Prince, what's the big deal?
#51
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Re: Prince, what's the big deal?
I don't think anyone who knew anything about music would put Madonna on the same level as Prince, and I like Madonna.
oh, that wasn't for you, I'm just saying madonna is good but as an artist Prince trumps her in every way and so much so that putting them on a similar level wouldn't make much sense.
oh, that wasn't for you, I'm just saying madonna is good but as an artist Prince trumps her in every way and so much so that putting them on a similar level wouldn't make much sense.
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Re: Prince, what's the big deal?
I don't think anyone who knew anything about music would put Madonna on the same level as Prince, and I like Madonna.
oh, that wasn't for you, I'm just saying madonna is good but as an artist Prince trumps her in every way and so much so that putting them on a similar level wouldn't make much sense.
oh, that wasn't for you, I'm just saying madonna is good but as an artist Prince trumps her in every way and so much so that putting them on a similar level wouldn't make much sense.
#53
Re: Prince, what's the big deal?
I never liked Prince because I only knew him from the Batman soundtrack and his later 90s stuff that almost sounded like rap.
Then I heard "When Doves Cry" on the radio and started looking into his 80s stuff. Too many good songs.
Then I heard "When Doves Cry" on the radio and started looking into his 80s stuff. Too many good songs.
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Re: Prince, what's the big deal?
<iframe width="425" height="349" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/0lZ1Mu78VFM" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
Argue with this, unreal people are so clueless in this thread. Watch the entire clip.
Argue with this, unreal people are so clueless in this thread. Watch the entire clip.
#56
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Re: Prince, what's the big deal?
Not in my book. That is pretty much the moment I quit caring about Prince's current recordings. I'm a huge fan of his 80's work and I'm glad he's still around performing. I'd lie if said I haven't heard a few good songs here and there in the past 20 years, but he's in line with tons of the greats who sort of lost the plot. Nothing wrong with that IMO.
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Re: Prince, what's the big deal?
I think the problem with Batman is that it capped off a decade where Prince was pretty much one of the defining artists of. From Dirty Mind to Lovesexy he gave us one great album after another... then came Batman. For what it is its a pleasant album and there's a few minor classics on it, but it followed a phenomenal eight-album run that pretty much has come to tower over the rest of his career. I look at Batman for what it is, a throwaway that he did per Warner's advice that he knew would restore some of the commercial clout that he lost with Lovesexy.
To me Diamonds And Pearls was where the tide really started turning. Graffiti Bridge redeemed Batman if you ask me. The movie was horrible but had GB came in 1989 instead of Batman it would be associated with his streak. Diamonds And Pearls was when he assembled the NPG and tried to appeal to the hip hop market. The album was extremely successful especially with Cream being a #1 hit, but I think that album was really the beginning of the decline from Prince being one of "the greats" to being just a "merely good" artist. He's had flashes of greatness since (Gold Experience, Musicology, 3121, Lotusflow3r) but he'll never be a patch on 1980-1990 again. But that's okay, its much like Bowie with 1970-1980.
To me Diamonds And Pearls was where the tide really started turning. Graffiti Bridge redeemed Batman if you ask me. The movie was horrible but had GB came in 1989 instead of Batman it would be associated with his streak. Diamonds And Pearls was when he assembled the NPG and tried to appeal to the hip hop market. The album was extremely successful especially with Cream being a #1 hit, but I think that album was really the beginning of the decline from Prince being one of "the greats" to being just a "merely good" artist. He's had flashes of greatness since (Gold Experience, Musicology, 3121, Lotusflow3r) but he'll never be a patch on 1980-1990 again. But that's okay, its much like Bowie with 1970-1980.
#59
DVD Talk Legend
Re: Prince, what's the big deal?
Graffiti Bridge is fine if some of the other artists stuff is left out. I like The Time tracks, but that Melody Cool and Tevin Campbell stuff is crap.
#60
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#61
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Re: Prince, what's the big deal?
Yeah, Batdance is one of the better cuts on that disc, mainly because of the funky section that cuts in about halfway thru the song.
#62
Re: Prince, what's the big deal?
The unreal part is people think that's exceptional lead guitar playing. I've been to blues dives and seen more impressive playing by complete unknowns.
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Re: Prince, what's the big deal?
Prince has never really been my thing. I get that he's talented and I respect him but I wouldn't listen to his music by choice. To me he's always felt like an artist who is too much a product of his time and I just have a hard time getting into his music. Some artists such as Elvis, The Beatles, Sinatra, Springsteen, Dylan, and a bunch more just have a wide appeal that stretches for generations and it doesn't matter what era they're from will always have some level of popularity, I guess personally I don't see Prince as being on that level. He seems like an artist who you liked if you grew up with his stuff but doesn't translate well in the modern times. I might be wrong but that's my opinion.
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Re: Prince, what's the big deal?
A product of his time? What does that even mean? All the artists you listed are products of their time. Are you honestly saying music like Elvis and Sinatra are timeless? Your opinion is far too close minded to think that pretty much only white artists can be seen as artists that can stretch their popularity for generations. I don't see the influence Sinatra has had in today's music aside from Michael Buble and Ne-Yo's wardrobe. I do, however, see the influence Prince has had on modern pop music and R&B for the past twenty years. The guy is a legend and deserves to be thought of as so.
I think it's more a "I hate the 1980's, that soulless decade ruined music" mentality. Sorry that Prince wasn't around to play Woodstock... he was one of the things that was great about the 80's.
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Re: Prince, what's the big deal?
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Re: Prince, what's the big deal?
Fair enough I guess I wasn't aware of that. I guess I should re-phrase and say I don't think he has that much appeal to the younger generation of 20-30 somethings. I'd be pretty willing to bet that a lot of people in that age group know who he is but most probably don't really care.
I can see teenyboppers who think the sun rises and sets on Bieber and Gaga aren't interested in the man, but people in their 20's and especially 30's are the ones who grew up on him and to us he was up there with Michael Jackson and Madonna in terms of "star power", except musically he was more talented than either of those (Quincy Jones was as responsible for Michael's best work as he was IMO).
Those teenyboppers who thinks Gaga and Bieber reign supreme also can care less about Elvis, The Beatles, Sinatra or pretty much anything else that predates 2005, so it isn't fair to single Prince out as the one artist they don't "get". I post on another board that has a lot of teenybopper stans and the groups like Beatles, Elvis, Springsteen, Stones, even Michael Jackson don't register on the radars of those who worship Gaga and Britney, its "old people music" to them.
#67
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Re: Prince, what's the big deal?
Okay I didn't think people were going to start jumping me for my opinion cripes. I personally think that Prince just screams 80s and doesn't really hold up as well as other artists who seem more timeless. I also can honestly say that I don't think I know one person who is a Prince fan. I know a lot of my friends and acquaintances have heard of him but I've never actually heard anyone say they were a fan. That's not saying they don't like a song or two but it's not anything they'd go out of their way to listen to.
I don't really agree that people who are in their 20s and 30s are who grew up with him. I would think the people who grew up with him in his prime would be more in their late 30s or in their 40s. There may be some exceptions of course and I'm not saying the people I know are the majority but Prince just seems like a more arty type musician who appeals to a more niche crowd. These aren't people who are just into current music either, a lot of them listen to music from all eras (including the 80s).
Yeah, because you know when I typed this out I was totally just going by race . I can think plenty of black artists hold the test of time too those were just some immediate examples that came to my mind.
I don't really agree that people who are in their 20s and 30s are who grew up with him. I would think the people who grew up with him in his prime would be more in their late 30s or in their 40s. There may be some exceptions of course and I'm not saying the people I know are the majority but Prince just seems like a more arty type musician who appeals to a more niche crowd. These aren't people who are just into current music either, a lot of them listen to music from all eras (including the 80s).
A product of his time? What does that even mean? All the artists you listed are products of their time. Are you honestly saying music like Elvis and Sinatra are timeless? Your opinion is far too close minded to think that pretty much only white artists can be seen as artists that can stretch their popularity for generations. I don't see the influence Sinatra has had in today's music aside from Michael Buble and Ne-Yo's wardrobe. I do, however, see the influence Prince has had on modern pop music and R&B for the past twenty years. The guy is a legend and deserves to be thought of as so.
Last edited by Mike86; 07-28-11 at 08:01 PM.
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Re: Prince, what's the big deal?
Okay I didn't think people were going to start jumping me for my opinion cripes. I personally think that Prince just screams 80s and doesn't really hold up as well as other artists who seem more timeless. I also can honestly say that I don't think I know one person who is a Prince fan. I know a lot of my friends and acquaintances have heard of him but I've never actually heard anyone say they were a fan.
I don't really agree that people who are in their 20s and 30s are who grew up with him. I would think the people who grew up with him in his prime would be more in their late 30s or in their 40s maybe even 50s. There may be some exceptions of course and I'm not saying the people I know are the majority but Prince just seems like a more arty type musician who appeals to a more niche crowd.
I don't really agree that people who are in their 20s and 30s are who grew up with him. I would think the people who grew up with him in his prime would be more in their late 30s or in their 40s maybe even 50s. There may be some exceptions of course and I'm not saying the people I know are the majority but Prince just seems like a more arty type musician who appeals to a more niche crowd.
Keep in mind that Prince continued to score big hits until the mid-1990's. He was the soundtrack to a lot of our childhoods. I was born in 1979 and I definitely remember "1999", "Little Red Corvette", "Raspberry Beret", etc... because of my older sister... and he was still scoring Batdance, Cream, 7, Gett Off, etc... well into my junior high years.
Plus you have to consider the crowd you hang with. If your friends hate pop/r&b music (I noticed you didn't list Stevie Wonder as one of the timeless artists, and I don't see any way that one can be disputed), he likely isn't on their radar... if they at all liked anything 1980's chances are he's someone they like. As I said, my boyfriend hates pop music and generally springs for heavy metal and electronica, but thinks Purple Rain is one of the greatest albums of all time and by the time he was even discovering music, Prince's hitmaking days were over.
#69
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Re: Prince, what's the big deal?
Prince's production is very 80's, which is only a problem because at some point some people decided it was uncool for songs to have 80's production styles. But now you see bands reviving 80's sounds because they grew up with it. Prince was doing neo-psychedelia, as he grew up on psychedelic music. It's all cyclical.
And when I last saw Prince live he did a three minute guitar solo that was so good my jaw dropped. I have yet to see that from an unknown at a blues club.
And when I last saw Prince live he did a three minute guitar solo that was so good my jaw dropped. I have yet to see that from an unknown at a blues club.
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Re: Prince, what's the big deal?
Another thing, not directed at Mike, but just in general for people who don't "get" Prince, is that Prince has always had the unfortunate fate of being the same age and race as Michael Jackson. While true Prince fans realize that those two are apples and oranges, I think Prince has always unfortunately had to settle for second place because he wasn't as obsessed with the mainstream as Michael. Michael was an entertainer who wanted to be loved, Prince was a musician who wanted to make what sounds good to him.
All we really need to do to contrast how different Prince was from Michael is listen to Bad, the followup to Thriller and compare it with Around The World In A Day, the followup to Purple Rain. Michael took five years crafting the perfect followup and when it came out, was so deliberately overproduced and laboured with catchy pop, dance and r&b songs (and even Dirty Diana for the rock market) to reach the widest audience possible so he could stay on top of the world. Even though Bad sold over 30 million worldwide, its still regarded as a disappointment following Thriller. Michael intended Bad to be as big as Thriller if not more. OTOH. Prince achieved mass megastardom with Purple Rain and just ten months afterwards dropped a fairly uncommercial, unconventional Beatles/Middle Eastern/psychedelic inspired record with a painting on the cover and back without his likeness anywhere to be seen and even the "Prince And The Revolution-Around The World In A Day" thing was in jibberish that was hard to read. Not only that but he didn't even release a single and video for Raspberry Beret until the album had already been on shelves for a month. Instead of wanting to capitalize on the newfound megastardom Purple Rain had given him, he used that power to record the music he wanted and not caring if his audience shrunk drastically. Prince has done ubercommercial things in his career (Batman, Diamonds And Pearls) but usually its a mean to give the label satisfaction so he can continue on the path he really wants to make.
IMO there is a reason there was no controversy when he was inducted into the Hall Of Fame although when Michael and Madonna got in there were plenty of "they're not rock!" detractors. Prince wasn't necessarily rock either (even though he's done his share on rock songs) but there was no way you could deny why he was worthy of being inducted.
All we really need to do to contrast how different Prince was from Michael is listen to Bad, the followup to Thriller and compare it with Around The World In A Day, the followup to Purple Rain. Michael took five years crafting the perfect followup and when it came out, was so deliberately overproduced and laboured with catchy pop, dance and r&b songs (and even Dirty Diana for the rock market) to reach the widest audience possible so he could stay on top of the world. Even though Bad sold over 30 million worldwide, its still regarded as a disappointment following Thriller. Michael intended Bad to be as big as Thriller if not more. OTOH. Prince achieved mass megastardom with Purple Rain and just ten months afterwards dropped a fairly uncommercial, unconventional Beatles/Middle Eastern/psychedelic inspired record with a painting on the cover and back without his likeness anywhere to be seen and even the "Prince And The Revolution-Around The World In A Day" thing was in jibberish that was hard to read. Not only that but he didn't even release a single and video for Raspberry Beret until the album had already been on shelves for a month. Instead of wanting to capitalize on the newfound megastardom Purple Rain had given him, he used that power to record the music he wanted and not caring if his audience shrunk drastically. Prince has done ubercommercial things in his career (Batman, Diamonds And Pearls) but usually its a mean to give the label satisfaction so he can continue on the path he really wants to make.
IMO there is a reason there was no controversy when he was inducted into the Hall Of Fame although when Michael and Madonna got in there were plenty of "they're not rock!" detractors. Prince wasn't necessarily rock either (even though he's done his share on rock songs) but there was no way you could deny why he was worthy of being inducted.
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Re: Prince, what's the big deal?
Prince's production is very 80's, which is only a problem because at some point some people decided it was uncool for songs to have 80's production styles. But now you see bands reviving 80's sounds because they grew up with it. Prince was doing neo-psychedelia, as he grew up on psychedelic music. It's all cyclical.
#72
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Re: Prince, what's the big deal?
Plus you have to consider the crowd you hang with. If your friends hate pop/r&b music (I noticed you didn't list Stevie Wonder as one of the timeless artists, and I don't see any way that one can be disputed), he likely isn't on their radar... if they at all liked anything 1980's chances are he's someone they like. As I said, my boyfriend hates pop music and generally springs for heavy metal and electronica, but thinks Purple Rain is one of the greatest albums of all time and by the time he was even discovering music, Prince's hitmaking days were over.
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Re: Prince, what's the big deal?
Look I just thought of a few as timeless and I didn't mean to leave anyone out those were just examples I thought of right away. I understand other artists of all genres and races are popular as well. They were simply what came to mind at first thought when I typed my reply. R&B generally isn't my favorite genre but I do like some of it and pop music is fine with me too.
#74
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Re: Prince, what's the big deal?
Maybe, but Prince is 5'1", 90 lbs, wears a RED hat and looks like a bad ass while he plays. Dude doesn't even break a sweat and has all the theatrics of a legend. Plus, if we're just talking guitars, I'm sure there are hundreds / thousands more talented... but nobody can argue his overal musical genius.