Re: Future Star Wars projects discussion thread - news, rumors, etc.
 

You don't think TGM's "I know where this is headed" feeling may be a factor? There can be reduced stakes because you know in broad strokes how the story is going to end up. It also can come off lazy, answering "questions" nobody ever felt they needed the answer to, like "how did Han Solo get his name?"

Rogue One was an interesting work because it shifted focus of the films for the first time from the big players, those destroying Death Stars and starting/ending Empires to the normal grunts, the people we normally only see as canon fodder in the battle scenes while the "heroes" save the day. We didn't know anything about these characters. Yes, we knew that the Death Star plans would end up in the hands of the Rebels, but the getting there was completely new.

No, they were complaining because New Line and MGM were treating it like a second LOTR, instead of as the simple story it was. They shoehorned in as many additional LOTR characters as they could, pulled story out of the appendices, and extended it way past what the story could bear.

There's the story that J.R.R. Tolkien, after LOTR, went back and started rewriting The Hobbit to fit in with his later work better. He rewrote the first few chapters and sent it to his editor, who said, "well, this is great, but it's not The Hobbit." Tolkien realized his mistake and stopped his work, finally only opting to change a bit of the Gollum scene (Gollum originally gave up the ring freely and showed Bilbo the way out, as agreed. This didn't jibe with it being the One Ring, as Tolkien had later decided it was, so he rewrote it and made the original version a lie Bilbo told everyone else, the Ring already corrupting him, see). Tolkien realized what PJ and the studios didn't: that The Hobbit isn't LOTR, but a much simpler tale, despite being set in the same world.

The first Fantastic Beasts probably had more doubts because it was based on a fake textbook made for Red Nose Day. The first was an entertaining enough diversion, but the second one was a mess, trying to be ESB without first properly establishing the characters and emotional stakes.

The Game of Thrones prequels are obviously a ploy to extend that franchise without having to include the original cast, since if it was set after the current series, it'd obviously be odd if the original cast wasn't involved. Maybe someone can make something compelling out of it, but the fact that HBO threw a dozen GoT prequels at the wall to see what stuck shows that their primary motivation was financial instead of creative.

Prequels can seem like wheel spinning, especially when they're in the middle of a story. Robert Jordan and GRRM both wrote prequel novellas in the middle of their series, seemingly because they didn't know how to move the story forward, so they moved backward instead. I actually enjoyed Wizard and Glass from the Dark Tower series, even though it's mainly a prequel story with some framing, but the prequel was about a main character, providing backstory. I've seen some viewing orders for Star Wars that puts them eps 4, 5, 1, 2, 3, 6, so that the prequel trilogy acts as backstory filler after the ESB reveal, but before you see how the story concludes.

My understanding is that KOTR was basically a way to get out of the restrictions George Lucas had put on the Extended Universe at that time. The books had to take place after, or maybe during, the OT, and couldn't really contradict each other. And most of the stories were about the main characters from those films, at least at first. You couldn't jump way into the future though, as that could mess continuity, and George was keeping the prequels for himself. A massive jump back in time was basically a way to do a clean-slate Star Wars, with much of the same overall concepts, but no real concerns about continuity, since it was so long before the other films.

KOTR could have mass appeal, but only if it told a compelling story. If it was just a retread of Republic vs Empire/First Order then it'd probably be considered a lazy way to not move the franchise forward. Freeing it from continuity concerns with the Episodes though could allow for a fresher take than TFA was.

Re: Future Star Wars projects discussion thread - news, rumors, etc.
 

"Why do people hate bad prequels? It's a mystery."

Re: Future Star Wars projects discussion thread - news, rumors, etc.
 

Possibly. Solo was the wrong character to try a comedy with to begin with. Rogue One was on the right path with a unique stand-alone story. There's more room for experimentation if they don't use characters from the Skywalker saga.

Re: Future Star Wars projects discussion thread - news, rumors, etc.
 

The prequel trilogy has been growing on me - watched The Phantom Menace for the first time in a long time (thanks to the 4K version on Disney +) and aside from Jar Jar (who is still an obnoxious character) and the miscast (or possibly just mis-directed) Jake Lloyd, the film actually isn't all that bad. Not great, but it's aged well - which I never would have guessed back in 1999.

Re: Future Star Wars projects discussion thread - news, rumors, etc.
 

This.

Re: Future Star Wars projects discussion thread - news, rumors, etc.
 

I’ve always liked the prequels despite their flaws, and my affection for them has only grown over the years, likely aided by nostalgia.

The biggest issue by far with the prequels is the poor direction of the actors. There are so many awkward line deliveries and I refuse to believe that all of a sudden all the actors started acting like shit.

If they get good actors and directors with well
written characters, I think the rest will take care of itself. IMO the MCU succeeded because of excellent casting choices.

Re: Future Star Wars projects discussion thread - news, rumors, etc.
 

They need a hard PG-13 type KOTOR film where we can assimilate with new characters who have nothing to do with our childhood. Anything trying to bring Luke, Leia, Han into the mix is going to be divisive.... and I know PG-13 will never happen.

Re: Future Star Wars projects discussion thread - news, rumors, etc.
 

Jake Lloyd was mis-cast in the sense that it was a critical error to introduce Anakin Skywalker/Darth Vader as a child.

The prequel trilogy should have looked like this:

Episode I - Essentially the story from AOTC; ends with Anakin marrying Padme and the beginning of the Clone War.

Episode II - Essentially the story from ROTS; ends with Kenobi vs Skywalker Padme reveals she's pregnant after OWK "kills" Anakin.

Episode III - Opens after the birth of Luke and Leia; Darth Vader hunts down the remaining Jedi. Vader seeks out Padme and reveals his identity to her. Ends with the twins being split up and hidden. Padme goes with Alderaan with Leia. (As this film would open, Anakin is presumed dead, and Darth Vader is assumed to be a new apprentice; Anakin obviously didn't kill Padme in the last movie, and she wouldn't die in this one either to keep it consistent with Leia's observations in ROTJ.

Since I really like Darth Maul's design, I'd probably have used him instead of Jango Fett. (Not as the basis for the clones; who they were based on isn't important to the story, but as the enforcer.) Still keep Dooku around (it's Chris Lee!) as a fallen Jedi, and not as Sideous' apprentice. It would also open an interesting plotline where the Jedi believe Dooku is the Sith Lord.

And find a way to work "Duel of the Fates" in there, too. And we lose Jar Jar Binks entirely.

That said, the Prequels weren't a complete clusterfuck.

Williams' score was damned good. Darth Maul had a great design that felt Star Warsy. Ewan was spot-on as Obi-Wan. I really liked Natalie Portman as Mrs. Skywalker, though her performance was all over the place (blame Lucas?). While the execution was often terrible, the foundation of the story was solid. Ian McDiarmid also put in a great performance, at least until the scene where he turned Anakin to the Dark Side, which can also probably be laid at Lucas' feet as well. That scene should have been ominous and frightening, instead we get Palpatine cackling like a lunatic. He should have been Doctor Doom, not the Joker.

Re: Future Star Wars projects discussion thread - news, rumors, etc.
 

wasn't Revenge of the Sith PG13?

Re: Future Star Wars projects discussion thread - news, rumors, etc.
 

It was. As was TFA and TLJ.

Re: Future Star Wars projects discussion thread - news, rumors, etc.
 

And Rogue One and Solo. It’s been a while since there’s been a PG rated Star Wars.

Re: Future Star Wars projects discussion thread - news, rumors, etc.
 

The bodies of Owen and Beru after being burnt probably should have given A New Hope a PG 13 if it had existed.

Re: Future Star Wars projects discussion thread - news, rumors, etc.
 

Severed arm would have as well.

Re: Future Star Wars projects discussion thread - news, rumors, etc.
 

Yeah, the last PG rated Star Wars film would be Return of the Jedi. :lol:

Re: Future Star Wars projects discussion thread - news, rumors, etc.
 

I didn't even notice the bodies the first couple of times I watched it. They sort of blended into the smoking carnage in that scene.

Then, one day I was watching it and thought I saw what looked like a human ribcage...

Re: Future Star Wars projects discussion thread - news, rumors, etc.
 

Phantom and Clones were both PG.

Re: Future Star Wars projects discussion thread - news, rumors, etc.
 

:lol: I totally forgot about the PT when I was googling the various movies.

Re: Future Star Wars projects discussion thread - news, rumors, etc.
 

Ya know, Clone Wars and Rebels both really fleshed out the tribal clan culture of Mandalore. With the success of The Mandalorian, I’m starting to think a movie or series of movies set in that world has potential. Especially if it’s set enough long ago that there’s not really any galactic government in place yet. I could see a good trilogy being a blend of the best aspects of SW and Game of Thrones. And definitely get the Darksaber in it.

Re: Future Star Wars projects discussion thread - news, rumors, etc.
 

I mean, yes, there's smoke, and maybe you could've missed them in the wide pan shot, but this shot....

https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/dvdtalk...3f2a9f57f7.png

Is pretty explicit. What did you think Luke was averting his eyes from?

Note that this is taken from a Youtube clip of the Blu-ray, see the 1:34 mark on this clip:

Without Luke finding the bodies, his later comments to Obi-Wan about joining him on his adventure make a lot less sense. "Oh, the homestead is burned and my aunt and uncle are missing. No need to go look for them, I'm sure they're fine!"

Re: Future Star Wars projects discussion thread - news, rumors, etc.
 

As an aside, I feel like I remember the 4:3 P&S versions on TV and VHS making the skeletons even more explicit because the crop focused on them, cropping out the rest of the shot.

So the shot would've looked something like this:
https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/dvdtalk...9eb6caeebe.png

Except smaller and fuzzier. Also, I can't confirm my recollection, since I've never owned a P&S copy of these films (even my VHS copies were the letterboxed ones).

Re: Future Star Wars projects discussion thread - news, rumors, etc.
 

Re: Future Star Wars projects discussion thread - news, rumors, etc.
 

I don't own a P&S version anymore, but growing up with that I don't recall the skeletons being that visible. Could also be the low resolution of VHS smudging it out.

Maybe the next time I'm in a thrift store, I'll grab one of the P&S versions they always seem to have and find a hooked up TV to check it.

Re: Future Star Wars projects discussion thread - news, rumors, etc.
 

as a young kid it never registered.... I think I just thought it was debris or something. it wasn't until I watched it as a tween that I realized what those were and thought, dayyyum.

In retrospect it is pretty nasty for Star Wars.

Re: Future Star Wars projects discussion thread - news, rumors, etc.
 

I had the pan and scan vhs growing up. For reference, this was the version where when Luke says, “Oh look there’s one of them now.” You can’t actually see the Sandperson because he’s at frame right and the pan scan fucks it up. Anyway, the skeletons were as clear as day.

Re: Future Star Wars projects discussion thread - news, rumors, etc.
 

According to imdb, the Australian theatrical cut edited out the shot. Not sure if this applied to later home video or TV edits there.
https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0076759/alternateversions

I can't find evidence of any of the US TV or home video edits removing the shot, or cropping the skeletons out of the shot. I think all y'all are just unobservant. ;)