Here's why I think they want the four:

Jack, Kate and Sawyer because they came out and confronted The Others. Hugo, because of his connection to the numbers. The Others knew Walt was special maybe they know all about Hurley as well. I still think Dave will make another appearance.

I feel that Walt has been the one communticating with his Dad on an actual computer in the Hatch that is guarded. His powers come into play when he knows when his Dad is trying to contact him. I'm sure they don't watch him 24/7 down there and never expect him to be able to make contact with the outside world.

BTW, whatever happened to the film warning us about not using the computer for anything but punching in the numbers or there'd be another incident?

When Walt told his Dad the Others were 'pretending' I'm sure he was referring to them wearing disguises, beards, etc...

I think Desmond got to his sailboat and started out but the huge magnet brought him back in.

I hope we see in the finale what Fenry did with the numbers while Locke was under the blast doors. That's a key scene. As well as Hugo realizing who Libby is/was. I hope there's more flashback with her at the hospital.

BTW, remember, Fenry said they would never give back Walt. As special as they believe him to be (even with all the questions from Mrs. Klugh(less)), I don't think they'll give him up after the 'trade.' Especially with Sayid in the mix. It'll be interesting.

I wish I was as confident as you are to use words like "I'm Sure" when talking about LOST!

Kate found the beard and such in a completely different hatch. If this IS their real camp, why would they store the outfits way over there? I see them as being "in character" for this whole charade with Michael.

They are the ones "in charge" and they are using nets to catch fish while the Losties eat dropped food, have utensils, washer and dryer, etc? I'd think they'd have taken the supplies and the Swan silo over a long time ago, unless they have something better.

It's also possible that Michael is just imagining Walt was talking with him through the computer.

When Clue was asking about Walt appearing in places, she could have been referring to Shannon and Sayid seeing him.

I think it's more likely that it would mess up the instruments on the boat and he sailed back there by mistake.

I don't. Think about it. He said he crashed on the island, met his buddy and holed up in the hatch. If his boat was still functional why would he stay in the hatch at all? Why would anyone choose to live on a [somewhat]deserted island? Was he suffering from some ailment like Rose, Locke & Jin that enticed him to stay? It will definitely be interesting finding out.

OK, let's be realistic about Michael. As Bill Cosby says ("those of you with children will understand"). Put yourself on an island. You JUST PRIOR TO leaving Australia get the son who was ripped away from you back (Walt's mother took him against his wishes and all but forced him to let her new beau adopt him, forcing him to give up parental rites.

Fast forward to the island. You build a raft for you and your son to be rescued. The boy is literally ripped from your arms and you are left for dead.
You have now lost your son again; this time to complete strangers who are doing god knows what to him.

You assume he is still alive because they said they were taking him. You get a message seemingly from him telling you he is still alive and being held. The most important thing in your life becomes getting back your kidnapped son. (Have you ever seen people in real life that have their kids taken away? - The big difference here is that seemingly, no one else cares about the boy being missing - they all have their own problems.

You leave to find your son. (yes, to us at home that only want the story to move forward really can't empathize with him unless some one we know has been kidnapped. Screamming "WALT!!" can get annoyining, but NO ONE else is looking. At least in real life you have the police/FBI helping). While on the search for your son, you are captured by the very people that kidnapped him. They lead you a few days away and refuse to tell you where he is. So now, you are kidnapped also, and STILL being kept from your child. They finally let you see they boy and then rip him away again and tell you ~do this or you wil NEVER see your boy again.

Come on, people! You would do EXACTLY what he did. Was his acting unbelieveable? To us, yes. To the other people on the island that know he is literally going out of his mind to find his son, not really. Remeber, he told Jack (who apparently takes EVERYTHING at face value) that it had to be the five of them - no Sahiyd (sp). Sawyer invites him. He approaches Sahiyd and says basically, it is my decision. This is how it has to be. He is overcome with worry. If he doesn't do what they say, his boy is all but dead. He is falling apart!

People want him dead for acting like ANY PARENT WITH A MISSING CHILD WOULD! A few weeks ago, everybody wanted Charlie dead. "He is annoying, he is acting different" Then it was Ana Lucia, people were calling for Locke's death because he seemed out of character...

They are on an island. They are cut off. They have been there a VERY short time and alot has happened to them. It has taken us 2 years to watch essentially less than 2 months of their lives. What would you be like if your world were turned upside down like that. You can't walk... oh, nbow you can. Your dying, well not anymore. You are a wanted criminal, oh, but now you're the island hottie. You are 8 months pregnant and alone, now you have 45 people that care about your well being. You fall in love, oops, now she's dead.

Next week... God, Locke and Ecko are getting annoying. I hope the hatch collapses on them as soon as they discover what is REALLY going on.

When Ms. Clue told Michael that something happened and one of theirs was captured and held by his friends and if he wanted his son back he would have to free him. Michael said why don't you go get him yourself, Ms. clue said we can't. Why can't they ? They were stealing tailies all the time yet they pretty much left the other group alone. They wanted Walt yet they waited for him to be out on the raft to get him. Is there something about that side of the Island they want to avoid.

OK, he's out of his mind. Everyone gets that. But that doesn't mean everyone throws common sense out the window. They're going into a dangerous situation. Their lives will be on the line too. Michael's not in the best state of mind. Why not try to continue to reason with him instead of following him blindly? There is absolutely no justification that Hurley should go instead of Sayid. But "that's the way it has to be" is good enough?

And actually, it's not quite what ANY parent would do in that situation. Mel Gibson in Ransom said F.U. to the kidnappers. (OK, it's not real life, but neither is Lost)

By the way - LOST airs at 7PM EST in Canada - only because of "American Idol".

I find it interesting that one of the most popular characters on the show - Sayid - is Iraqi...kinda funny in this day and age. To repeat what others have said before, he really is the fucking man.

Does anyone know which hatch is the Rectangle at the Other's camp? C3, C4, or the crossed out one? Walt said go North, which would imply the crossed out one assuming the map is drawn with North up.

Perhaps the "Others" are kept from approaching the other test sites by the mysterious black smoke. I'd venture a guess that, for one reason or another, the are not allowed to go near the other areas. Maybe a Dharma rule?

I figured out why they want Hurley. It's another Dharma test, to see how gullible the losties are.

Anyone else think Walt was in on it, and was selling it to make Michael get Henry and bring those people back? I think it's possible, he's been there awhile and knows how things work now, and maybe he likes it there.
Why did Clue say they would be angry and believe anything you tell them? Did she know Michael would kill Ana and/or Libby?

And lets not forget about the other children that were taken? where the F are they? Will we get any explanation on them and what they're doing? Or is JJ and company hoping that we have forgotten all about them? How many damn Tailies were actually killed or kidnapped by the Others (They're not so damn good themselves are they?)? It seems like there were more than just a handful of survivors from that tail section. And the producers talking about how this show could go on for years and years with tales of redemption, I don't think so. How many acts of genuine redemption have we seen in two years (besides Jack doing his job saving people) that dont stem from something being needed or a desire being filled by someone on the island? There have been a few times where we have seen things done that have given a person clarity in their lives but by them doing it away from their normal way of life takes away from the significance of the change. It's easier to make a change when your not in the rat race setting of normal life, but it's more telling when you do it while still being exposed daily to the demon(s) that your trying to overcome. If I wanted to quit being a Dr. Pepper junkie it would be much easier stranded on Not So Fantasy Island than it is living in a city with a billion 2-liters of it.

You are correct. In the completely fictional Ransom, they threw reality out the window. However, the police WERE at least trying to help Mel. Also, Mel took things in his own hands and went after the kidnappers (as did Michael) and basically would not let them have the power over him. Michael was a prisoner. He knew they had his son. He knew that so far he wasn't harmed. Unlike Ransom, he was not (up until he saw Walt) being told, give us X and you'll get your son back. Once they gave him this choice it was "Here is your son. We have kept you here x number of days without allowing you to see him or to be free yourself. If you ever want to be reunited with him; here is what you do.

Great episode. I cannot wait for next week. I am glad that they are revealing some big mysteries next week - I don't want to see this show collapse under the weight of its own mythology.

also,

Thank you! Now I don't feel like one of the only ones who actually seems to be paying attention to what's going on!

I think that one of the problems with this show, and how people releate to it - i.e. have trouble following what's going on - is because of how time unfolds for those on the island vs. those watching the show.

To us, in real time, it's days and weeks between events transpiring. I think a lot of people lose perspective of time. For instance - pretty much everything we've watched happen over the last 3 episodes (or 3 weeks to us), barring flashbacks, has only been less than 2 days to the people on the island - but in our case it seems like it's been more like a week.

It's easy for us, with a more complete picture, to get frustrated for more people not noticing something's fishy with Michael. But to the people on the island, a whirlwind of shit has just happend (Michael's back, Henry's gone, 2 people are dead, we gotta do this, we gotta do that, etc, etc) and all in a very short period of time to them - so they might just be a little pre-occupied with other things to actually stop and question inconsistencies with one person.

Luckily, this is where Sayid comes in - being a person who is used to getting the truth out of people, and also knowing when they are lying.

Oh, and I can't believe no one else has even mentioned the best line of the show yet, either...when Saywer doesn't get that Jack is being litteral in what he said, and thinks he means something esle instead ... "Caught in a net- is that what you kids are calling it these days?"

Going out on a limb here:

When Walt met with Michael...I think Walt was faking it.

All that "don't leave me dad", " I love you, dad!" stuff doesn't sound like Walt. He's been gone this entire season, I think he's learned enough, been told enough, etc to accept where he's been all this time and he might be smart enough to know it's in his best interest.

What ever the Other's are doing with Walt, to Walt, for Walt....I think Walt wants it to happen now.

Maybe they are helping him hone his powers. Maybe Walt hates his powers and they are helping him get rid of them. Who knows.

Actually no I wouldn't.

I wouldn't murder 2 innocent people to get my child back. I wouldn't send 4 people to their unknown fates to get my child back.

And believe me, I would do anything to protect my child. Do anything to the people responsible for harming my child, but not to the people that have nothing to do with the abduction of my child. Simple as that.

Chris

Yes, but do you have kids?

you know what's really creepy? I watched that episode of right after watching this episode of Lost last night.
ooo eee ooo ooooooo....

I guess you didn't notice that huge base they have on their part of the island

In I.T. (Island Time) , hasn't Walt only been gone about a week and a half/two weeks at most?

Michael said it would only take them a day to reach the camp. He accused Miss Klugh of asking him the same questions all week. Then he appears to Jack and Kate a couple of days later. If I were them, I'd wonder that if the Others camp was so close, why did it take Michael so long to return.

Sam

I think they want those four because they believe they are the non-"good" ones who are leaders. They have seen Sawyer, Kate, and Jack lead. As to Hurley, they think he's a leader because he is the one who outed Ethan Rom. Ethan reported that fact back.

You still can't figure it out....

this post:


...is specifcally spoiling things that were in the preview for next week's episode, the season finale. A lot of people, including me, avoid the previews. THAT is the difference. I do have no sympathy for anyone who comes into this thread and sees spoilers for THIS episode. Coming in here and seeing spoilers for NEXT WEEK'S episode is an entirely different ballgame. Jeez.

Keep in mind:
1. Child was ripped from your arms by kidnappers
2. Kidnappers capture you and hold you against your will and away from your child
3. The 2 "innocents"... 1 you SAW murder an acquaintance of yours and was planning the murder of someone else. The other was an accident
4. the four are not being SENT to unknown fates. You are leading them their. You are out of your mind with grief. You have been the ONLY person that seems to care that your child was taken. You still feel queezy about it; but it seems to be the only way.
5. This has all been about getting you and your child off the island. You will send help back; but you are getting off. You were helpless before (after being hit by a car) and your child was taken from you. It WILL NOT happen again.
6. The people that have "nothing to do with the abduction" have also had nothing to do with getting your child back. If they truly cared for you and your child; why aren't they helping find your boy?
7. When you were captured and they captured antoher from the beach; they were, in your mind, chasing you for stealing a gun and locking Jack and Locke in the ammo room.

I don't think you can truly know what you would or wouldn't do unless you are in the same situation. I'd like to say that I wouldn't do any of this; but then I look at my 4 year old and think, how could I not?

No I don't.

But I and everyone else will be held accountable by God for our actions, so that is how I base my statements. Plus, what Michael did was a selfish move only for his benefit (I know this is only a ficticious story).

My whole life has been based on helping others and trying to be as humble as possible (not always good at that). I could never sacrifice someone else's life for another. I would have no problem sacrificing my own life (because I have that right), but I (and Michael) do not have the right to sacrifice another life.

Chris