RocShemp

I didn't hate Green Lantern (I sort of liked it while being simultaneously disappointed) but it irked me that they kept the focus so squarely on Earth. GL is great because you can tell the story in vast parts of the galaxy. It's like Star Trek but with super powers. And I'm shocked it cost $250 million. I would have guessed it was fairly low budget.

If there is a sequel, I hope they leave Earth far behind after the first 5 minutes.

That said, GL is the character who should be the lead of a Justice League movie. Not as the headliner (those should be Batman, Superman, and Wonder Woman) but he should be the one to first discover the looming threat and bring word to Earth, while seeking the aid of various super powered beings (and one crafty bastard in a costume) on our planet.

davidh777

I've enjoyed many of the DC DTVs and think they've successfully pushed many of the minor characters (Shazam, Jonah Hex), but what I've heard is that nothing makes any money that isn't Superman or Batman, and we're talking DTVs that should appeal to the geekiest of us. I do like the animated-feature-film idea but am not convinced it would do any better than the DTVs.

I don't think we're saying that it was only due to the method, and we've mentioned script and casting. I think that that's the focus of the thread since we're looking at what WB/DC wants to do now, and how it seems like a Johnny-come-lately move to re-create the Avengers' success. If they want to completely follow the blueprint, it'll take significant time and resources.

And while I agree that The Avengers stands on its own just as a good movie, I think the method made it that much better. I was more invested in the characters from already having gotten to know them, and they were able to bypass a lot of the "origin" filler they would have needed otherwise.

DthRdrX

Batman Begins was a damn good movie too, but it followed Batman and Robin so didn't make as much as Avengers. People waited and were teased with the Avengers for what .. almost five years? Got to get people in the door before you make money.

DthRdrX

Batman/Superman are the most popular so they get more releases it seems.

Consider that the next release is The Dark Knight Returns: part 1. Breaking it down to two releases to keep prices lower for parents as impulse purchases.

davidh777

The others just don't sell. I heard that Wonder Woman, the third cornerstone icon of the DCU, had a very well-received movie that just didn't sell a lick. I think something like the Green Lantern Corps was intended to provide background for the Ryan Reynolds movie so in that sense they are using the DTVs to support the theatrical releases, but I bet that didn't sell either. (I didn't buy it and haven't seen it even though I'm a GLC fan from the old days.)

Hokeyboy

^Of all the DC Animated DTVs, the Wonder Woman one was the best. By far. Very cinematic, very well written and voice-acted. That would have been a great feature film.

RocShemp

Agreed.

It's a shame it didn't sell well. They had planned a director's cut but shelved it when the regular cut tanked.

Shannon Nutt

Wow - I really disagree with that. I enjoyed THE AVENGERS quite a bit, but as a stand-alone movie it's very incomplete.

RocShemp

Yeah, it's not much of a movie but rather an event and payoff to the setup of the previous films. Hell, it even acknowledges a well known deleted scene from The Incredible Hulk. It really only functions effectively with the previous films.

Mike86

Yeah The Avengers probably would have been decent if it were just a stand alone film but I really think that introducing us to the members in their own movies before launching the first Avengers movie helped it out a ton. You built up the characters making people who probably didn't know much about them to begin with fans and making them think with each movie how cool it's going to be to see them all in action together. It also helped of course that the movie was just solid but I really like the method Marvel used for creating The Avengers. It also shows that they were actually putting thought into the series rather than DC who just seems like they want a cash in and are hoping to ride on Marvel's coattails.

Solid Snake

it semi references it. He never actually shot himself. He was intending to but then he Hulked out.

DthRdrX

Which scene was that Roc? I don't think I've ever watched any of the deleted scenes for I.Hulk but that sounds interesting.

Solid Snake

it's the alt. opening. it's not a DIRECT reference. Just a semi reference of an event like it. It's not canon and nor was it mentioned in the same manner.

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davidh777

Hard to imagine anything pushing second-tier characters better than Justice League Unlimited did

nando820

Wonder Woman and Under the Red Hood are my favorites from all of them and I do try to watch them all.

PhantomStranger

It should be cinematic, the script for it was adapted from a potential live-action script for the Wonder Woman movie that was never made.

People don't understand that Warner is not going to be able to duplicate the Marvel movie formula with their characters. The Justice League movie would go poof in the air once an Aquaman solo movie was released and crushed at the box office. The movie executives at WB have no understanding of superheroes and have only produced strong films when the creative talent had a strong vision for the material. The more the studio has gotten their way, the worse the movies have turned out.

Iron_Giant

Actually...

Wonder Woman is DC 4th best selling (out of 14) and 4th most profitable direct to Video release.

-Only ones to outsell WW DVD total number:
Superman: Doomsday (Number seller by far)
Superman/Batman: Public Enemies
Batman: Under the Red Hood

-The ones that outsold WW $$$:
Superman: Doomsday (Number seller by far)
Superman/Batman: Public Enemies
Batman: Gotham Knight

WW outsold "Green Lantern: First Flight" by about 29% in both numbers sold and dollar amount.
WW was such a great story, I am not sure they could have duplicated it.

But, DC did not want to take the $$$ risk, they want sure bets only.

Dragon Tattoo

What you're saying doesn't really disprove the previous points. It could be 4th place and have only sold 100 copies. Just because it outsold all the other duds doesn't make it a success. The fact that 1-3 are Superman/Batman movies proves as much. I've heard that the dropoff in sales between the Batman/Superman movies and Wonder Woman was large, and it was obviously large enough that DC thought selling a Director's Cut (which was planned) would be pointless.

RocShemp

Since this thread has bridged the gap between DC and Marvel, I thought this'd be appropriate here:

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Solid Snake

That's actually my fav HISHE.

FRwL

so is Routh coming back as Superman?

majorjoe23

Replaced by Henry Cavill.

FRwL

well i guess he does need his career to be saved so this is a good step.

Michael Corvin

The three of you are arguing from a place of having seen all the previous films and I'm not. The movie stands on its own just fine and having seen them all none of you can objectively say otherwise. I'm sure there is more of a payoff having seen them but as someone who hasn't seen them all, I can honestly say it's not necessary.

Paul_SD

Yeah, a year or so back I remember seeing the figures and WW did respectable sales. The sticking point for Warner was apparently that the magical minimum they were looking for- whether it was units or $$- didn't come fast enough.
The Batman and Superman titles have hit profitability sooner. There also may be a belief that those two properties having a higher profile will continue to sell more steadily than the B listers, but that is just conjecture on my part.

I still think Warner is looking at this the wrong way. Marvel has already conquered live-action films in a way DC simply hasn't beyond Batman. They do however have a substantial amount of goodwill accumulated through their animated properties, especially JLU and Batman TAS.
A JLU live action movie is going to be a minimum $200 million dollar gamble that could not only just break even, but could seriously impair a bunch of other solo-properties for many years.
OTOH, 1/5th of that could bankroll a fairly lush, full length theatrical animated movie. This is an area that Marvel has not been as successful in, DC has, and they already have a sound production development team in place to make sure this material is shepherded properly.
A theatrical animated movie
1) still gives them plenty of licensing opportunities- maybe even more since this will be very 'kid friendly'.
2) doesn't not take anything away from Live-action projects (except maybe to make they look more lacking by comparison)
3) Done well, can be an evergreen seller- as Disney's & Pixars material has pointed out.

And probably the main reason- the things that many people claim they want to see the most (like Batman interacting with a bunch of superpowered demi-gods) just simply works much better in an animated medium.
Unless you will be happy to see something in the vein of The Batman '66 TV show (which contrary to popular opinion was taking it's equally foolish material seriously) which frankly I wouldn't mind one bit.

And I say all this as not a particularly big animated movie fan. I just recognize that that is where DC's strength is.