freighter to die, and not caring what happens to the flight 316 redshirts. Killing the two guys in the desert after he turned the donkey wheel, threatening to kill Widmore's daughter .... thats just off the top of my head.
I havn't even mentioned any of Ben' methods such as what he did to Karl or his lies and manipulations. Widmore sent the freighter to kill everyone on the island, snapped that guys neck a few weeks ago, and we assume he was behind digging up dozens of bodies and planting them on a fake plane in the ocean for his own personal gain. He also treated Desmond like garbage. Obviously, Christian is no where near comparison with these two guys yet. Every character on the show is flawed in one way or another, but Ben and Widmore are on another level. Ben - Roger, Keamy, two in desert Michael - Libby, Ana-Lucia Sawyer - Frank Duckett, Anthony Cooper, Tom Sayid - many, many people Jin - many people Sun - Colleen Kate - Wayne Locke - Naomi, Mikhail (1), Himself? Charlie - Ethan Rom, Himself Desmond - Mikhail (2) Juliet - Pickett Eko - two Others, man as a young boy, drug runners Ana-Lucia - Shannon, Goodwin Danielle - her entire crew Nikki & Paulo - old guy Alpert - many hostiles Widmore - many people Keamy - many people Mikhail - Bonnie, Greta, Bea Klugh, Himself (3) |
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