I don’t get it. Those aren’t in physical release by Criterion...

As with all things, it depends on what your particular interests are. For me, there's a lot more than I had two days ago.

Like? None in that article are blu releases from them. That’s what I want to stream. Those Criterion blu movies...

It would be awesome if you looked for yourself in the HBO Max thread, but here is a list (and it's not even complete)

CRITERION COLLECTION

8½

...And God Created Woman

16 Days of Glory

2 or 3 Things I Know About Her

The 3 Penny Opera

The 39 Steps

The 400 Blows

The 47 Ronin: Part 1

The 47 Ronin: Part 2

Ali: Fear Eats the Soul

Amarcord

An Angel at my Table

Ashes and Diamonds

Atlanta’s Olympic Glory

Au Revior Les Enfants

Autumn Sonata

Babette’s Feast

Battle of Algiers

Battleship Potemkin

The Beales of Grey Gardens

Beauty and the Beast

Belle De Jour

Bicycle Thieves

The Bitter Tears of Petra Von Kant

Black Girl

Black Narcissus

Black Orpheus

Blithe Spirit

The Blob

Blood Simple

Breaking the Waves

Breathless

Brief Encounter

A Brief History of Time

The Brood

Brute Force

Buena Vista Social Club

Calgary ‘88: 16 Days of Glory

Carnival of Souls

Chimes at Midnight

La Ciénaga
Eraserhead.The Circus

City Lights

Cleo from 5 to 7

Cranes are Flying

Cries and Whispers

Crisis: Behind a Presidential Commitment

Cronos

Daisies

A Day in the Country

A Day’s Pleasure

The Daytrippers

Dead Man

Desert Hearts

Destroy All Monsters

Diabolique

Divorce Italian Style

A Dog’s Life

Don’t Look Back

Down by Law

The Earrings of Madame De

Eating Raoul

Ebirah, Horror of the Deep

Elevator to the Gallows

The Emporer Jones

The Entertainer

Equinox

Eraserhead

Europa

Europe ‘51

Eyes Without a Face

F is for Fake

Faces

Fanny and Alexander

Fantastic Planet
Godzilla vs. Mechagodzilla.Fat Girl

First Man Into Space

For All Mankind

Foreign Correspondant

The Four Feathers

Fox and His Friends

The Front Page

Funny Games

George Stevens: A Filmmakers Journey

George Stevens: D-Day to Berlin

Germany Year Zero

Gidorah, The Three Headed Monster

Gimmer Shelter

Godzilla

Godzilla Raids Again

Godzilla vs Mechadodzilla

Godzilla vs Megalon

Godzilla vs Gigan

Godzilla vs Hedorah

Godzilla, King of the Monsters!

The Gold Rush

The Gold Rush: 1942 Version

The Grand Olympics

Gray’s Anatomy

The Great Dictator

Great Expectations

Grey Gardens

Hamlet

Hanzo the Razor: Sword of Justice

Hanzo the Razor: The Snare

Hanzo the Razor: Who’s Got the Gold?

A Hard Day’s Night
A Hard Day’s Night.Harlan County U.S.A

Haxan: Witchcraft Through the Ages

Hearts and Minds

Henry V

The Hidden Fortress

Hobson’s Choice

The Honeymoon Killers

Hoop Dreams

House

I Married a Witch

I Shot Jesse James

I Was a Teenage Zombie

The Idle Class

Ikiru

The Immigrant

In the Mood for Love

In Vanda’s Room

Intermezzo

Invasion of Astro-Monster

Irma Vep

Ivan the Terrible Part 1

Ivan the Terrible Part 2

Jubilee

Jules and Jim

Juliet of the Spirits

The Jungle Book

The Kid

Kill!

The Killing of a Chinese Bookie

A king in New York

The King of Kings

Knife in the Water

Kwaidan
Lord of the Flies.Lady Snowblood

Lady Snowblood 2: Love Song of Vengeance

The Lady Vanishes

L’Amore

L’Argent

The Last Emperor

The Last Metro

The Last Wave

Late Autumn

Late Spring

L’Avventura

Lillehammer ‘94: Days of Glory

Limelight

The Lodger: A Story of the London Fog

Lola

Lola Montes

Lone Wolf and Cub: Baby Cart at the River Styx

Lone Wolf and Cub: Baby Cart in Peril

Lone Wolf and Cub: Baby Cart to Hades

Lone Wolf and Cub: Baby in the Land of Demons

Lone Wolf and Cub: Sword of Vengence

Lone Wolf and Cub: White Heaven in Hell

Loneliness of the Long Distance

The Runner

The Long Voyage Home

Look Back in Anger

Lord of the Flies

The Lost Honor of Katarina Blum

Love in the Afternoon

Major Barbara

Man Bites Dog

The Man Who Knew Too Much

Marriage of Maria Braun

Masculin Feminin

Metropolitan

Mikey and Nicky

Modern Times

Mon Oncle

Mona Lisa

Monsieur Hulot’s Holiday

Monsieur Verdoux

Monterey Pop

The Most Dangerous Game

Motha vs Godzilla

Mr. Arkadin

Multiple Maniacs

My Brilliant Career

My Dinner with Andre

My Life as a Dog

My Night at Maud’s

Nagano ‘98 Olympics: Stories of Honor and Glory

The Naked City

The Naked Kiss
My Dinner with Andre.Nanook of the North

Nice and Friendly

A Night in the Show

Night of the Living Dead

Of Mice and Men

Oliver Twist

Onibaba

Paris, Texas

Pather Panchali

Pay Day

Pepe Le Moko

Permanent Vacation

Persona

Picnic at Hanging Rock

The Pilgrim

The Player

Police Story

Primary

The Private Life of Henry the VIII

Pygmalion

Quadrophenia

Querelle

Rashomon

The Red Ballon

Red Desert

The Red Shoes

Rembrandt

The Return of Bulldog Drummond

Return of the Scarlet Pimpernel

Richard III

The Rink

The Rise of Catherine the Great

The Rite

The River

Rodan

Rome Open City

A Room with a View

The Ruling Class

Sabotage

Safety Last!

Salesman

Le Samourai

Samurai Trilogy 1: Musashi Miyamoto

Samurai Trilogy 2: Duel at Ichijoji Temple

Samurai Trilogy 3: Duel at Ganryu Island
Seven Samurai.Satan’s Brew

Sawdust and Tinsel

Scanners

The Scarlet Pimpernel

Scenes From a Marriage

Schizopolis

Seance on a Wet Afternoon

Secrets and Lies

Senso

Seoul 1988

Seven Samurai

Seventh Seal

The Seventh Veil

Shadows

Shock Corridor

Shoot the Piano Player

The Shooting

The Shop on Main Street

Shoulder Arms

Sisters

Smithereens

Solaris

Son of Godzilla

Speedy

Stagecoach

La Strada

Stranger Than Paradise

The Stranger

Stromboli

Summertime

Sunnyside

Sweetie

Taste of Cherry

A Taste of Honey

Terror of Mechagodzilla

The Testement of Dr Mabuse

That Hamilton Woman

The Thief of Bagdad

Three Colors: Blue

Three Colors: Red

Three Colors: White

Throne of Blood
Watership Down.Through a Glass Darkly

Time Me Up! Time Me Down!

Time Bandits

The Times of Harvey Milk

The Tin Drum

To Be or not To Be

Tokyo Olympiad

Tokyo Story

Tom Jones

The Trial of Joan of Arc

True Stories

Twin Peaks: Fire Walk with Me

Two English Girls

Ugetsu

Umberto D.

The Umbrellas of Cherbourg

Under the Volacno

Vampyr

Victim

Vivre Sa Vie

Voyage to Italy

The Wages of Fear

War and Peace

The War of the Gargantuas

The War Room

Watership Down

Weekend

Wild Strrawberries

Wings of Desire

Wise Blood

Withnail and I

A Woman of Paris

A Woman Under the Influencer

The X From Outer Space

Yojimbo

Young and Innocent

Young Girls

Z

I think we are getting sidetracked in this thread. Let’s stick to actual physical releases from Criterion please!

Lee Kline, technical director of restoration, confirms Amores Perros, the Coen Brothers' The Man Who Wasn't There, and possibly a Bollywood box set.

Criterion Discussion and Random Speculation Volume 7 - Page 147 -

Are there any Barnes and Nobles insiders that can confirm if the annual Criterion 50% sale is happening next month? It would fall within the same release date as the Bruce Lee box set and I want to be prepared.

Seems unlikely. They have stopped most coupons and sales. Likely it would be delayed for months.

Apparently Lee Kline said the following on the Team Deakins podcast, for anyone wondering what the current status of Ultra HD Blu-ray is over at the Criterion offices:

I feel the opposite - since they can do it online, it would be a great way to boost sales.

I recently noticed the B&N store near me closed down for good just in the past few months. If they want to remain relevant, they should definitely do the sale.


And, apologies for getting off track again, but my wife recently let me know that she was now aware that there is a Criterion streaming channel and she will be using that as a negotiating tool in the future, as in I won't be able to buy as many physical releases. I've already cut way back after realizing I don't care for most stuff in the collection, but I'd still like to get things like the War of the Worlds or the Bruce Lee set.

They really need to have a talk with the boutique labels that are starting up on 4K. Or better yet, send out an email to Criterion customers and gauge their interest. That's not hard to do and they'll get a relatively good idea on how the reception would be.

The tricky thing there is that (1) the labels most comparable to Criterion (BFI, Masters of Cinema, Arrow Academy, etc.) haven't dipped their toes in either, (2) the UHD titles coming out from other boutique labels have tended to have some sort of genre appeal (anime, horror, sci-fi, etc.) that's not really indicative of Criterion's typical release slate, and (3) the labels that are experimenting have done so in extremely small numbers. Blue Underground is the most aggressive by far; I think they said eight titles before the end of the year? Within the next year? Something like that. Vinegar Syndrome is at two, with another pair coming in November (we lost one somewhere along the way). Kino Lorber is still at one after more than a year, with potentially three titles on the horizon (may or may not happen this year because of the pandemic). Synapse also stands at one with no indication of any future releases. Not counting IMAX docs, Shout Factory and its sister labels are at one with nothing else announced yet. Discotek has been holding at one, although we know at least one more should be on the way at some point. Arrow has two coming in August but no word on how frequently more may follow. Admittedly, it's early days yet, especially since the sum total of boutique UHDs in the U.S. stood at zero a little over a year ago. The current count might quadruple before the year's out for all I know.

So, we're still in an experimental phase (even more than four years into the life of the format!), and Criterion is in less of a position to experiment than other labels since everything's all about the line. Spine numbers. Consistency. Collectors. Packaging. If another boutique experiments with UHD, they...just experiment with UHD. Whatever Criterion decides has a wider impact because one title can't just be an island all its own. And the instant Criterion issues their first hypothetical UHD BD, there'll be an outcry. Multiple outcries, even! Some longtime Criterion supporters will gripe about their collection now being worthless. Some will argue that Criterion's just trying to exploit their fanbase, offering diminished returns at an inflated price point. Some might be less likely to buy titles on Blu-ray they might have picked up otherwise, waiting instead for a UHD release that may never come. There'll be arguments about why some lousy film like _______ is getting the UHD BD treatment from Criterion while the far more worthy _______ isn't. Some may use this as a jumping off point for Criterion entirely. And while those buckets individually may not be terribly large, the sum total of it could have a material impact. Is UHD BD worth the hassle? Gaining sales by supporting UHD BD could be difficult enough, but could supporting it wind up costing them sales?

Would a UHD release bring in customers who wouldn't ordinarily buy a Criterion BD? Because without fresh blood -- or at least support from the UHD-or-nothin' crowd -- they're just shifting purchases around. Someone who would've just bought the movie on Blu-ray would instead be buying it on UHD BD. Is that really worth it? Would the premium for a UHD release multiplied by however many people buy it be enough to cover increased authoring costs, replication costs, etc.? (Blue Underground's Bill Lustig said last month that authoring costs are about three times a traditional Blu-ray disc, and replication costs are 3-4 times BD. This doesn't include the cost of Atmos remixes -- which I know wouldn't really be a thing for Criterion -- or any additional restoration.) Then there are the less tangible opportunity costs, where whatever effort they direct towards UHD isn't being directed towards something else that could potentially make them more money. Could they convince retailers to stock UHD BDs in sufficient numbers (or at all)? Would the universities and libraries that buy Criterion titles find this worth investing in (since many reportedly still haven't shifted away from DVD)?

tl;dr: the fact that Criterion has a loyal fanbase (that, by and large, hates change!), is larger, and has more resources available to it than most every other boutique might actually be making it tougher for them to kick the tires on Ultra HD Blu-ray.

Criterion knows there's interest. It's unclear if they know how much interest...like, if it is/isn't enough to be a viable business or if they're just making assumptions because it's easier to say "no". But anyway, the scenarios that strike me as the most likely paths towards Criterion giving the format a shot:

• Overall sales start to slip, and UHD BD is a way to shore up support/interest
• A filmmaker they really want to work with insists upon it
• Competing labels overseas adopt UHD BD, and Criterion has to keep up with the Joneses (which we've seen happen with individual titles but not some kind of seismic wave)

I am the type of person who'd upgrade my favorite Criterion titles in 4K/HDR. A UHD release might compel me to buy a title I was maybe on the fence about or would've waited for a 50% sale. I'll happily give you more money, Criterion! I just don't know if there are enough mes out there. And if there are, I still don't know if Criterion would care.

If Criterion put out a survey, my questions/answers would be something like:

Should we focus on 4K discs of existing Criterion releases, or mainly new additions (with 4K masters) to the collection?
(me: new additions with 4K masters should be top priority. existing high-value titles are a far second. Everything else doesn't need it)

Should we bundle 4K and BD together, or have separate releases?
(me: 100% separate or 4K movie with BD special features only)

Should we stop releasing DVDs?
(me: I can't believe you haven't already... it's twenty-twenty!)

If we do offer up existing titles, should we offer a trade-in program?
(me: YES. $10 BD to 4K. Send disc & sleeve, get new disc & sleeve in an envelope, yes, even with a crease along the spine. Donate BD discs to libraries/charity.)

Should spine numbers restart?
(me: what are you, high? Of course not)

Should Lost Highway be our first 4K disc?
(me: absol-fucking-lutely)

Other than box sets, when should we use anything other than the standard clear plastic cases?
(me: Never.)

I can't see them dropping DVD. Haven't we always been told that libraries are a big purchaser and they mostly buy DVD versions?

Makes a lot of sense for libraries to favor DVD because it's backwards compatible with the two HD formats, and, thus, the most ubiquitous format.

I'm not sure what Criterion's sales figures look like regarding DVD vs Blu-ray, but if DVD still makes a significant chunk of their overall sales, they're not going to abandon it. And they probably don't want to do three different formats.

I could see them dipping into the 4K waters for select titles, mostly mainstream, like Silence of the Lambs or David Lynch titles.

yeah, I was joking around mostly, but libraries are almost definitely a big part (at least, as long as libraries are even still around...)
I think Josh is right that they don't want to manage three formats, along with everything Adam said about the perception of adopting 4K.

It's a shame, because, at least personally, I'm hesitant to buy titles like Roma, Marriage Story, or Cold War... only because I know they're available in better quality* on streaming services.

*perceptions about compression and ownership from streaming vs. disc is a different conversation in my opinion.

If they were going to dip into 4K, they really should be targeting titles that are showcases for the format. Something beautifully filmed with great cinematography. You need to give customers a big wow factor making them really want to upgrade/buy the 4K version. Terrance Malick films come to mind.

I'd prefer a mix, leaning towards new additions. Geez, over the next month or so alone, we have War of the Worlds, Portrait of a Lady on Fire, and the Bruce Lee box, all of which I'd buy in UHD without even thinking twice. Heck, even though I'm buying WotW next month, I still plan on getting the UHD version through VUDU or the like.

It's interesting to see how the boutiques so far have handled this.

UHD/BD - Blue Underground (2 out of their 5 announced titles); Vinegar Syndrome; Kino Lorber; Shout Factory
UHD-only - Blue Underground (3 / 5); Synapse; Discotek; Arrow

There isn't a definite trend one way or the other. My preference would be for a combo -- instead of 3 SKUs to deal with, just let all Blu-ray copies come with a UHD disc too -- but I don't think that'd go over well with the Criterion crowd. I don't think anything would go over well with the Criterion crowd, though. I wouldn't play the BD other than to view extras, but I wouldn't argue to not have one either.

Eh, if it helps keep the lights on, go for it.

I wouldn't expect it but wouldn't say 'no' either!

Ditto what you said.

There was a time when I was dead certain that Lost Highway or Blue Velvet would be KLSC's second UHD release.

I'm okay with giant Godzilla books. Sometimes. Followup question: when should we have fold-out thingies instead of booklets? Never! I don't care how many years you've been doing it now.

Agreed.

ain't that the truth. I do wonder if a lot of those types are the vocal minority.



Not to give the wrong impression with my silly Q&A, I'm not picky at all at this point, and I'd generally be okay with any way that Criterion would choose to take on 4K. I just want them to do it. Sure I have some preferences as noted, but at this point, I'd buy the titles if they're interesting to me, regardless of the bundles or packaging or any of that.
Hell, we didn't even talk about whether or not we would avoid releases that don't have HDR! (I enjoy HDR, and prefer it, but its absense would not be a problem for me)

The Elephant Man coming in September. Happy birthday to me!

September releases:

Brute Force
Beau Travail
Christ Stopped at Eboli
The Elephant Man
Martin Scorsese’s World Cinema Project No. 3
The Naked City

I might pick up The Elephant Man. I remember liking it. Only thing is I’m not sure how much replay value it has.

I would be excited about The Elephant Man, but I’ll grab the Ultra HD release from overseas instead.

Very much looking forward to the pair of Dassin films!

Already have Elephant Man's Canal blu-ray, and I'll just stick with the Criterion DVDs of the Dassin movies I already have.

I have the Studio Canal 4K release of Elephant Man, so this CC edition is sort of redundant for me. I'll pass.

The Brute Force and Naked City dvds came out during Criterion's window box fetish period, so that combined with the new 4k scans make these must upgrades for me.