A new original villian would help.

Or.. you know, someone that the comics have used in a classic sense that isn't lex? I mean shit, you can have so many options for bad guys for superman from the comics that it's not even funny to simply make it Lex over and over again.

I hated the Superbaby the first time I saw Returns, but I've since grown to like him quite a bit on subsequent viewings. I don't know that I want him as an integral part of a sequel, but I appreciate his presence in Returns now. I've also grown to appreciate Bosworth's portrayal of Lois more. It's a more textured acting job than is apparent in one viewing.

A simple reboot. By deciding to do "Returns," they catered to a very small percentage of the general public that still has an attachment to the Reeves' films.

There is a reason Nolan and Bale started over. They should have done the same thing with Superman.

The thing is Batman's origin was never really explored on film. It has been in Superman, and I don't think it could be done any better than Donner did it. Superman doesn't need to be gritty and real like Batman does, he's an alien after all. So starting over, back to the beginning, would be redundant and tedious for movie-goers. Singer did a fine job of establishing the universe and feel for Superman in our era, the faults of his film lay in the story (and that's subjective).

They're better off just continuing the story and uping the ante. It's not like SR was a disaster at the boxoffice, and I'm sure the DVDs and merchandise have treated WB quite well.

Or maybe we're just over Superman and they should just let it rest.

At the rate the development is going for this sequel...they may as well do a reboot. Several years will have passed since Returns was on the big screen.

I simply just disagree. The percentage of the general public TODAY that has an attachment to the Donner films is very, very small. It doesn't matter how good of a job he did representing the Superman origin (which I agree with you, was great).

But from a commercial perspective, to make the latest version as a continuation from two movies that were made over 25 years ago was a monster mistake. And the dollar signs back it up.

And Singer was way too hard headed and arrogant. When a tv show on a bad network has a better Clark, Lex, and Lois, you are in serious, serious trouble.

Overly dramatic much?

Nope.

Pure speculation of course. But the world's biggest superhero should not have barely cracked $200 million when Spider-man, a superhero with a much smaller following, doubles that domestically. That is a reasonable, common sense inference.

And cost? Call it what you want (lazy or whatever), but it has impact. This is a business and the return was nowhere near what it should have been.

It was a bust and the numbers back it up.

I'm on the fence about the writers not coming back. The kid/Richard story didn't bother me as much as the dumb Luthor scheme did.

I just want them to move away from Lex and bring in some powerful alien people like Gen. Zod and co. I'd like this guy to show up.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...d_Darkseid.jpg

Considering Returns followed the horrendous Superman 3 and 4, it's amazing it did so well.

Ugh, I don't get the love for Zod either. The last thing i'd want is to see a returning villain when there's so much untapped.

I agree with Mr. Orndorf. Let us not forget that the reception by the general public is NOT represented by those who complain ceaselessly on the internet...particularly on a DVD discussion forum...and especially on a film which most people have already liked (or disliked) and have moved on with their lives.

I think it's time to stop confusing hype with merit, and large numbers with quality. Otherwise, flicks like INDEPENDANCE DAY are considered great, while THE INSIDER is a loser.

Well, I think Mr. Orndorf's point was that cost has nothing to do with reception. Yes, the movie industry is a business, but if SUPERMAN RETURNS cost a $100 million less, would all the naysayers have had a different reaction?

Finally, Spider-Man does NOT have a smaller following. His comics generally outsold (and continue to outsell) Superman'sl his popularity since the 1960s has always been considerable; there has never been a movie made of the character; and he's a "newer" and more "hip" superhero than the Man Of Steel, in general.

Someone brought up the fact that it's amazing RETURNS did so well after two lousy sequels from years ago. I agree. And while III and IV are over twenty years old, they are still replayed every year on cable television, so it's not like the bad Superman movies have been erased from the public eye.

Back to the topic: I hope Singer, Routh, Bosworth and the whole cast return for another outing sooner rather than later.

Sure, but i'd say the public reaction to Returns was hardly as positive as say, Batman Begins. Clearly enough so that sequel talks were stalled.

I didn't know that sequel talks were necessarily stalled, aside from endless rumors and speculation among non-insiders. As far as I remember, the sequel was mentioned and announced in 2006, planned for a release in 2008 and would be worked on after Singer's next project.

Personally, I found RETURNS a bit disappointing overall, but seeing it on DVD has made me appreciate it a lot more, which doesn't happen too often. I loved ATTACK OF THE CLONES when I first saw it in the theater. After a second and third viewing on HBO, however...well...

I should have said bringing in some NEW powerful alien people like Darkeid.

I had the same problem with Attack of the Clones. I have now latched on to how many times Hayden says "Master" or "M'lady" and the movie is damn near ruined. And the Yoda lightsaber battle kicked ass in the theater but now makes me laugh out loud at home.

Returns, however, is better every time I watch it. Saw it twice in the theater (which I hardly ever do) and have watched the DVD several times. I'd rather watch Returns than any of the Donner films.

Blasphemy. Burn this man at the stake!

:shrug: Reeve is awesome, Stamp is pretty good - everything else is pretty cheesy, very dated and way too campy.

I ***loved*** "Superman Returns". Is it better than the original? Of course not. But it's the perfect companion piece. And clearly Singer is a huge fan of the original. Which is probably the main reason why I loved "Returns" so much. It clearly showed. I'm o.k. with the writers not returning, but if Singer doesn't, I'm going to be worried.

Strongly agree. And while I was hardly impressed and easily annoyed with Superman Returns, I still find it better then any of the previous movies due to the campyness alone. Lex in Returns was far better, albeit still overused.

I understand the criticisms (and even agree partially) ... but doesn't diminish my love for the 1st two Superman movies (and my lukewarm response to Returns).

Yeah, the camp was overdone. Luthor shouldn't be a bumbling idiot (surrounding himself with even bigger idiots). Stuff like the time-reversal and the magic kiss were just plain stupid. And they just couldn't let action scenes play out straight - there was usually some silly slapstick or eye-rolling joke lines that lessened the impact (more a problem with II). But for the scenes that worked, they were movie magic for me. And despite the advances in special effects technology, SReturns never came close to reaching the peak moments of the first 2 movies. I don't think the contribution of Reeves can be understated - he sold the character and made you care (no matter how silly things got ... well, at least until Superman III/IV). Routh just seemed to be doing a Reeves impression to me. He looks the part for sure, but there wasn't much past that.

I so much wanted to love Returns when I saw it, and the opening credits gave me chills. But I couldn't help leaving the theater disappointed. Routh's characterization of Superman didn't work for me, as did Bosworth's Lane. Didn't like Superboy. It was nice to see Lex more evil, but did we really need another real estate scam? And I prefer less brooding/stalking from my Superman - leave that to Batman.

That said, Superman is too good a character to bury and I welcome a new movie. And it's not like Superman Returns was bad or anything. I think Braniac's the pick for this movie - there are a lot of interesting directions you could go with that villain to make a nice challenge for the uber-powered Superman. Darkseid would be great, but I don't see the producers handling his character well. They'd probably ditch the whole alien from Apokolips (searching for the Anti-life equation) thing and just make him something stupid like a human mutant.

they need to put the joker and scarecrow in the next film in order to take it to the next level