The question is, then, whether the source of the demo material was Sony. If so, that would easily explain the artifacts, given Sony's stubborn refusal to adapt to newer, better codecs. All reports indicate that the BD discs coming from Disney, Warner, and other studios that have moved on are identical in quality to HD DVD (at least in image quality -- on special features the jury seems to still be out). And that is as it should be. Both formats support the same codecs, and both provide ample bandwidth for the newer codecs to produce pristine images.

As far as the price differential goes, is there any real news to support the notion that BD will be coming down out of the stratosphere this winter? And please note, I don't consider the PS3 a BD player. It's a game machine that happens to play BDs, but it is as yet unproven, and has some serious history (from the extremely poor PS2 DVD player performance) to lead me to believe that it won't measure up. I want a real BD player, one that is comparable to the HD-A2, at the same or better price point, and from a reputable manufacturer (such as Pioneer or Panasonic). Then I'll jump in, just as I did with HD DVD.

BD has had this big advantage in support since day one. I figured they would get around to using it at some point. If they start putting out quality discs on a consistent basis and get the player prices down many of us will end up buying them. Its kind of a given.

RoboDad nailed it. Toshiba set the bar with the quality and value of the their players. Pioneer, Sony or someone is going to have to step up with a comparable player to the A1 or even A2 to make buying into BD feasible.

Sorry, but I'm not paying more than HD DVD player costs when they have failed to prove any real advantage over HD DVD with their discs.

No, Im almost positive that Rumor Has It and Firewall commercials had the hd-dvd comment in it.

Nope. This would be the first, AFAIK.

Oh and regarding, CEDIA: a lot of it has to do with perspective. There are people on AVS that say it was split down the middle with BD and HD DVD displays. Who knows what the real deal is.

I'm assuming that's what Bcolon's post was about.

here we go again...

http://abcnews.go.com/Technology/wireStory?id=2461325

Doesn't surprise me.

Next thing you know.....we'll be hearing about a PS2 recall

MOD NOTE: If you keep that up, next thing you know.....you'll be suspended. -namja

I've been wondering when the next laptop-maker would do a recall. Can't believe Sony hasn't, yet. I suppose now Virgin Atlantic will have to ban Tosh portables on their airplanes, too.

Ex-Blu-boy Bill Hunt with his 2 cents from TDB...

MOD NOTE: Please don't make me explain. Please. -namja

So jokes aren't allowed here any more? maybe we need to amend the new rules because I honestly don't remember that one being on there.

And is there anywhere else we can point out how ridiculous this is? Since the Mod thread was closed?

Start a new thread in Forum Feedback.

Better yet, e-mail the moderator directly.


candyrocket786's post was just a cheap shot at Sony and something that disrupts the flow of this thread. It's both a threadcrap and a flame bait. Plus, it has nothing to do with BD or HD DVD.

Too late.

So I still would have gotten tagged in the Tech Forum for this comment ?

Possibly.

If it were in the Video Game Talk Forum, then you'll probably be already suspended.

That is indeed the correct answer. Dunno what I was thinking.

I COMPLETELY agree with Bill. HD-DVD seems to be appealing to us early adopters where BD is not (at least yet).

This war SHOULD be fought over early adopters right now, NOT joe ps3 who cant tell whether 1080p or 720p looks better.

Just because millions of people accept a format doesnt make it a good thing for us. Im scared that if BD does win, that lackluster releases with little or no extras wil be the norm. BD prove me wrong! Please!!

To be fair, many displays currently max out at 720p. I know mine does. I wonder what percentage of currently-owned HDTVs are only 720p native resolution.

While HD DVD currently appeals to the early adopters, I really don't see anything about the format that shouldn't appeal to the average consumer looking for a HD video player. If HD DVD is going to falter, it's going to falter because of studio support.

My point was that most consumers do not have the eye that we do. Most of them probably dont see the difference between sd upconverted and hd.

Again, not my point.

Im just saying that I dont want joe six pack (or kiddo ps3 gamer) to decide this war before standards have been set. For example, if it werent for early adopters, joe six pack probably would have accepted The Fifth Element as a nice BD offering. Releasing lackluster discs with poor video and no extras is ridiculous.

I think BD is starting to get it right though (fingers crossed). They know there are people out there keeping an eye on them (joe six pack doesnt read online reviews ). They know we wont buy it if its crap. That goes for HD-DVD too. I bet FMJ hasnt sold too well.

Unless someone has an HDTV with a screen size larger than 50", chances are almost 100% it is a 720p set (most likely represented as 768p). I doubt that will change much in the next few years. There will probably be far more 720p sets in circulation than 1080p sets for a long time to come.

As much as we early adopters like to trumpet our importance, I don't think we amount to a hill of beans in this crazy war .

Looking back at Bill's article, I'm not convinced that the comparison to the early days of DVD are entirely valid. There was no format war then. Now there is. The more logical analogy is the VHS/Beta war. That war was not "fought" by early adopters. The average consumers of the world decided that conflict, for better or worse. And for better or worse, this war will more than likely be settled by the same "infantry" soldiers. The "Joe PS3s" of the world will go with the format that offers the best selection of movies they want to watch. If that selection reaches some level of parity fairly soon, then the war could go on a long time, and possibly never have a winner declared. But if the selection remains skewed toward Blu-ray, chances are it will win, and win handily.

I can totally see that happening.

Things you and I care more about: video/audio quality and extras.
Things the average consumer care more about: availability of movies and price.

I agree that it will be settled by joe six pack unfortunately. No argument there. But, I do argue that we DO amount to a hill of beans right now. We are the ones purchasing (or not purchasing) their products right now.

My point was that Im hoping that we, early adopters, pioneers, trendsetter, whatever you call us , set the standards for releases (which I think is happening). The outcry of The Fifth Element transfer has pushed Sony to possibly be releasing another version.

I think we all basically agree. Im right there with you on this.

Im just hoping we can influence the studios right now even if its minor.

IMO, it just seems that HD-DVD is really focused on making early adopters happy right now and BD is more focusing on those people who will pick up the PS3. In this case, I think hd-dvd has the right idea.

I got a surprise at Best Buy tonight. Both formats have been moved to a different area! The Blu-Ray player still has a hold over a large lcd display near the TV section but all of the discs for both formats are seperated right next to the new release dvds. The Hd-dvd section has "next generation dvd" on the top of the rack and Blu-Ray has it's logo and name.

Playstations now can fight disease too:

http://www.cnn.com/2006/TECH/fun.gam...ng/index.html/

I have to disagree on a few points being made. Frst of all you guys are making it out to look this way, that the early adopters are the people currently buying of course and make up the more educated people. By eductaed I mean belong to sites like this and are up to date with the news and technology. the 2nd group or non early adopters are not educated and only care about what movies will be available for thier given format and have little care for wether or not a competing format is a better value, value being better transfer, more extras etc..

While I do belive there is some truth to this model, I also find that it falls way to far from the tree when discussing the entire population and thier movie buying habits. I do agree that the early adopters are by far the more educated and are by far the ones more willing to choose a format on quality over quantity. With that being said I think that this educated customer goes much farther down the consumer buying chain then many of you are giving it credit for. I dont think you realize just how many people have acces to the internet now and just how many people actually do look into these kinds of things before making a purchases, moreso because there is a format war going on.

I think alot more people than you realize currently know that Sonys' Blu-Ray has not lived up to its expectations and that HD-DVDhas done just the opposite. The way I look at it there are going to be 3 major groups that end up with a HD-DVD or BD drive in thier home in the next 2 or 3 years and those are:

1 - Hard Core movie nutballs like us that have to have the best in current technology.

2 - HDTV buyers who end up getting a HD-DVD or BD player simply because they have already invested in a HDTV. Why get a HDTV if your not going to get a HD PLayer will be the prevailing mentailty.

3 - Next generation Video Game console owners including PS3 and Xbox360 owners.

I honestly feel that the rest of the population will not switch from SD DVD's quite so quickly as they are happy with the quality DVD's and the selection and price of DVD's as well. I mean how can you not be. The SD DVD market is absolutly heaven for anyone loving anything to do with sports, TV or film. Its by far the best format ever released to the home entertainment market and the amount of titles available and the prices which you can get them for are staggering. Even the average person today can have a huge DVD collection for very little money if purchased correctly. There is a big difference between the VHS/SD DVD upgrade and the SD DVD/HD DVD upgrade.

Now out of those 3 groups that I mentioned above that will most likly be the ones upgrading to HD in the next few years. I find that a good percentage of these people are not only educated, but very internet literate. The fact that 60% of the people who have purchased Xbox 360's are using XBox Live just further backs that up. While they may not be as hardcore as the people on this board, I do think they are hardcore enough to follow the major news ragrding the formats and thier success so far. Given that these purchases are somewhat expensive only makes me think that even more will do research before making the plunge.

Then you have to look at the fact that its going to be groups 1 & 2 that most likly do most of the movie purchasing once they actually do own a HD player. While you can argue that alot of the video game console owners will be major purchasers in regards to movies, I dont think you can argue that it would still be a small percentage of overall console owners. The majority of console owners would buy a few movies here and there and would be buying more videogames than movies and with next gen videogames costing 60 bucks and up now, well thats even less money for them to spend on movies.

So to sum this up, I just really have a very different picture than some of you do on the overall picture of who will be buying what and how educated will those people be. I really feel that the majority of peole that end up investing into HD players the first couple years they are out make up a much more educated and skilled buyer than in history past. These are internet savy people who know how to look for deals and know how to research items. I just refuse to accept that most of the people that invest this kind of money into products like these and in these times are uneductaed people who just want selection and dont care about quality.

I think sony may have alot more players in the market in the next couple years but i think the sales of movies per unit will be heavily favored in HD-DVD's corner. That is of course if everything continues to unfold as they have been

PS...