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If you're gonna get into HD DVD...do it soon!

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If you're gonna get into HD DVD...do it soon!

Old 08-31-06, 01:19 AM
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If you're gonna get into HD DVD...do it soon!

From Robert on AVS:

G1 HD players have always and are now in short supply. They will very quickly disappear as their is (a.) very little inventory in any part of the pipeline, (b.) no more production after September. I would not expect to find A1 players after the end of September easily if at all.
Personally, I saw my Best Buy had about 5-6 of them yesterday and that's the most I've ever seen there.

Are others still experiencing shortages at their stores?

I wanted to post this separately for those who may be on the fence or otherwise wouldn't delve into the "Vs." thread.
Old 08-31-06, 01:32 AM
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So when are we meant to expect G2 players? Don't tell me that from September to the end of 2006 we won't see any more HD DVD players at all.
Old 08-31-06, 06:25 AM
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I'm already into the format and have NOT YET purchased a player! I have a bounty of discs but I'm holding out for a second generation player; so a shortage on current models doesn't mean a thing to me. All the glitches associated with first generation devices makes me happy to enjoy my massive D-VHS collection.
Old 08-31-06, 08:10 AM
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I think the title is a bit misleading. A better title would be "Generation 2 HD-DVD players just over the horizon..."

I'm still happy with my A1. The thing is built like a tank.
Old 08-31-06, 08:12 AM
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Yeah, I really like the A1. I'm kind of doubting the second generation player will be built this well.
Old 08-31-06, 08:43 AM
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Originally Posted by darkside
Yeah, I really like the A1. I'm kind of doubting the second generation player will be built this well.
Improved loading times would be nice in a 2nd gen player. Plus, doesn't the HD-A1 only support 1080i?

Either way, it's a great piece of hardware. The firmware updates have been frequent and ironed out a lot of the early kinks.
Old 08-31-06, 09:14 AM
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Might as well mention this deal to those who have overlooked it:
http://forum.dvdtalk.com/showthread.php?t=470228

$363.xx shipped for an A1.
Old 08-31-06, 10:33 AM
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I bet the gen 2 players look like that new European model
Old 08-31-06, 10:40 AM
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Originally Posted by Doughboy
Improved loading times would be nice in a 2nd gen player. Plus, doesn't the HD-A1 only support 1080i?

Either way, it's a great piece of hardware. The firmware updates have been frequent and ironed out a lot of the early kinks.
Robert at VE already confirmed the load times would be greatly improved for G2 but I don't think 1080p will happen.
Old 08-31-06, 12:15 PM
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Originally Posted by Doughboy
Improved loading times would be nice in a 2nd gen player. Plus, doesn't the HD-A1 only support 1080i?

Either way, it's a great piece of hardware. The firmware updates have been frequent and ironed out a lot of the early kinks.
Yeah, we are stuck at 1080i, but I only have a 1080i TV and won't be getting a new one anytime soon. Also the image upscales nicely to 1080p anyway. Its a non issue. The Samsung can't really do 1080p either and it promotes it because it upscales 1080i. Really no difference between it and the A1 hooked up to a 1080p TV.
Old 08-31-06, 12:27 PM
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Originally Posted by darkside
Yeah, we are stuck at 1080i, but I only have a 1080i TV and won't be getting a new one anytime soon. Also the image upscales nicely to 1080p anyway. Its a non issue. The Samsung can't really do 1080p either and it promotes it because it upscales 1080i. Really no difference between it and the A1 hooked up to a 1080p TV.
And, in the final analysis, there's no real difference between a 1080i player and a "true" 1080p player, when connected to a 1080p set. The set, unless it is of substandard design, will be able to recombine the fields of the 1080i signal back to it's full 1080p glory. Mine does.
Old 08-31-06, 12:32 PM
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Assuming that Gen2 will be better and cheaper.....why on earth would anyone recommend that consumers rush to buy the G1 machines? Toshiba does not usually go backwards in features/quality.
Old 08-31-06, 12:46 PM
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Originally Posted by Spiky
Assuming that Gen2 will be better and cheaper.....why on earth would anyone recommend that consumers rush to buy the G1 machines? Toshiba does not usually go backwards in features/quality.
My exact question. Now, it's pretty common that as scale ramps up, quality slowly but incrementally goes down. Hence, your 20-year old, $1000 CD player will play better than the average $15 boombox from Best Buy. Somewhere in G3 or G4 there will be noticeable build quality differences. Not to say that those players will be crap - they probably won't. But something has to give.

I can understand wanting to coax people into getting into HD-DVD soon. Waiting a year might save you $300 but that's a whole year you won't be watching some movies on HD.

But to give this story as a supporting argument...
Old 08-31-06, 12:59 PM
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If they want HDDVD to succeed, how smart is it to have the flagship, reasonably affordable player out of stock and out of production going into the holiday season?
I rarely get first gen hardware, so I'd be waiting anyway.

so is it a 'great player' or is it 'full of glitches'?
Old 08-31-06, 01:00 PM
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The next players will, most likely, NOT be as well built as G1 players. If you're not interested in that, Spiky, then go ahead and wait.
Old 08-31-06, 01:14 PM
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So the company will knowing release an inferior, second gen product, to follow on the heels of a well-built, very limited device? That doesn't make a lot of sense; I'll agree with mr Bus that the quality will drop as they become more 'popular' and they have to churn them out, but usually the first couple generations are improvements.
Old 08-31-06, 01:17 PM
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Originally Posted by dtcarson
So the company will knowing release an inferior, second gen product, to follow on the heels of a well-built, very limited device? That doesn't make a lot of sense; I'll agree with mr Bus that the quality will drop as they become more 'popular' and they have to churn them out, but usually the first couple generations are improvements.
I found the following thread (re: G1 build quality) to be pretty interesting:

http://www.highdefforum.com/showthread.php?t=25018
Old 08-31-06, 02:20 PM
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Toshiba DVD players definately went down in quality as the generations increased.
Old 08-31-06, 02:27 PM
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Originally Posted by dtcarson
so is it a 'great player' or is it 'full of glitches'?
After 60+ hours of use, I have yet to encounter a single glitch.
Old 08-31-06, 02:40 PM
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Originally Posted by digitalfreaknyc
The next players will, most likely, NOT be as well built as G1 players.
What exactly do you mean? And based on what?
Old 08-31-06, 02:42 PM
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Originally Posted by The Bus
After 60+ hours of use, I have yet to encounter a single glitch.
I experienced some skipping on the first HD-DVD I ever played on the HD-A1 which was Serenity. But that was only in the first 10 minutes of the movie. And it's the only glitch I've ever seen.

The firmware updates have corrected a lot of the other reported glitches. Even the menus run smoother now.
Old 08-31-06, 03:42 PM
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Originally Posted by The Bus
Now, it's pretty common that as scale ramps up, quality slowly but incrementally goes down. Hence, your 20-year old, $1000 CD player will play better than the average $15 boombox from Best Buy. Somewhere in G3 or G4 there will be noticeable build quality differences.
In entry level players, I most definitely agree. But to say that you can't buy a 3rd or 4th generation product that matches the build quality of the 1st generation is not true, at least from my experience. You can spend $50 on a CD player today, but you can also still buy a $1000+ CD transport. You can buy a $150 A/V receiver today, but you can also spend $5000 on one.

I don't doubt that there will be HD DVD and BD players of diminishing quality as time progresses, but that is the nature of the consumer electronics business. That is how they saturate the market with product. But I have no doubt that high-end players will always be available (at least as long as the formats survive), and I would bet that a $500 player in 5 years will actually be better in build quality than the HD-A1, and probably offer much better features as well.

Oh, and BTW, my $20-year-old, $700 CD player doesn't play CDs even as well as anything I can buy today, because the laser pickup in that player died a few years ago, and it wasn't worth the expense to replace it.
Old 08-31-06, 04:02 PM
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Originally Posted by bwvanh114
What exactly do you mean? And based on what?
No offense but have you read any of this thread??? All the answers are contained within.
Old 08-31-06, 04:32 PM
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Originally Posted by digitalfreaknyc
No offense but have you read any of this thread??? All the answers are contained within.
No offense, but when I read your post, all the answers were not contained within. You said, "The next players will, most likely, NOT be as well built as G1 players." and I want to know why you think that.

I still do as I don't think this thread adequately answers the question.
Old 08-31-06, 04:49 PM
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bwvanh114: I agree with you. The only evidence in this thread for the next gens to not be as good as this gen were the quote you referred to, and the Bus's that "Now, it's pretty common that as scale ramps up, quality slowly but incrementally goes down....Somewhere in G3 or G4 there will be noticeable build quality differences." Even DFNYC says "most likely".

I've always thought of it more like a bell curve, when balancing quality and price: first gen expensive, maybe somewhat buggy; next gen a little cheaper, a few extra features, some design improvements and not as buggy; then cheaper still and more improvement; eventually you can buy an el cheapo device that is not great quality, but still does the job; though there's still quality machines available at different price points. At that point you're getting into the 'disposable' type options, 50 buck dvd players, etc.

But the vibe I'm getting from HDDVD proponents is "Buy it now, or you'll regret it!" , and I'm not seeing any real reason why that should be the case, except for lowered availability and a delay before G2 comes out.

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