View Poll Results: What do you think of Braveheart?
Love it!
50
53.19%
Good but not great
29
30.85%
It's OK
9
9.57%
Don't like it
6
6.38%
Voters: 94. You may not vote on this poll
Braveheart
02-20-12, 12:22 PM
#51
Banned
02-20-12, 12:51 PM
#52
DVD Talk Legend
Re: Braveheart
FWIW, while I like Gladiator better than Braveheart, I think Braveheart is more worthy of being a Best Picture winner. The reason I like Gladiator better is because I can pop it in for light entertainment purposes and not have to pay that much attention to it. Braveheart can get a bit heavy handed at times. I was actually quite astounded that Gladiator won Best Picture the year it came out, as I saw and still see it as a guy action movie and little more.
Let me also say that me liking it better than Braveheart does not mean I think it is the better movie. If someone to were to ask me which movie I liked better of Raiders of the Lost Ark or Schindler's List, I would obviously say Raiders, but cannot deny that Schindler's is the better quality movie of the two.
Let me also say that me liking it better than Braveheart does not mean I think it is the better movie. If someone to were to ask me which movie I liked better of Raiders of the Lost Ark or Schindler's List, I would obviously say Raiders, but cannot deny that Schindler's is the better quality movie of the two.
02-20-12, 12:59 PM
#53
DVD Talk Limited Edition
02-20-12, 01:20 PM
#54
Banned by request
Re: Braveheart
All I'm saying is that people in the minority can't get pissed because most people don't think like them. If 90% of the moviegoing public likes The Godfather, for example, the 10% that don't like it shouldn't go spouting off trying to belittle the 90% that do.
You're perfectly entitled to not like a certain movie or a certain style of movie and you could very well have perfectly good reasons why you don't like it, but don't waste your time trying to change the mind of the overwelming majority that do that particular movie or genre.
I've been in the situation numerous times. There are many movies I don't like that EVERYBODY seems to love. No Country for Old Men is a perfect example. That seems to be universally loved, but I hate it. I'm not going to say that the 90% that do like it are morons or sheep or whatever. I just realize I'm in the minority and keep my mouth shut.
You're perfectly entitled to not like a certain movie or a certain style of movie and you could very well have perfectly good reasons why you don't like it, but don't waste your time trying to change the mind of the overwelming majority that do that particular movie or genre.
I've been in the situation numerous times. There are many movies I don't like that EVERYBODY seems to love. No Country for Old Men is a perfect example. That seems to be universally loved, but I hate it. I'm not going to say that the 90% that do like it are morons or sheep or whatever. I just realize I'm in the minority and keep my mouth shut.
Your opinion is your opinion. It may not be popular, but it is yours. So say it. Just be prepared for people to disagree. I'm not going to keep my mouth shut because a majority of people like Gladiator. I'm not going to keep my mouth shut because a majority of people think differently than I do, period. We should strive for a spectrum of perspectives and opinions as often as we can.
02-20-12, 01:26 PM
#56
DVD Talk Legend
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Re: Braveheart
If the majority said instead that the sky was pink and not blue, would that make it so? The truth value of the proposition is independent of public opinion. The majority of people in the 19th Century didn't believe in evolution -- does that mean evolution wasn't true back then? What about today -- at least in the US, only 40% of people believe it's true. If by 2050 90% of humanity believe in evolution, does that mean the truth changed between 1850 and 2050?
02-20-12, 01:46 PM
#58
Banned
02-20-12, 02:08 PM
#59
DVD Talk Legend
Re: Braveheart
Always been a huge fan of Braveheart and Gladiator.
Last edited by Artman; 02-20-12 at 02:17 PM.
02-20-12, 02:21 PM
#60
DVD Talk Platinum Edition
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Re: Braveheart
I think the argument here isn't that one shouldn't voice their criticism, it's just that some people seem to voice their criticism by trying to undermine or devalue everyone else's opinion first. The "most people like that movie, and I hate it. Well most people are morons so who cares what they think" idea.
I've never seen a Transformers movie and I never intend to. Sure a shitload of people have seen them and obviously liked them enough to warrant three, soon to be four of them and they all made buckets of cash.
Saying that is one thing. Saying all those people out there who made them so successful are stupid for liking them is crossing a line, and I think that's what the argument is about.
A lot of people despise "Independence Day". It's one of my all-time favorite movies. I suppose to a lot of people I'm an idiot or have no taste for loving that movie. Like something, hate something, fine. As long as people don't go belittling those who don't share that opinion which is extremely arrogant to do, then there's no issue here.
Or to sum it up nicely:
Indeed. 
I've never seen a Transformers movie and I never intend to. Sure a shitload of people have seen them and obviously liked them enough to warrant three, soon to be four of them and they all made buckets of cash.
Saying that is one thing. Saying all those people out there who made them so successful are stupid for liking them is crossing a line, and I think that's what the argument is about.
A lot of people despise "Independence Day". It's one of my all-time favorite movies. I suppose to a lot of people I'm an idiot or have no taste for loving that movie. Like something, hate something, fine. As long as people don't go belittling those who don't share that opinion which is extremely arrogant to do, then there's no issue here.
Or to sum it up nicely:
Your opinion is your opinion. It may not be popular, but it is yours. So say it. Just be prepared for people to disagree. I'm not going to keep my mouth shut because a majority of people like Gladiator. I'm not going to keep my mouth shut because a majority of people think differently than I do, period. We should strive for a spectrum of perspectives and opinions as often as we can.
02-20-12, 03:03 PM
#62
DVD Talk Gold Edition
Re: Braveheart
Disagree strongly. To me Raiders is an all time classic of its genre while Schindlers is good but doesn't bare close scrutiny.
02-20-12, 03:52 PM
#63
DVD Talk Special Edition
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Re: Braveheart
I pretty much agree with Supermallet.
I'll add that I don't like either film in question particularly much, but I would never think negatively of those who do enjoy them. I think it's stupid to belittle people for their opinions of films, regardless of whether they match up to the majority. The first and third Transformers films may have bored the hell out of me (I didn't see the second), but I know plenty of very intelligent people who love them. I'll feel free to express my opinions on the films, and I won't be bothered when someone else comes and says how much they love them.
The only time it annoys me is if someone comes in and starts making assumptions about the intelligence or taste or objectivity of those with differing opinions ("if you didn't like this then you've forgotten that movies are supposed to be fun" or "you only liked it because it was foreign" or "the only people who didn't like this are those who have to have explosions and sex in all their films"), all of which seem to be based on the idea that everyone secretly feels the same way about a film and any stated deviation in opinion is only an indication that there's something wrong with your thinking. That doesn't seem to be happening in this thread, it's just a pet peeve of mine so I thought I'd mention it.
I also think it's misguided to hold "public consensus" as some sort of barometer against which other people's taste should be judged - that is, both "This movie made almost no money so it must be great" and the far more common "You may not have liked this movie but it was super popular so it's obviously very good" (or, similarly, "I've never even heard of that film or any of the actors so it must be crap," a line one of my coworkers used just a few days ago) seem like pretty bad ways of looking at things.
I'll add that I don't like either film in question particularly much, but I would never think negatively of those who do enjoy them. I think it's stupid to belittle people for their opinions of films, regardless of whether they match up to the majority. The first and third Transformers films may have bored the hell out of me (I didn't see the second), but I know plenty of very intelligent people who love them. I'll feel free to express my opinions on the films, and I won't be bothered when someone else comes and says how much they love them.
The only time it annoys me is if someone comes in and starts making assumptions about the intelligence or taste or objectivity of those with differing opinions ("if you didn't like this then you've forgotten that movies are supposed to be fun" or "you only liked it because it was foreign" or "the only people who didn't like this are those who have to have explosions and sex in all their films"), all of which seem to be based on the idea that everyone secretly feels the same way about a film and any stated deviation in opinion is only an indication that there's something wrong with your thinking. That doesn't seem to be happening in this thread, it's just a pet peeve of mine so I thought I'd mention it.
I also think it's misguided to hold "public consensus" as some sort of barometer against which other people's taste should be judged - that is, both "This movie made almost no money so it must be great" and the far more common "You may not have liked this movie but it was super popular so it's obviously very good" (or, similarly, "I've never even heard of that film or any of the actors so it must be crap," a line one of my coworkers used just a few days ago) seem like pretty bad ways of looking at things.
02-20-12, 03:58 PM
#64
DVD Talk Legend
Re: Braveheart
^ I respect that, and you might be right as Schindler's is such a rough movie to endure subject wise that many people most likely don't watch it enough to give it close scrutiny, hence its reputation as being one of the best movies ever made.
I have no problem with people saying they disliked a movie like Gladiator, but I feel if you disliked something and the point of the thread isn't about the movie, no need to give in depth detail as to why you didn't like it , just say so and move forward. Saying you disliked it is one thing, going on a rant about all that is wrong with it can come across as condescending to those that did and while it may not be intentional, could make them feel lesser and sorry they even mentioned it. If the point of the thread is to review it, then yes, explanations should be given, that's the point of a review .
Staying on topic, the score to this movie (Braveheart) is one of the finest ever written IMO, and I have been inspired to give it another viewing later this week to see if perhaps it does still hold up.
I have no problem with people saying they disliked a movie like Gladiator, but I feel if you disliked something and the point of the thread isn't about the movie, no need to give in depth detail as to why you didn't like it , just say so and move forward. Saying you disliked it is one thing, going on a rant about all that is wrong with it can come across as condescending to those that did and while it may not be intentional, could make them feel lesser and sorry they even mentioned it. If the point of the thread is to review it, then yes, explanations should be given, that's the point of a review .
Staying on topic, the score to this movie (Braveheart) is one of the finest ever written IMO, and I have been inspired to give it another viewing later this week to see if perhaps it does still hold up.
02-20-12, 04:38 PM
#65
DVD Talk Hall of Fame
Re: Braveheart
I enjoyed it very much when I first saw it. it was on a couple of weeks ago, and I couldnt resist watching it. It holds up well. As for the historically accurate documentary that some people are speaking of in this thread, I havent seen that one.
02-20-12, 04:47 PM
#66
DVD Talk Legend
Re: Braveheart
It's interesting that people let historical inaccuracies get in the way of enjoying a film. Are fantasy-based epics like Lord of the Rings superior because they aren't held back by possible inaccuracies? Should Gibson have made up a fictional Scottish hero that inspired revolution? Should he have sacrificed entertainment value so that he could be more historically accurate? I'm just interested in hearing more from people who are really bothered by the inaccuracies in films like that. What sort of solutions would you propose to make a better film? What other historical films did you really enjoy that were more accurate?
02-20-12, 06:47 PM
#67
Banned
02-20-12, 07:22 PM
#69
DVD Talk Legend
Re: Braveheart
Well there's this school of thought that a film is better when it's more serious or dramatic, but I'm not sure I agree with it. I think both Raiders of the Lost Ark and Schindler's List are great movies, but I'd probably rather watch RotLA more on repeat viewings. I'd probably have to concede that I like it more than Schindler's List so perhaps I would have to say that I think it's a better movie because of that.
02-20-12, 11:18 PM
#70
DVD Talk Legend
Re: Braveheart
Well there's this school of thought that a film is better when it's more serious or dramatic, but I'm not sure I agree with it. I think both Raiders of the Lost Ark and Schindler's List are great movies, but I'd probably rather watch RotLA more on repeat viewings. I'd probably have to concede that I like it more than Schindler's List so perhaps I would have to say that I think it's a better movie because of that.
Last edited by Artman; 02-21-12 at 10:46 AM.
02-22-12, 01:38 AM
#72
DVD Talk Legend
Re: Braveheart
Great movie. I remember Mel Gibson being on Leno, with a longsword.
Couldn't find that clip, but here he is on Letterman with a war hammer. Part 2 is where he is talking about the movie.
<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/IazA9PUecyQ" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/Y_jHY4AXFUQ" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/MEYMrw9HxSo" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
Couldn't find that clip, but here he is on Letterman with a war hammer. Part 2 is where he is talking about the movie.
<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/IazA9PUecyQ" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/Y_jHY4AXFUQ" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/MEYMrw9HxSo" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
