French bashing
08-25-05 | 01:37 PM
#1
Thread Starter
DVD Talk Hero
French bashing
Simple question, why is it allowed? Why have a 3 page thread where people are worried about the occasional off-hand comment that could be interpreted as "subtle racism" and yet, some posters are allowed to constantly start threads, not because they are interested in intelligent discussion, but for the sole purpose of bashing the French. It has become a sport and most people seem to believe it's perfectly acceptable because well... the French suck. Would people be allowed to constantly start threads bashing gays or blacks? Certainly not. So why the double standard? Occasional jokes are part of forum life but this type of behavior goes much further than this and nothing has been done to make it stop. And what happens when you do nothing and you let this type of behavior flourish? Well you get threads like this one, where people up the ante by using ethnic slurs and only get a tiny slap on the hand for it...
http://www.dvdtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=435250
http://www.dvdtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=435250
08-25-05 | 02:00 PM
#2
DVD Talk Hero
I think it is a good point. I have moderated French bashing (or French "jokes") threads in the past. I have not seen this particular one, but it does seem to be treated differently on all forums, not just DVDtalk.
08-25-05 | 05:35 PM
#3
DVD Talk Hero
I think all racial slurs should be allowed and people should learn not to be offended by them.
What the hell is the difference between "Fucking french people
" and "Fucking frogs "? Either way I'm talking down on you.
I can't stand how people get so butthurt by made up words.
What the hell is the difference between "Fucking french people
" and "Fucking frogs "? Either way I'm talking down on you.I can't stand how people get so butthurt by made up words.
08-25-05 | 06:15 PM
#5
Thread Starter
DVD Talk Hero
Whether some people are overly sensitive or not is besides the point.
Whether all derogatory terms or no derogatory terms should be allowed is also besides the point. Although, even if I'm not personally that offended by them, they do promote hatred and intolerance which is hardly acceptable.
The point is, either there are rules or there are none. And if there are rules they should be applied the same way, without any exceptions, regardless of the prevailing forum member's stance on a specific race/religion/sexual orientation/nationality. French bashing shoudn't be treated differently because most people on these forums believe that the French suck.
Whether all derogatory terms or no derogatory terms should be allowed is also besides the point. Although, even if I'm not personally that offended by them, they do promote hatred and intolerance which is hardly acceptable.
The point is, either there are rules or there are none. And if there are rules they should be applied the same way, without any exceptions, regardless of the prevailing forum member's stance on a specific race/religion/sexual orientation/nationality. French bashing shoudn't be treated differently because most people on these forums believe that the French suck.
08-25-05 | 06:28 PM
#6
DVD Talk Hero
Or one could just ignore it and stop making every marginal ethnic or racial slur on an anonymous message board into a cause for a crusade to rid the world of such atrocities.
Until this message board becomes a hotbed of blatant racism that would make the KKK smile, I think nothing should be done here. If you're gonna stop the french bashing, you gotta stop the white trash bashing, not to mention the muslim bashing and basically bashing of any variety.
And if you take away all the bashing, all you're left with is the edit king babbling about whatever thought is in his head at the moment.
Until this message board becomes a hotbed of blatant racism that would make the KKK smile, I think nothing should be done here. If you're gonna stop the french bashing, you gotta stop the white trash bashing, not to mention the muslim bashing and basically bashing of any variety.
And if you take away all the bashing, all you're left with is the edit king babbling about whatever thought is in his head at the moment.
08-25-05 | 07:21 PM
#7
Thread Starter
DVD Talk Hero
One last time, every forum is going to have a marginal amount of bashing. That's unavoidable. But it clear to me and I would hope to others, that French bashing has gone overboard and that a double standard is applied when it comes to dealing with it. RandyC seems to agree with me. If you are oblivious to that fact and/or find it acceptable and don't think it's a big deal, then there is nothing further I can say to convince you.
08-25-05 | 09:13 PM
#8
DVD Talk Limited Edition
In my humble opinion, French bashing, when done in fun, is the god-given right of all English speakers. It's just traditional. Calling someone "a fucking frog" isn't fun, though, so I don't approve of it.
This was kind of funny (to me at least):
And should pass as okay.
But that's just me. Maybe I'm insensitive.
Or it could be I that I haven't gotten over the cute French foreign exchange student at our house twenty years ago who mocked my accent when I tried to talk to him. Damn older Parisian kid for making me feel stupid and provincial. )
This was kind of funny (to me at least):
Originally Posted by The Bus
Famous Frogs
Not Frogs:
Not Frogs:
But that's just me. Maybe I'm insensitive.
Or it could be I that I haven't gotten over the cute French foreign exchange student at our house twenty years ago who mocked my accent when I tried to talk to him. Damn older Parisian kid for making me feel stupid and provincial.
)
08-26-05 | 12:17 PM
#12
DVD Talk Special Edition
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It seemed like it was mainly the "fucking frogs" comment since I read the entire thread and am dumber from reading it. It would be hard for me to take anything seriously from that thread.
08-26-05 | 01:03 PM
#13
DVD Talk Godfather
I'm glad someone liked my joke. I've been smitten* by that man ever since I was him in the delightful INS rom-com Green Card.
Unless I learned English from the wrong sources, "Racist" always meant to me something similar to Dictionary.com's entry, "Discrimination or prejudice based on race." I fail to see how national origin is racist. I always thought France to be one of Europe's most heterogenous countries (behind only Spain, Britain, and Italy).
I think there's a fine line between playful joking and mean-spiritedness.
This (amazingly SFW) link at *********** goes over the history of American Franchophobia. For those of you at work or behind firewalls, I will post a short summary here:
It then goes on to a timeline of American anti-France events, dating back to the 1700s but mostly focused on the last 25 years and ending on this quote:
<blockquote>"The last time the French asked for 'more proof' it came marching into Paris under a German flag." -- David Letterman</blockquote>
France-hating is certainly somewhat ingrained in our culture (America). Why that is, I don't know. It might deserve our ridicule (as do all countries, including ourselves), but not our hate.
I'm not saying it's right, but a slight amount has to be allowed. (Especially if people can drone on and on negatively about any subject remotely connected with rap using outdated lingo and subtly racial comments).
As always, it falls upon the shoulders of moderators to draw the line somewhere betwen good-natured humor and unneeded jingoism.
* Where I define smitten as: smitten adj. To not watch movies of.
Unless I learned English from the wrong sources, "Racist" always meant to me something similar to Dictionary.com's entry, "Discrimination or prejudice based on race." I fail to see how national origin is racist. I always thought France to be one of Europe's most heterogenous countries (behind only Spain, Britain, and Italy).
I think there's a fine line between playful joking and mean-spiritedness.
This (amazingly SFW) link at *********** goes over the history of American Franchophobia. For those of you at work or behind firewalls, I will post a short summary here:
For the past sixty years, France has been a mainstay of American xenophobia. Since World War II, their citizens have been the butt of foreigner jokes for three generations of Americans. It all boils down to a deep-seated suspicion that, for whatever reason, the crepe-eaters just plain never fought hard enough against the Germans.
America stereotypes the people of France as rude, effete bastards having an undeserved air of self-importance and a culture based primarily around their cuisine. They are generally dismissed as pretentious egomaniacs, with a propensity toward an undeserved ethnocentrism.
These prejudices against the French are so engrained in American culture that isolated instances go unchallenged by typical citizens. In fact, they're barely even noticed at all -- fading into the background. Since they were young, Americans have become desensitized to anti-French portrayals in the media and overall culture.
So, naturally, when France began making noises that they would veto a United Nations resolution authorizing America to stomp Saddam flat, the response back in the US of A was fairly predictable.
French wine flowed in the streets, the various gutter bordeaux and beaujolais, never mind that the French still received payment for such spilt protest. And Fox News pundit Bill O'Reilly called for a consumer boycott of French goods.
Florida Congresswoman Ginny Brown-Waite sponsored House Resolution 1265: the American Hero's Repatriation Act of 2003. "France has consistently turned its back on the United States... They forget, if it weren't for America, they would be speaking German today."
America stereotypes the people of France as rude, effete bastards having an undeserved air of self-importance and a culture based primarily around their cuisine. They are generally dismissed as pretentious egomaniacs, with a propensity toward an undeserved ethnocentrism.
These prejudices against the French are so engrained in American culture that isolated instances go unchallenged by typical citizens. In fact, they're barely even noticed at all -- fading into the background. Since they were young, Americans have become desensitized to anti-French portrayals in the media and overall culture.
So, naturally, when France began making noises that they would veto a United Nations resolution authorizing America to stomp Saddam flat, the response back in the US of A was fairly predictable.
French wine flowed in the streets, the various gutter bordeaux and beaujolais, never mind that the French still received payment for such spilt protest. And Fox News pundit Bill O'Reilly called for a consumer boycott of French goods.
Florida Congresswoman Ginny Brown-Waite sponsored House Resolution 1265: the American Hero's Repatriation Act of 2003. "France has consistently turned its back on the United States... They forget, if it weren't for America, they would be speaking German today."
<blockquote>"The last time the French asked for 'more proof' it came marching into Paris under a German flag." -- David Letterman</blockquote>
France-hating is certainly somewhat ingrained in our culture (America). Why that is, I don't know. It might deserve our ridicule (as do all countries, including ourselves), but not our hate.
I'm not saying it's right, but a slight amount has to be allowed. (Especially if people can drone on and on negatively about any subject remotely connected with rap using outdated lingo and subtly racial comments).
As always, it falls upon the shoulders of moderators to draw the line somewhere betwen good-natured humor and unneeded jingoism.
* Where I define smitten as: smitten adj. To not watch movies of.
08-26-05 | 01:58 PM
#14
DVD Talk Legend
Originally Posted by eXcentris
One last time, every forum is going to have a marginal amount of bashing. That's unavoidable. But it clear to me and I would hope to others, that French bashing has gone overboard and that a double standard is applied when it comes to dealing with it. RandyC seems to agree with me. If you are oblivious to that fact and/or find it acceptable and don't think it's a big deal, then there is nothing further I can say to convince you.
Just some social-culture thing.
08-26-05 | 03:13 PM
#16
DVD Talk Legend
BTW, for what's worth, I think those frog jokes are totally lame.
The Pepe Le Pew skunk is still the best one.
As racist as some may think Looney Tunes may have been, it's still pretty damn funny.
The Pepe Le Pew skunk is still the best one.
As racist as some may think Looney Tunes may have been, it's still pretty damn funny.
08-26-05 | 07:47 PM
#17
DVD Talk Hall of Fame
Originally Posted by El Scorcho
And if you take away all the bashing, all you're left with is the edit king babbling about whatever thought is in his head at the moment.
08-27-05 | 12:16 PM
#20
Thread Starter
DVD Talk Hero
The Bus good post, and I agree with:
This line is often crossed but this comes from a very small minority of posters who relish the French bashing and cause others to jump on the bandwagon. Why these instigators have never been warned is beyond me. The fact that there is a history of French hatred should not be used as an excuse to condone such behavior. Like I said, I don't mind the occasional joke (although some NEW ones would be nice ) but these often lead to downright mean and ugly stuff.
Ranger, Pepe Le Pew rocks!
And since you can't properly bash without good grammar, I suggest a grammar subforum for Canadian Bacon.
I think there's a fine line between playful joking and mean-spiritedness.
) but these often lead to downright mean and ugly stuff.Ranger, Pepe Le Pew rocks!
And since you can't properly bash without good grammar, I suggest a grammar subforum for Canadian Bacon.
08-27-05 | 03:22 PM
#22
DVD Talk God
Originally Posted by Lemdog
If we did some German bashing to even it out, would that make everyone feel better?
but we still need to stick to 95:5 french bashing
08-27-05 | 03:27 PM
#23
DVD Talk Legend
Being stuck in South Florida for oh so many years, I have seen this area filled with ethnic types of various races/regions/religions. Retirees, Haitians, Cubans, Brazilians, El Salvadorians, Catholics, Baptists, Jews, Lutherans, blacks, whites, hispanics, whateveretc. etc. They all get along or don't get along in various degrees. But one thing is for certain: each and every last one of them LOATHES French Canadians. I have no explanation for this, but there you are.