Does "OZ" count as being gay friendly?

so she's a lesbian
she's still nasty
I'm more concerned with her being a hypocrite

She's gay?!!?!?! I would have never had guessed it... oh wait.. yeah I'm sure everyone knew for years already

What do you mean?

I think we need a two-hour special devoted to her numerous hypocrisies.

When she first started the show, I thought it was straightforward and honest and was different from the useless crap the other daytime shows were spewing forth. But as lies piled upon manipulations, and one holier-than-thou speech after another, I grew to detest her. Mark your calendars for a special in two years for Rosie to announce that she's still gay. It's going to be huge (among other things).

das

As a gay person myself, I'm glad Rosie FINALLY admitted she's gay, even though she makes my stomach churn. I agree with das Monkey that she is a hypocrite - how conveniant for her to come out right at the end of her show's final season and right before her bio comes out.

The two hours was not all about Rosie and her sexuality it was about gay adoptions and the lunkheads in Florida who want to mandate their "morality" based on mythic ideals and biased "science".

Rosie has always come across as an idiot but last night I thought she spoke very eloquently about the topic.

If Florida won't let perfectly capable homosexuals adopt children then heterosexuals better stop adding to the thousands and thousands and thousands of "unwanted" children.

What it comes down to is this, and this is the bottom line.
It all has to do is because of the Bible. And because God said that no man should lay down with another man, and when God destroyed Sodom&Gomora because it was a gay city.

So me not being gay has a choice to make on this . Do I side with Hollywood Stars telling me gay is o.k. or side with the Bible?
Nough said!

Das, you and I rarely agree, but when we do, it is dead on.

I see. So me being gay, my choice is this: spend my life celibate or go to hell for something I had no conscious choice over? Or do you pretend that I decided to be gay on a whim?

I trust you feel just as judgementally about all premarital sex? About all divorce and remarriage?

In fact, I sure hope you're married to the first woman you ever "lusted in your heart" after. If you want to "side with the Bible," that's the same as having actual sex. From that point on, you were eternally bound to her, and everything else you've done since then was a sin.

And of course, I sure hope you're not allowing women to speak aloud in your church.

Side with the Bible all you want, but realize when it was written.

Whether you admit it or not, even the strictest Christians pick and choose their "most relevant" parts of the book...

Well, this thread is already going to go way off topic because of this quote... so I'll add my $.02.


You do realize that the Bible wasn't written by God, right? That it was written by men? Thousands of years ago?

I'm not going to comment on anyone's religious beliefs or opinions about homosexuality... but I would suggest that you read the quote is das's signature and take it to heart. Take some time out from reading the Bible and read some books about the Bible. You'll come to realize many things -- that there are many different interpretations of Bible passages; that many of the authors of the Bible had specific agendas that likely didn't have much to do with "God"; that different translations of the Bible over the years have changed its meaning, sometimes radically.

In the quote above, you seem to be implying that there are two choices -- believe what a TV star tells you or believe what you read in the Bible. I think there's a 3rd choice -- read all you can about something, then look deep inside yourself and make up your own mind. I try not to take anything I'm told (on TV, in church, on the internet) at face value. Question everything.




(For anyone interested in a great Bible book, I can definitely recommend In the Beginning: The Story of the King James Bible and How It Changed a Nation, a Language, and a Culture http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/AS...-4/ref=dvdtalk)

bboisvert,

The Bible was not written merely by men, but Men who were guided by the Hand of God. God would not allow His Words to be written in a fashion other than His Design. Consequently, Translations of the Bible are equally guided by the Hand of God, and once more, He would not allow His words to be presented in an inaccurate or misleading manner. The Bible is the de facto Word of God and should be interpreted as such.

No ... I do not believe that. Just preparing you for the counter-argument to your reason. The inherent problem with any such discussion is that one side has established axioms that are so high above any possible argument. I'm not saying they're wrong or intentionally tipping the scales, but when they establish that the book they selectively follow is the ultimate truth in the Universe and is the final word of our Creator, there's really nothing that can be said to counter that. Even if it's not true, it's a self-supporting axiom that leaves no room for discussion.

I, for one, believe like you've suggested. If God got so involved to protect his word through generation upon generation of corruption and mistranslation, then that raises a whole host of questions about why we even exist in that world. The more rational approach, from my perspective of course, is to examine everything yourself from all sides. But there will always be division, and 2000 years from now, when the word of God has been translated to be nothing like the Bible we currently know, there will be those who believe it's the ultimate truth in the Universe and those who believe it's just a guide.

In a likely futile attempt to return to topic ... Nosie can still suck my nuts.

das

Hypothetical Question:

If you were an orphaned child, which would you choose to adopt you (all other things being equal):
A fit heterosexual couple?
or
A fit homosexual couple?

Just think back to when you were a kid and how cruel other kids can be and how damaging that is.

Isolating one attribute of someone isn't a very good way to make such a determination. Unless you mean physically fit, there's no way to quantify two sets of parents as "all other things being equal." "All other things being equal" I'd want parents that made one cent higher annual salary. "All other things being equal" I'd want parents that had an inch larger television. "All other things being equal" is never going to happen and just presents a scenario to pick the most superficially favorable attribute.

If you have parents that love and support you, you have a pretty good thing going regardless of how green the grass on the other side of the fence may be. Kids can be cruel. Hell, adults can be just as cruel. I was made fun of because I was smart. Would I trade that? Hell no. Am I equating being intelligent with having homosexual parents? No. But I am pointing out that the opinions of cruel kids should not be a determining factor of the positive and negative aspects of your life.

das

That would be great if it were only true - regardless of your attempts at being sarcastic or funny. The truth is that Americans are still hateful and frightened by anyone who is not the "norm".

Matthew Shepard was murder less than five years ago for being nothing more that a small, defenseless gay man. Ellen Degeneres spoke at a rally on Capitol Hill in memory of Matthew Shepard attempting to persuade congress to pass a hate crimes legislation bill (which STILL lies dead in the water) saying that when she came out on her show she'd hoped it would affect SOMEONE SOMEWHERE so that stuff like this wouldn't happen anymore. The truth is it still does - EVERY DAY - and nothing can legally be done to punish or prevent it.

Rosie O'Donnell's coming out should be gauged as nothing less. It IS important. Her core audience is what can generally be regarded as people who don't give much regular consideration to homosexuality. If her coming out puts the idea into just a handful of people's minds that "Hey, I love Rosie and she's gay so maybe every gay person isn't like Jack on Will & Grace or the psycho killer Richard Gere played in Looking for Mr. Goodbar." If THAT INTERVIEW, her coming out makes another Russell Henderson or Aaron McKinney think twice before murdering an innocent young gay man like Matthew Shepard then yes a two hour special is what she should have. Besides, I'm sure the majority of people who watched it were her fans (at least those who weren't also NCAA fans) and homosexuals who were thinking "maybe this will help a little."

As for those in Hollywood still in the closet - they have only to look as far as the success of George Michael's last record release to see why staying IN has more adantages over coming out.

As for Rosie's fan-aticism of Tom Cruise, that was always a pretty safe idol to worship. He's goodlooking and pretty much as gay as she was prior to this interview. How bankable would Mr. Cruise be with HIS adopted children without his "hetrosexuality" being forced into everyone's face by the pathetic tabloids on a weekly basis? (Penelope Cruise indeed!)

Just my .02....

Rosie needs a two-hour special to tell us she's gay?

Here's what I imagine as a much more effective means of "coming out": The news anchors from Family Guy breaking in and saying,
"This just in...for those of you just coming out of comas, Rosie O'Donnell is gay".

Amen!

Yes but isn't there a slew of things that the bible says are no-nos that a lot of people even do without thinking? Sorry, I just think the whole bible thing is a poor argument. Maybe this is because we did more crafts than learning in CCD, but I remember reading a website that had a list of things most ppl do, that the bible says is a no-no. If I find it again Ill post the link.

You weren't snoozing during an important Bible lesson in CCD. Live and let live can also be derived from several passages in the Bible (including the Ten Commandents to a degree). The point is that the Bible is an interpretive text! There are a gaZILLION contradictions in the Bible - all open to free interpretation. In the long run, it simply takes an enthusiastic speaker/interpreter to find what works for that persons ends, present it as such and then convincingly present it for other people to believe and follow.

My personal feeling on bibical teachings is that God put us here to get along and gave us some guidelines along the way. NOWHERE in the Bible does it say it is okay to KILL someone because they are black, American, handicapped or GAY!!!!!!!

What do you mean "nothing can legally be done to punish or prevent it"? Aren't Shepard's murderer's serving life sentences?

I'm going to put this in a nutshell and direct it at no one in particular... let's stay on the topic of Rosie and the relationship of her opinions to this show OR let's get ready to head over to the Otter to discuss the pros and cons of homosexuality. Regardless of which of these is selected, let's also remember to be respectful of each other and their beliefs/lifestyles even if we don't agree with them.

This was one of the worst cases of network television propaganda i've ever seen.It was like watching tv from the old Soviet Union where everybody to the right of Karl Marx is portrayed as a total nutcase.This is a shining example of liberal bias in the media gone amok.But some people are starting to wake up-witness Bernard Goldbergs book on top of the NY Times best seller list for weeks.And who elected Rosie to anything,why are media paying so much attention to entertainers?Rosie(and all entertainers/actors/singers) are just modern versions of court jesters,nothing else,and being human means that you can have desires and inclinations but we don't have to ACT on them.

Whatever happened to her undying love for Tom Cruise?

By the way, I guess I'm in the minority... I care when celebrities reveal anything huge, especially if I'm a fan. We can all act like her being gay isn't a big deal, but coming out ranks up there with the biggest of announcements in my opinion. Strictly on adoption issues, my political mind is against gay adoption, period. Blah...

Well let me be the first to THANK congress for not wasting our time and money on such useless drivel.

Oh yeah, Nosie can also suck my nuts.