Well there is quite a bit of a cheese factor with American idol but it looks down right respectable when compared to NBC's Fear Factor and the Plug-fest otherwise known as the Apprentice.

TIM

Fox is and always will be the Walmart of television....I despise them for what they've done to TV and the carbon blobs for lapping it up. The only thing I watch on Fox is the NFL....and I can't stand their presentation of that either. there are no robots in football.

I love that every graphic and factoid has to have an accompanying sound of an explosion or the slamming of huge steel doors. :sarcasm:

Fox still produced it. Face it. While fox loves to cancel those risky shows, it's the only studio that is actually producing them on a daily basis. Some hit their mark, some don't and get canceled. But at the very least Fox is producing so many different types of shows that will find it's mark for anyone.

Regardless if Fox had to do it with AI, it did it. It's number #1 in the demographic that matters the most. While you may not be watching it, it's still the item that the masses watch. Nuff said. Taste very. But scond rate? No way. They don't have news at all locations, but where it matters, they have the local affiate news stations. Not to mention the morning news. Good Day L.A. That's something to get them out of that slot.

:lol: Fox Local News anywhere i've ever been is the biggest joke on television. Wayne and Garth could do a better job :lol:

Local news on any channel has been a joke for years now. Why do you think folks turn to the cable news channels? And who's #1 on those? Fox. :p

even though I really really hate Fox News, it's still #1 also.

I think it's interesting to see Fox promotes "House"--a Universal-NBC production, while NBC does their best to bury "Scrubs"--a Disney-Touchstone production. Neither will see $$$ from syndication or season DVD sets, but nevertheless House gets a prime location in Fox's line-up.

TIM

Truth. Everyone is touting the national newscasts. Fox has that in the fox news channel.

Lets not forget that viewership of the national broadcasts is down sharply over the last 10-20 years. Its not a big issue.

No national news, no 10 PM primetime hour, not available in as many markets as the big three (and thus some of their shows get syndicated on other networks), have a habit of ripping off other networks' shows on a regular basis (especially reality shows), still have to stand on your head with the antenna in one hand and tin foil in the other in order to watch it in some markets if you don't have cable, famous for their exploit shows... still second-rate to me.

:hscratch:

Not to me --- that spot is rightfully reserved for UPN and WB in my mind.

To me, Fox is one of the "big 4", and with shows like 24, The Simpsons, and of course American Idol, it's doing alright.

there are people that dont have cable? :whofart:

Fox... a network... LMAO.....LOL......

You never saw that Married With Children episode? "Assume the Fox viewing position!"

If you don't know what I'm talking about, then you won't.

Actually I was scratching my head at this nugget:

Honestly....if you dont have cable..you have to stand with the same wire coat hanger etc. for all of the other network channels.

In fact..Fox is the only channel that comes in good here when cable is out..

and..doesnt almost everyone have some form of cable/satelitte anyways?

That's not true, but it's not worth arguing over.

I can't believe this thread has gone on so long. I guess I think of second rate different than most people. It's all about quality to me and Fox officially stopped being second rate 13 years ago when they had the 2 best shows on TV: The Ben Stiller Show and Simpsons. NBC and CBS have been second-rate to me for as long as I can remember. They seem to be in some kind of horrible loop where they show the exact same shit over and over again. ABC, Fox, and, to a lesser extent, WB all try different things and almost always have higher quality shows than the other 2.

Come on, let's be honest - the most successful TV shows are almost always the ones that appeal to the lowest common denominator. That's been the guiding rule of TV for a long time now, and explains why reality TV is so popular.

They've left the "shaking up" to spinoffs. First there was that horrid Child Idol or whatever it was called, and now it's the very poor looking dance show.

:hscratch:

I live in DC and have cable, but I also have an antenna hooked up to get all the Baltimore locals (in glorious HD) except UPN 50 miles away - great picture. FYI - about 75-80% of the country has cable or satellite.


That being said, I always :lol: when the Bundys got into "FOX viewing position" on Married with Children.

If Married with... was on CBS or NBC, you'll hear them say the exact same thing but with their name in place. Then again, only Fox is willing enough to let a show make fun of them whenever they want.

Since when has NBC tried to bury Scrubs? Not only did they sign a two year contract for it, they are hurting badly for a hit night ever since friends went away. The Syndicated programing is generally pushed the most since the network wont be making any of that cash when it hits the magic number. So just use it for ratings as much as possible. From Fox pushing OC (wb) to WB/UPN pushing the Joss Whedon shows of Buffy and Angel (Fox). But right now, NBC is trying to make anything out of a night using any show possible to build a night around.

Well a quick review of NBC's fall line-up reveals NO Scrubs.

Tuesday 9:00 p.m.--My Name is Earl
Tuesday 9:30 p.m.--Office

I assume if Earl fails they'll bring in Scrubs off the bench... but who knows, the only other half hour slots they have 8-9 Thurs. with Joey and Will & Grace.

TIM

fox has 24, so its the best