at the end of the theme song for Speed Racer, Speed leaps from the Mach 5, freezes in mid-Sears catalog pose, and the camera rotates 90 degrees around in a perfect sweep exactly like the way "bullet time" works in The Matrix or the Gap ads......did this effect appear in film or animation prior to Speed Racer?

No... but it was in the Lost in Space movie...

Actually, I think this effect was first invented 100 years ago. Even many of the concepts that appeared in The Matrix started popping up around 100 years ago.

I remember asking my friends a few years ago why they liked The Matrix and their best response was that it was so original. I just had to laugh. I've been reading and seeing similar stories my entire life.

If that got too off-topic, I'll also add that the bullet-time was used in music videos and other commercials before it was used in Matrix and Gap ads.

In that case you really can't say ANYTHING is original. Many things Borrow from others and create something new.. but under your logic, it's still not original since it was a variant of what was there before.

Many folks say the matrix was original they are just trying to say that it brought those already inprinted Ideas and put it together making it work as something fresh. sort of how a fashion can come back in style though it was dead for a while. You might have seen the sort of stories, but that doesn't mean that when it is done so that everyone could enjoy it that it wasn't done with a sort of fresh style. Take your name, NNY, books like JTHM have been done before. done to death. But JTHM came out and it was something new because it took those already set in stone idea's and put them together in a new way that was something fresh for folks to enjoy. Old concept placed in a new situation.


I don't think I ever heard anyone say in a film:
"Oh man, did you see how those two forces went at each other? Man, that was such a editing rip off of The "Odessa Steps" sequence from the 1920's."

Yup, I remember watching a TV special about the effect a few years before The Matrix was even in production....

Somehow though, the camera trick combined with Hong Kong style wire work was thought to be the best special effects of the year, despite not being original, and despite all of ILMs advances in CG in any of the films they worked on that year (even dreck like Wild Wild West.)

It's not about who did it 1st, it's about who took it to the next level and or used it...at the right time.


i.e. Howard Stern is NOT the 1st shock jock... many have tried shock radio in the past. However, he was lucky in that he was around when people were more willing to accept it. Then same could be said for "Bullet time"


FYI, the first digital music format was NOT the CD:

Why did you put that in spoiler tags? What exactly do you think you're spoiling?

Anyway, having pits and holes does not make something "digital". Digital is about storing information as a binary series of 1s and 0s. The pits and holes on a player piano roll vary in size as well as spacing, and are therefore not "digital".

The point isn't that it isn't original, it's that the SFX guy made such a big deal about how "innovative" his technique was, which was all B.S.

Yeah, I really hated that. They acted like they invented it. As for the special effects, I wasn't impressed. Personally, I thought the use of bullet time I had seen previous to The Matrix were better done. Of course I may have just been like all the people amazed by The Matrix special effects and was just more impressed with the previous uses because it was new.

As for originality, I wasn't implying that originality equals quality. I just feel that I've seen the whole virtual reality storyline way too many times. And so much of the script of the first 2 films revolved around these tired concepts without introducing anything new. The Matrix seems like an intelligent movie for dumb people. I can't believe how many critics I saw say they didn't understand The Matrix when they reviewed Reloaded.

I'd also like to add that there are several factors causing me to hate The Matrix so much. In addition to everybody on the planet liking that pile of crap, it was also one of my anticipated movies ever. Bound is one of my favorite movies, the commercials looked great, the website with original comics by comic book greats was amazing, and other aspects all contributed to me dying to see the movie. I know I shouldn't get my expectations so high, but I can't help it with all evidence pointing to an awesome movie.

"They" should be changed to "HIM" since it was the SFX guy who was ranting and raving. Why wouldn't he be though? This was something that will land him his next job in the industry.


ah, so since everyone likes it, you must hate it? Seems you set yourself up for a let down. Look up Episode I for a reference on how folks can do this to themselves.

I don't know if it was the same show, but I did see something like this demonstrating how they did that effect on a Timex commercial, which might have been the first time I ever saw that effect where they pause the video and move the point of view. There were several commercials that did that before The Matrix.

I wouldn't call that "bullet time." The first time I heard the term bullet time was from the the video game Max Payne (which was copying the effect from The Matrix) and they were just referring to showing everything in slow motion while following the bullet which was sort of an addition to stopping everything and changing the point of view.

I don't like anything about The Matrix except the lobby scene and even that overdoes the slow motion. The fact that it's so highly regarded and my expectations adds to my hatred of it.

Hehe, it's funny that you bring up Episode I since I had really low expectations for it and it managed to be worse than I could have possibly imagined. I figured if everything else in that film was bad, at least I could enjoy a good John Williams score, but even that was bad.

Also, I'm curious if you have any recommendations for books like JTHM. I've never really seen anything else like it except Lenore and I didn't like Lenore.

Also used in Wing Commander prior to The Matrix.

whatever. of course it's not DIGITAL as we know it. But it was a predecessor.

By that logic, so was Morse Code.

....in terms of creating music.

Actually... Both morse code and player piano are by your definition "digital". Each key on a player piano is either 'on' or 'off' based on the holes in the sheet music. The tone on morse code is either on or off as well.... No?

Now, WHY did I reply in this thread...

Hmm.. temptation to add to sig rising..

I agree, a player piano can be called "digital" if by digital you mean binary and not electronic. Each key is either on or off, essentially 1 or 0.

I also agree that player pianos are not analagous to CDs in terms of predecessors, since a CD is an encoded sound wave attempting to recreate the music, whereas a player piano is trying to encode the player of the music and recreate his keystrokes. It would be better to say that a player piano is the predecessaor to MIDI, and you might even get away with claiming it is the predecessor to the robot (i.e., automating physical human tasks).

I think the difference, though, is that predecessors used a static camera shot (i.e., freeze the action and move around it in a 3D space). This is relatively simple -- take several pictures at the exact same time from several angles, and then flip through those simultaneous photos.

The innovation of The Matrix was that they did a motion shot, capturing several images moments apart, so that as you flip through the images you're also progressing through time, simulating slow-motion. This is relatively more difficult than timing a series of cameras to go off simultaneously -- you'd have to time each one 1/30th or 1/24th of a second apart.

Granted, not a huge leap forward, but more visually interesting and serviceable as a storytelling device. Probably not worth all the accolades, but if you're going to acknowledge the emergence of a new special effect, do you really want to bestow the title "Oscar-award-winning Wing Commander"?

Bingo. You beat me to it.

The Gap ad, for example, used the static motion version, and other examples that people brought up did as well. I believe The Matrix was the first to put it in motion.

"...you're also progressing through time..."
Interesting. (And now I know the difference between the static and the moving version.)
Now, about the original question (and this may be the wrong forum), but, if you're familiar with the segment from Speed Racer, they create 3-dimensional space with hand-drawn images. Or are my eyes being tricked? Don't they draw the same images from a slightly different angle creating a fluid 3-D sweep? Maybe this isn't significant, but everytime I see it, my eyes think it's an amazing trick (especially for 1967).

No, actually they move forward in Lost in Space as well... it's not a static shot (though I think the process to get the motion is probably different.) Most shots in The Matrix were using the static style though... for the most part, I think that's what got it the award.

A camera trick that is not even original (even if it brought it a step up) is not worth more to me, then ILM's cg battle droids, virtual sets, realistic creatures like Sebulba, or even lesser well done creatures like Jar Jar or the Mummy.

On the topic of Speed Racer, I've never seen it.

However, I remember Animaniacs used to do a full camera rotation around a character more farily often. (no, not a bullet time or freeze shot... just a regular pan around) That's always been some of the most impressive animation to me since it's not just a flat shot of a character walking or whatever, a slow pan around a character's body (and not in CG!) looks really cool, and must be a bitch to draw.

I am 99% sure that every bullet-time shot in the Matrix has some motion.

Hmm, you could be right. It kind of depends on how you see it. For example, the first time it's used Trinity jumps up in the air, it slows down, and the most dramatic part is where it's frozen.

Also, when Neo and Morpheous are walking through the simulation, it's frozen... no movement at all.