Since there are so many avid viewers here, I'm wondering if you'd give me your opinions on something...

Would this show appeal to you:

A single lead P.I. show along the lines of Rockford Files, but obviously updated.

The guy would be white, not be wealthy, not have a flashy car (but maybe an old muscle car). He would have an ex-wife always hounding him for alimony, an anxiety ridden teenage daughter who lives with the mom and resents dad, a huge African-American sidekick who looks really deadly but actually hates fighting and usually runs away when things get hot.

It would blend serious storylines with humor ala Rockford.

What do you think? Is it time to rehash this classic genre or does it just feel dated and "seen it all before?"

Please give me your honest takes. don't hold back.

Thanks.

I've got some questions...

LOCATION? LOCATION? LOCATION?

Where is it going to take place? Which coast? or is it just some big little city? does he travel?

(Besides that, I'd give it a few episodes... plus I'll leave a longer commentary later, if my questions are answered.)

Location - good question!

Most likely Los Angeles. The other choice would be some rainy kind of place like Vancouver or Seattle.

In what way has this been updated? Sounds like the same old tired 1970s-onward formula to me...

That's not to say it would necessarily be bad, or mightn't be popular. It sure doesn't draw me as a pitch, but maybe I'm not the right market.

So, it's Joe Mannix meets Jim Rockford with a dash of Rick Hunter and a side of Rick Simon?

Personally, I would love to see a revival of the "Loner Detective" genre, but I don't think it will happen. Nowadays, TV dramas require large casts and someone famous to carry the lead. I don't like the idea of the wussy "sidekick," but I wouldn't mind a wussy regular, maybe an informant like Sporty from Hunter.

Key questions: is this a badass show, or a pansy show for the ladies? Are we talking Frank Cannon, no ladies - they just get in the way? Or Joe Mannix, play along with their games for leads but drop 'em cold when the case is over? Or Michael Knight, damsel in distress kissy-kissy every week?

Personally, this is one of my favorite genres, and I'd love for another Cannon or Mannix to surface. But it would require the same grit that it had in the late 60's and early 70's. And I'm not sure the networks are willing to embrace anything like that, unless it has a twist-ending or stars Brad Pitt.

das

Good questions, Das...

I think for the badass question, it's kind of like Magnum, in the sense that he's not really badass, but still cool.

Or do you think straight ahead badass is the way to go?

Well, my favorites are Mannix and Cannon, and neither really had much time for the ladies. Joe Mannix looked the part of a ladies-man, but he always dropped them hard when there was a case to be solved. So, I'm all for the complete badass.

However, a network wouldn't allow that. He'd have to have some on again/off again relationship with a reporter or something, and he'd have to bail her out of trouble for season cliffhangers. If on NBC, he'd propose at the end of the 3rd season, and they'd have a kid. But I'm getting sidetracked ...

I think TV could use some bad-ass ex-cop/PI types who aren't bogged down by the ladies. I would prefer the daytime worker (with some night work) over the dark streets/nighttime avenger of Robert McCall.

das

B-O-R-I-N-G, sounds like you're adding cliche to doggie-doo and expecting people to like it. Is it any wonder why network television is losing the ratings war against cable? How about a sitcom about a gay lawyer living in Chicago who can't find a job despite an Ivy League degree?** Come up with something different. Is it possible to have black leads in a non-sitcom? Maybe a drama about 2 black business men and the struggles they face while trying to start a company?


**copyright grunter, and I mean no ill will towards him nor his crappy situation, maybe he can help write!!$$

*cough* Hack *cough* (CBS, Friday's 9e/8c)

• Quoth Goldberg74 •<HR SIZE=1>*cough* Hack *cough* (CBS, Friday's 9e/8c) <HR SIZE=1>

*cough* Read my post *cough*

I said NOT the dark streets avenger. In fact, the closest possible parallel to Hack is The Equalizer aka Robert McCall. Don't get me wrong, I have nothing against Hack - it's just not the badass one man gang I was describing.

das

With a premise this generic, it really all depends on who's cast as the solo main guy. It would probably have to be an huge name--or have other significant buzz--for me to preview it.

Sorry das... my bad.

But I had a thought... but what if someone took a spin-off of Nash Bridges and just plopped Steve Austin's "Det. Jake Cage" into your scenario.

Big name, bad actor.

Just a thought, concidering he's still a house hold name, but kind of out of work a the moment.

das

These are smart, interesting posts. Thanks, folks.

One note of interest: There was a pilot sold this year called "McBride." Twentieth for CBS, I think. Anyway, it was straight ahead, loner, ex homicide detective kicked off the force for drinking, has to earn money doing "creative investigations." Very dark - along the lines of Lawrence Block's Matt Scudder character for those familiar (8 million Ways to Die).

They bought it, then bailed on it when the script was turned in saying, "Too dark, too depressing."

Well, then why the hell did you buy it???

As with all things, concepts don't interest me as much as the writing. If you'd asked me if I'd watch a show about a cute teen named Buffy and her hapless friends fighting vampires, I'd be less than interested. Writing is key, and too often it seems as the suits are more interested in gimic than quality. SportsNight was a show about people working on a sports show ... *yawn* Oh, and it was one of the best written shows ever ... that interests me. That's why I watch every pilot ... you never know where the great shows are going to be.

Unless the concept is drastically unique (which yours is not), my interest is most influenced by the writing, and in the case of your style of show, the lead actors.

das

The huge sidekick who hates fighting and runs away all the time sounds funny Aside from that, it really sounds like a single character from all of those cop shows on right now.

just out of curiosity, why does the race of the detective or sidekick matter? or it just part of the prelimary sketch of the show? why not make the sidekick Asian and update the green hornet genre?

I made das laugh, I feel fulfilled for the day...

But I just want to mention that if I were to name a show that I miss that had somewhat of a unique premise (despite the fact that it was a retooled British drama) I miss Robert Pastorelli's Cracker. I also need to say that I never saw any of the original eps, but I watched everyone of the US version until they yanked it.

I'll be quiet now.

I enjoyed Cracker too. It wasn't as strong as the original, but it was fun to watch, and they were building an interesting character.

das

sounds boring to me, but then again, I aint really into too many dramas on tv right now (24 and Boston Public and the occasional Practice). But I'm probably not the key demographic this show would be targetted towards

None of it sounds like something I'd watch, but I absolutely hate the sidekick idea.

Haunches,

Frankly, the idea sounds tired and cliche, but like the monkey said, writing is key. Considering that you are a horrible, horrible writer, I'd say can the idea now. Just kidding.

If this project does see the light of day, please don't put it in a rainy setting like Seattle or Vancouver. It seems like too many shows are using that type of setting nowadays and it's depressing (unless you want the show to have that darkish slant).

Dark Angel - Seattle
Haunted - not exactly sure, but SF, I think
John Doe - Seattle

Honestly, the first thing I thought of when I read your post was "Haunted" (new show on UPN with Matthew Fox of "Party of Five" fame). Not that the characters are totally the same, but they're similar.

How about a show with an Asian guy as the lead for a change?

I'd be willing to give the show a try if the previews caught my eye, but in all honesty the only thing I watch on CBS is NCAA basketball, NCAA football, and NFL football. I think the last TV show that I regularly watched on CBS was "Jack's Place" with Hal Linden, but I don't even think that show lasted an entire season (and I'm not even totally positive it was on CBS). The only other show I've watched regularly on CBS was "Tour of Duty".

I think there might be room for a less gritty detective show. There are so many homicide/law and order/boomtown/judging providence shows out there.

Something along the lines of Simon and Simon or Spencer for hire might work.

I don't see much difference between P.I. shows and cop shows. There are a ton of cop shows on now.

See, that's their thinking. Where this is coming from is: a studio gave me 3 ideas to see if I'd be interested in writing any of them. One of them was this "New Magnum, P.I./Rockford Files" treatment.

I've felt like we're due to see the single lead cop/PI drama return soon because there is so much ensemble stuff now, but who knows? Most likely it'll take a big name show runner to get it on the air.

Development goes in cycles here. Two years ago family/character dramas were the thing. Last year franchise shows accounted for the majority of development. This year it'll go back to character stuff and then next will be franchise again.

Unless your CSI... I predict that next season we''ll have:

Monday: CSI: Miami with David Caruso and Kim Delaney
Tuesday: CSI: Twin Cities with Jessa Ventura and Rena Mero
Wednesday: CSI: Orange County with Colin Hanks and Jack Black
Thursday: CSI: Vegas ... remember the original?
Friday: CSI: Anywhere with Peter Faulk and plane ticket
Saturday: CSI: Vegas II - Day Shift with Penn and Teller
Sunday: CSI: DC with James Garner, Joe Montengna and Sally Field