So orginals = good and clones = bad ?
Maybe this 'incident' was clones going bad, getting out of control or something?
Maybe the clones just didnt turn out how they wished and have/had flaws?

BTW !!!!!!!!!!!!
If you dont want to be spoiled in ANY way of the last two episodes, DO NOT goto Lost-Media.com
They have massive spoilers all on the front page, including promo images.

Maybe the hatch door itself is the period at the bottom of the question mark.

And why was Locke's hatch door so hard to open, and this one swung open relatively easily with the axe?

There is if you consider he was in the hatch with someone else for quite some time. He could go out exploring for several hours before his "shift" started. Assuming he convinced the other guy to take on a 16-hour shift of button-pushing while he went exploring, that would give him an 8-hour "radius" from the hatch. And given that he was probably a pretty decent runner, he could have explored a great deal of the island, but maybe never made it as far as the "northern" fringes.

You have a point about the ? dot being the hatch, but it looked like if the plane was not there, it would have been covered by dirt.Maybe not though and you are correct.But if it was in plane sight, why draw on the map a ? and not a hatch like the other?
Again, maybe too much thinking there and it really is nothing.

Thanks. I've been toying with the clone idea for a few weeks, but last night's episode really made everything click.

Maybe the "good ones" (like Locke) are successful clones, whereas the "bad ones" were not properly cloned and will soon face serious health problems. Maybe this is the sickness that had been mentioned.

Maybe they took Claire's baby because as the child of a clone, she was at risk of significant health defects. Don't know why they would take Walt.

This is a good theory.

continuing on the clones theory, perhaps they take children because their cells are easier to clone? (dunno if that's true, just a suggestion)

I think you're misreading the flight tracking results. It says "Alert" for everything under the arrival headings for 815. Plus, it mentions the Flight 815 tragedy on the front page.

I apologize for not making it more clear. There were *two* tracking pages - the one I am referring to was before it changed. Part of the conspiracy I imagine.

Not true. The hatch was under the tail section of the plane which would put it right where the dot would be in the question mark.

But was it not under dirt? I remember them having to move earth off the top of the hatch.Eko used his axe to hit the ground around there and finally heard a clink that directed them to what was 'under' the dirt.

EDIT to add images....

http://img400.imageshack.us/img400/4292/pearl2li.jpg

Oceanic Airlines website
 

Has anybody checked out this website in a while??

http://www.oceanicairlines.com/

Look here for more information on the hansofoundation.org website and the commercial.

http://forums.go.com/abc/primetime/l...9&forumStart=0

Will they ever answer one, just one question in this show?

They have answered several, in fact.

As for the clone theory:
Let's not assume the "flashbacks" are the characters' flashbacks at all. This is a TV show. They may be simply letting us know who each character was in the living. Then the plane goes down, everyone dies, and a select few of the dead bodies are cloned. Those with enough will to survive because of a desire to right some previous wrongs in their lives. The show let's us in on the lives of those cloned before they were cloned to see why these people's souls would want to hang on to life so much that they would be willing to be cloned. ie there are 2 Lockes: Real Locke, as seen through "flashbacks", and Clone Locke, as seen on the island.

Or, perhaps the flashbacks are all bullshit. Just some fake memories implanted into the clones to give them some sense of realism through individuality. Or maybe they were the living character's dreams, some darker than others. As in Jack was a truck driver who wished he stayed in school to become a doctor. Kate was bored with her life and dreamed of an exciting life of crime.

Maybe those who have seen the monster/T-Rex/black smoke and survived were particularly good clone jobs therefore allowed to live. The pilot then would have been a bad clone job and subsequently torn apart like ripping up a bad first draft.

On the question mark:
IIRC the ground on top of which the plane landed had the same clay as the ground in the loop part of the question mark. The leaves and vines covering the clay probably fell along with the plane on top of the blast door area which was covered in clay to conceal it. I'm sure whoever drew the map on the blast door just drew what he/ she saw from the cliff.

We shouldn't be so quick to assume it was Desmond who drew the map. The Swan-ees were supposed to be there for quite some time before being replaced. I'm sure anyone would get a little curious about the rest of the island and/or the nature of their "job". I'm likely to believe whoever drew the map didn't do so while he/she was alone in the hatch.

It seems like to fully explain all the details of the clone theory, we get closer and closer to "it was all just a dream" concept. Basically, anything that can't be fully explained, we can write it off as just an implanted memory.

If they are in fact clones, the clones would either have had been on the plane already or the plane crash was staged (or memory implanted). Locke was able to walk immediately after the crash, so if he is a clone, then how did he end up in the middle of the crash site?

I think there are a lot of clues that could point to a clone theory, but there are still a number of troublesome points to the theory.

On the printout:
It seemed to me the last 2 numbers were different (in ascending order) on each set of numbers before the word "accepted". I took this to mean the numbers represented how many times the button was pushed before the 108 minute deadline. I'll leave it to one of you math geniuses to figure out how long that button was being pushed for. Or how many 108 minute intervals have passed beginning with 1 and ascending to the large number seen on the printout. And if Locke or Eko or someone else inspects the printout they might notice a line where the numbers skip one (like go from 19 to 21 with no 20) or the numbers will follow themselves in order without the word "accepted" trailing them. This would indicate where Fenry did not push the button.

I brought up the clone theory last year: http://forum.dvdtalk.com/showthread....97#post6203097
I arrived at this theory because it was the only good explanation for Locke's becoming unparalyzed and for explaining why Jack's father wasn't in the coffin despite the fact that the coffin wasn't opened. HOWEVER, they threw a little cold water on this when they revealed Rose said to John (after he said that the leg would take around 4 weeks to heal), "Well, you and I both know it won't take that long.".

It doesn't necessarily exclude the theory, but faster healing (if it turns out to be true) doesn't suggest cloning as much. However, I still think it's the best theory so far (though it doesn't explain the electromagnetism, nor Walt's heightened sense of intuition).

I remember that hanh. I didn't think the clone theory was fresh this thread, I just couldn't remember who posted it.

Anybody else notice Eko's passport? It was issued 15 April 04 and expires on the same date in 2014. At least that places the flight in 2004. Apparently there was some speculation that the flight may not have taken place on the same date or even the same year as the first episode. The producers even made a point about this in an interview at the start of this season. Wonder if it means anything?

Keep in mind that the "main" hatch has two doors, the one they blasted open and the one they use now that you can just walk out of. Had they found that one first, they probably could have gotten into it with the axe as well.

Anyone else notice the odd coincidence that Eko's dream lead them to the same place Locke's dream last season led him to? Locke's original dream was right around when he was trying to open the Swan hatch. Maybe the Island was trying to lead him to the Pearl hatch through the first dream, but Locke got sidetracked by focusing on the plane and then what happened to Boone.

http://www.medicinenet.com/script/ma...ticlekey=51973
Unless Dharma/Hanso found a way to create instant adults with our Lost characters, then the cloning theory would have to go wayyyy back many years with some of the older people on the show.

Maybe when the accident or incident ( whatever the guy in the training film mentioned ) happened somebody was trapped behind the blast doors for a while and had time on their hands and drew the map then.

One of the projects Dharma was working on was gene therapy and life extention. Part of that could be accelarated aging.

Agreed. But some folks will never be satisfied until ALL the questions are answered IN FULL. (Series finale fodder)

I actually think people's biggest issue is that for every question answered, two more take it's place.

What I don't get (among 2 trillion other things) is why draw it with only blacklight visible paint/ink? Like it was being hidden from someone? The only way to draw and subsequently view it would be with those blacklights on...

Some questions concerning the clone theory...
So why were the survivors broken in to two groups? If they were cloned and replaced or what not, why not bring them all back together in the same place?
Why take Walt, if he was a clone why release him in the first place?
Why would Michael be sent to kill AL(assuming that is what happened)?

I think there's a pretty good explination for it - whoever drew the map didn't want people to see it *unless* the situation warranted it (e.g., what happened when the doors came down).

Clone Theory

1) NONE of the tallies besides the children were good people. They probably wanted them to die. They had a MUCH worse time on their side of the island.

2) I actually don't think the children ARE clones, I think the children are originals.

3) Michael was went to kill AL because she killed Goodwin and least one other person. It was revenge, pure and simple.

I'm not sure Michael was sent to kill AL.....I think he was sent back to free Henry Gale. Killing AL and possibly Libby was the way to free Henry.

There are a thousand ways Michael could have gone about freeing Gale without killing Ana-Lucia. I think her death may very well have been "part of the package" (whereas Libby was collataral damage).

Conventional wisdom tells us that Michael is probably being used as a pawn by the Others as a way to get back Walt. But if it were up to me, I'd much rather learn that he met the Others, was enraptured by them, and joined them voluntarily.

Spoiler for the film Saw:

I would have bought that theory except for the fact that Michael seemed horrified by what he was doing to AL and Libby.

I still think that Michael saw his first chance to get Henry out when few people were around was when he was alone with Ana Lucia. If the others wanted revenge for someone killing there own...Michael would have been sent back to kill someone (like Charlie) as revenge for killing Ethan.

Ethan could be part of a different group of others. As some people have said before, I think there are two groups of others. I believe Micheal was found by one group of others. He was told he needs to do the following to get Walt back:

1) Kill AL
2) Free fake Henry Gale
3) Convince the Lost group to attack the other group of others

Exactly, especially on the part of Libby - he is clearly shocked by the fact that he just shot her.

I believe that Michael is under the influence of brainwashing, or some form of mind control. (Anyone ever see Manchurian Candidate?) It's like he can see what is happening and what he's doing, but clearly has little control over it. He's pretty much shaking when he fires the gun at AL, and also when he goes to shoot himself in the arm - as if he doesn't truly want to, but can't stop himself from doing it anyway.

Clearly the Others had him - too much of a coincidence that he just shows up after Jack makes his challenge to them. Also, here's something else to ponder - he left with a gun (rifle) but did anyone see him come back with it? If not, what happend to it?

Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't the showrunners announce at one point, either late last season or early this season, that "the reason they crashed" was going to be revealed as the S2 season capper? Did I misremember or misunderstand?

I haven't heard any mention of that again in the run-up to the finale (nor have I seen the previews) but I'm wondering if others remember that as well, and if it looks to still hold true...

Weren't The Others abducting the tailies, though? They were coming in at night and taking them away. We have no evidence they were killed, with the exception of Nathan.

Does that mean they're going to be coming after Charlie and Eko next?

Eko killed a couple, and Charlie pumped Ethan up with lead.

I always thought they were in the process of taking Eko because he is "good" when he killed them.


i could be wrong, but thats what i thought. I need to watch early season 2 episodes again.