At least use a smiley or something so i know you're kiddin!

I admit that a lot of my feelings with regards to this is the same condescending holier-than-thou attitudes that every person who is a die-hard BR fan expresses. There are those who remain agnostic who I have no problem having a pleasant discussion with. When those who are obviously "for" BR come up, there's such an arrogance about their posts and their distaste for anything that's not BR, it just becomes another one of the many turn-off's of the format. After this whole fiasco, I have to say I will NEVER buy another Sony product again. I never understood why so many people hated Sony in the past. Now I get it.

Would I go so far as to say that HD DVD will win? Hell no. Will I put something in my sig supporting it? Hell no. I have no idea who will win. I think most of the signs point towards HD DVD but since I'm not a mind-reader like some members pretend to be, I can't say for certain. As I said, the general public is dumb and cheap when it comes to electronics. Luckily, both of those things will work to their advantage in this situation if they're seriously looking to trade-up.

nah, sorry there, I really shouldn't have said that - it was kind of out of line for me to be that crass.

Are you serious? I'm convinced those are Microsoft employees posting stuff so idiotic everyone will hate Sony. This forum may be Microsoft's greatest viral marketing ever. I may never buy another Sony product just out of distaste of the fanboys on this site.

Sony make great products but the way they seem to be handling Blu Ray and especially PS3 seems to suggest someone is asleep at the wheel.

I was originally thinking Blu-Ray would easily win the format war, but HD DVD is putting up a great fight (granted sony hasnt shipped yet so there is no competition at moment).

Should be an interesting year.......

I agree with this part of the statement. HD DVD fans are quick to bash BR since Sony is one of the CO-developers. Most look at it as if Sony solely developed the Blu-ray standard, when if fact multiple companies developed it.

Remember, HD DVD is based on the AOD format that was developed by none other than Toshiba and NEC. Of course Toshiba would back the product that it has a stake in just as Sony is doing the same.

Blu-ray was announced by nine companies before AOD (
http://www.pcworld.com/news/article/0,aid,84964,00.asp) followed by AOD (http://www.pcworld.com/news/article/0,aid,104489,00.asp and http://www.pcworld.com/news/article/0,aid,104570,00.asp).

Notice how the first AOD article mentions the following:

Neither are perfect, but we should wait until both formats are out before deciding which is better.

If Blu-Ray were the next Beta, I certainly wouldn't be bashing it. Beta was light years better than VHS in quality.

We don't have that difference here.

BR fanboys seem to be especially defensive these days since they, unlike the content HD DVD fanboys, have no product to crow about. All their vehement arguments inevitably revert to the capacity issue, and that's the only thread they're holding on to now (which is a pretty thin thread given that HD DVD discs will initially have more capacity). It's so easy to hate Sony when they themselves make such arrogent comments such as "they (HD DVD) don't have the horses to compete with us" (stated just a couple of weeks ago).

Don't forget studio and manufacturer support.

That's a valid argument, but keep Sony and Blu-ray seperate issues. If you have a problem with Sony then don't blame Blu-ray for it. Blu-ray isn't a Sony only technology.

Because HD DVD has their player out and Bluray doesn't, many BR fans are laying low and not posting like they have before HD DVD was released. I think they'll be back with a vengeance when they get their players too, and it'll probably be worse than ever.

My bad. Sometimes the distinction gets blurry to me.

I don't agree with bashing from any side. We're all entitled to our own opinions, but when it comes down to it only the facts are what matters and right now we don't have all the facts. Bashing just makes things worse.

I'm just wondering how many of those $1000 and $1800 players will be flying off of shelves.

I never implied bashing. Ok, maybe I shoulda left the horses in the corral

That may be your perception, but I can't say that I necessarily agree with it. From my observations, most people don't "bash" BD because Sony co-developed it. If anything, it is because of the way so many of the BD Boys continually parrot the line that Sony is the savior of BD, and that with Sony backing it, there is simply no way BD can fail. That, combined with Sony's profoundly arrogant attitude, makes it difficult to separate the format from the company.

All of them... if the shelves were tipped over.

I don't mind paying extra for a good quality player. Yes, it seems Blu-ray players may be more expensive, but there are limited HD DVD players out right now. There also is some speculation as to what the price of future HD DVD players will be.

Right now HD DVD only has 1, make that 2, HD DVD players out which are made by Toshiba. From what I've read the RCA, etc. players are just rebadged Toshiba models. It doesn't look good when Toshiba can't produce a lot of those $499 players.

I'd like to see players from other manufacturers and what their price point will be.

bruceames, the bashing wasn't directed at you. That was directed at the community as a whole.

I'm cool.

Anyway, whether or not a debate here reduces itself to bashing (intentional or not, real or imaginary), the fact remains that this is a very hot and sensitive topic. And it sure seems that the Bluray side have quicker triggers.

Exactly. I'm fully aware that there are other companies involved. Notice that none of them are really saying anything? Sony is the mouthpiece in this particular war.

And what a big mouth it is.

I agree I don't expect them to sell well. Why buy a Blu-Ray player for that price when you can get a Playstation 3 for cheaper? I expect Playstation 3 to sell like hot cakes.

Hot cake sales are trending downward, though.

Which gives HD DVD a, what, 7 month lead?