Yeah, I was standing right there with ya on those....funny how when we predicted Crash winning the Oscar we were lambasted by the BBM fanboys. Its ok because they got it in the end.

I digress....sorry.

You must be snagging them before I see them!

No. He means that there are other forums where the BR fanboys are running rampant. I think he means avsforums, which are IMHO totally out of control. I always held them in high regard but after this whole thing, I seriously don't.

But I digress...

$700?!?!?!?

Not a chance. All Blu-Ray players are being sold to make a profit while the Playstation 3 is selling at a loss. The Blu-Ray ability of the Playstation 3 adds about $220 cost to the console. Best estimates say that the Playstation 3s devolopment cost is around $650 and game consoles always sell below devolopment cost. What its final price is will be detirmined by how much hardware loss Sony is willing to eat. The Playstation 3 has to be competitive with the Xbox 360 and HD-DVD players. $600 is the very highest it will sell id bet my ass on it.

E3 3006 will give us a lot of new info on the Playstation 3 and possibly final price. If Sony can deliver the Playstation 3 on time at an affordible price and in decent quanitites there is absolutly zero chance that HD-DVD will make it to 2008.

Where are you pulling out these number from? I think the PS3 will sell for $500 as well, but right now there is no proof what it will sell for and no numbers I have seen on what the costs are per console. There are also zero solid specs on what it can do for Blu-ray movies. Until E3 shows us something to go on I think its a little early for the sky to be falling on HD DVD.

If the PS3 is the key to the death of HD DVD I have no doubt it will survive for years.

Send a picture. I may take you up on that.

Well, they already missed one deadline.....the Spring launch. So I'm not so sure they'll make November either.

Your honor...exhibit A.
http://forum.dvdtalk.com/showthread....84#post6951984

All I can say is that I find it very revealing that the context-sensitive ad that was displayed when I brought up this page was a link to Deep Discount DVD for a title called "Why We Fight".

And curisouly enough, I really don't see much "fighting" coming from the HD-DVD camp (but then, I don't really see much of an "HD-DVD is the best thing since sliced bread" camp to speak of). Most of the argumentative posts seem to be coming from the "other side."

Suddenly, my mind is playing back the Jimmies episode from Seinfeld...dvd talk style.

"Jimmy says the PS3 will destroy all. Jimmy says HD-DVD has 0 chance of surviving. Jimmy says he'll sell his ass if the PS3 costs more than $600."

Honestly, it must be really frustrating when all you have to defend yourself is speculation.

And now I have a new sig.

Even with no sound at all an HD-DVD can't fit 6 hours of 1080p video. DTS-HD audio can go up to eight channels of sound at a whopping 24 megabits per second. Higher then the video. HD-DVD has all the space you need for Doby plus but when DobytrueHD and DTS-HD become commen the space limitations of that format will become more apparent.

ok, I've been reading over at the AVS forums(some crazy people there by the way) and I see alot of complaints about the HD-DVD players only outputting 1080i while the Blu-Ray players are stated as being 1080p. now my question to anyone buying HD-DVD is this - do you care about this at all? my tv is only 1080i and I don't think I'll be upgrading it for possibly 3 years at this point(I still have 2.5yrs. left on my warrantee) so with the fact that I can't use 1080p is not big deal to me in the least. what are your opinions?

Well 1080p would make it more future proff. However I believe it would be smart to offer a cheap 1080i player for those who don't care. Why aren't they? I think with all there support they don't see HD-DVD as a threat. They probably believe offer 1080p in all announced players will increase the sales of 1080p televisions. Oh well. With all Blu-Ray supporting companies I believe it is inevidible that one of them announces a cheap Blu-Ray player that lacks 1080p.

Personally, I jsut plan on selling the 1080I and upgrading to the 1080P 2nd generation player when it's released in the fall with HD-DVD. Not so much for P, but for other things.

It's bound to be less clunky, lighter, and faster. The machine outputs well, but I don't want to stick with a slow 1st gen machine for years.

I tend to upgrade generation by generation. It doesn't really cost me much of anything. A little bit, but nothing major. I just trade up.

I remember the first DVD recorder. Yikes!!! I couldn't mentally function if I was still putting up with that. A pain in the ass.

So, I have no concerns about 1080P now. My tv only outputs 768P. By the time I have a 1080P tv, I will already have a player to go with it.

I agree.

I don't believe Sony is going to charge a price like this. They could. But, this is completely out of reach for the holiday customer. I could see their faces now.

$499 will be pushing it, but will still sell. I am hoping they completely surprise us and pin a price of $399 on it. That's a far shot, but maybe we will get lucky.

So, basically Blu-Ray players are $1000 to help make up costs for PS3? That makes sense, but that sucks to those of us who want to early adapt Blu Ray.

PS3 will be a HUGE boost to the BR camp, I'm not sure why some of you are so easy to discount this. Apparently a lot of you are forgetting the hoards of discs that tried to capitalize on the PS2 coming about by printing "PS2 compatible" on their stickers. You don't think they're going to do it again this time around, especially with the format war and exclusive titles? The price does have to stay relatively low for this to stick. Sony would be committing suicide by pricing it any higher than $599.

As far as 1080i/1080p goes, I realize early adopters have to sit through some of the bugs, but 1080i could become the non-anamorphic of the new generation. I only have a 1080i television right now, but I still would like to take every precaution that my player will last for as long as possible, especially at 500 plus dollars a unit. With an HDTV, would you buy a non-anamorphic dvd now? While that isn't a problem for people with SDTVs, people with HDTVs certainly feel the heat on this. 1080i is the same way; we might not feel the burn now, but knowing I'm covered whenever I do decide to upgrade to 1080p is a good feeling.

This happens a lot, and its funny to see it happen. Overnight when the ps3 is released, it will trump over any hd-dvd sales by then without a doubt. Ive seen people say that most ps3 owners wont buy BR movies, and i consider that laughable. People who buy ps3's are HDTV owners who want top technology, BR is part of that. Even if 25% of PS3 owners buy BR movies, that still eclipses anything from the HD-DVD camp by 10 times or more, and its 1080p out of the box.

Right now, I don't care. My tv is only 1080i as well. I'm sure future Toshiba HD-DVD players will output 1080p. AVS, like many die hard BD supporters, are under the impression that HD-DVD players will NEVER output 1080p. There's only been the entry level player released. I would say their generation 2 players make the switch.

This subject is being discussed at length in this thread:

http://forum.dvdtalk.com/showthread.php?t=463142

Any HD-DVD folk who bad-mouths Blu-Ray is just kidding themselves. If they ever want to see Sony, MGM, Fox, or Disney movies, they will need a Blu-Ray player. It would be silly for them to denounce it now, only to purchase it later.

Actually, part of that first sentence is backwards. Since everywhere I've read, it seems the BD group does nothing but bad mouth the HD-DVD format. There is always a chance Fox and Disney could produce HD-DVD content. Nothing is set in stone.

Fox: one of the reasons they gave for their endorsement of Blu-ray was "aggressive intellectual property protection in the new format". This refers to BD+. They asked for the adoption of this CP system as a condition for endorsing the formats. HD DVD refused; Blu-ray accepted. Fox announced support of Blu-ray. Now it is impossible for HD DVD to change its spec after launch to include a similar protection scheme, so it is impossible that HD DVD passes the test for Fox adoption, unless Fox gives up on it altogether (which, if it was so important for them, is highly unlikely).

Disney: this studio considers that, in order to make parents buy the Disney classics once again, higher video and audio quality are not enough. They want substantial bonus features, interactive games and whatnot. The 50GB of Blu-ray swayed them to adopt that format. Can HD DVD offer them that capacity? No.

If any of those folks ever post on the board I will tell them.

And with Universal's Music Group already on board with Blu-Ray, it is more likely that Universal Movies supports Blu-Ray than Fox supporting HD-DVD.