4th Annual August Animation Challenge - Discussion Thread
#101
Re: 4th Annual August Animation Challenge - Discussion Thread
I decided to start with Batman: TOS and went to find all the volumes *now* so I don't have to interrupt the viewing later. I easily locate V1, V3, & V4 but V2 is being elusive. I pull out *all* the unwatched TV stuff from the various cubby holes, nooks, and cranies *twice* and it's nowhere to be found (there are many with several that are 3 layers deep and it took about an hour). I *know* I have a copy as it was the first volume of the series I purchased. I finally decide it can't be found when I realize *I've already watched it!* and it's on the "I've watched it already" shelves! I go look... Yep... there it is... I check my challenge lists to find I watched it *two years ago* on August 5th & 6th! That's when I remember I'd done that to make sure I really wanted to purchase the rest of the series. Man... I gotta get more sleep...
#102
DVD Talk Hall of Fame
Re: 4th Annual August Animation Challenge - Discussion Thread
Thanks for posting that information about episode order! I'd purchased that series out of order and was waiting to start watching for this years challenge as I finally picked up V1 a few months back. Looks like I'll be researching the proper viewing order before I start the journey.
What throws off the DVD sequencing is that the very first episode to air was "The Cat and the Claw, Part I"...on a Saturday. "On Leather Wings" aired on a Monday, and "The Cat and the Claw, Part II" didn't air until the Saturday after Part I. Ergo, the decision to be made when sequencing the DVDs was: which makes the most sense? They went with an amalgamation of production and airdate order. There may be some continuity issues in Volume One, since those were the lion's share of the first episodes and therefore introduced and established everyone, but to be honest I wouldn't sweat worrying about sequencing unless you're really just that determined.
Volume 1 of Batman: TAS has some wonderful episodes: "Appointment in Crime Alley," "Beware the Gray Ghost," and "Two-Face."
I hate to keep harping on my own previously written remarks about that show, but I also hate to be repetitive. My laziness is the tie-breaker so I'll just leave this here. I wrote about for each of the four DVD volumes on my blog. Here's Volume One. You'll see links to the other three volumes there.
One observation I made then that I will go ahead and repeat is how remarkable it was that for the first time in my generation, mainstream animation featured guns firing actual bullets. After a decade of laser blasts that only ever stunned people, these weapons were real guns. I wasn't very cognizant of how important that was at the time, but in retrospect it's one of the elements that makes it such a point of demarcation from the "cartoons" of my childhood to the "animated series" of my adolescence.
Speaking of Harvey Dent, can some comic book readers answer a question for me: in the comics, how does Harvey Dent become Two-Face? The Animated Series has one scenario and the live action films have their own stories but I never looked into what the original source material said.
Animation has always been kind of a hard challenge for counting, with the blend of feature films that almost always have short running times, and episodes and short films with a wide spectrum of run times. If you look at my list, I'm keeping both a running "easy point" system tally and a "traditional counting method" converted score. It's easy so far, but as the month wears on I may abandon the conversion process because, as we all know, math is hard.
#103
DVD Talk Hall of Fame
Re: 4th Annual August Animation Challenge - Discussion Thread
As for me, after yet another rough day/night, I was up early this morning and elected to pop in the Ratatouille DVD. Titles link to my Letterboxd diary entries:
***SPOILER ALERTS FOR ANYONE READING EMAILS***
Lifted
Ratatouille
-X- Watch 2 films from Filmspotting Top 100 Animated Films
-X- Watch 2 Annie Awards Best Animated Feature winners
-X-Watch a Saturn Award for Best Animation Film winner
-X- 2000 (2007)
-X- G
-X- Mostly or all CGI
-X- Comedy
One could also argue this for Fantasy and Romance.
Your Friend the Rat
Lifted and Your Friend the Rat also count as 16:25 toward 90 minutes of short films.
***SPOILER ALERTS FOR ANYONE READING EMAILS***
Lifted
Spoiler:
Ratatouille
Spoiler:
-X- Watch 2 films from Filmspotting Top 100 Animated Films
-X- Watch 2 Annie Awards Best Animated Feature winners
-X-Watch a Saturn Award for Best Animation Film winner
-X- 2000 (2007)
-X- G
-X- Mostly or all CGI
-X- Comedy
One could also argue this for Fantasy and Romance.
Your Friend the Rat
Spoiler:
Lifted and Your Friend the Rat also count as 16:25 toward 90 minutes of short films.
#104
DVD Talk Limited Edition
Re: 4th Annual August Animation Challenge - Discussion Thread
"Appointment in Crime Alley" wound up my highest-ranked episode of the entire series, and second only to the feature film Batman: Mask of the Phantasm for that continuity when I went back through it all last December. I often balk at melodrama, but that show absolutely nailed it time and again.
I hate to keep harping on my own previously written remarks about that show, but I also hate to be repetitive. My laziness is the tie-breaker so I'll just leave this here. I wrote about for each of the four DVD volumes on my blog. Here's Volume One. You'll see links to the other three volumes there.
I think the maturity of the show is one of the reasons why it's holding up so well. It didn't pander to a "young" audience: the show told the stories it wanted to tell and you never outgrow good storytelling. I only have two complaints about the show and neither are a big deal: first, the fact that it's been over 20 years since this show started makes me feel old; and second, I wish they would clean it up a bit and release it on blu.
#105
DVD Talk Hall of Fame
Re: 4th Annual August Animation Challenge - Discussion Thread
At the very least, you'll want to watch Mask of the Phantasm and SubZero between Volume Three and Volume Four, because Volume Four contains The New Batman Adventures with the revamped design work. Much more than The Batman & Robin Adventures, that incarnation has its own identity entirely.
If you have it handy, I would also suggest prefacing Volume Four with The Batman/Superman Movie. That was the three-parter "World's Finest" (found on Superman: The Animated Series Volume Two). It aired just an episode or two into TNBA, so it was just easier for me to start with the Superman team-up and then go onto Volume Four in its entirety.
"Crime Alley" gives you Bruce Wayne's back story but without hitting you over the head with it. The final shot of Dr. Thompkins embracing Batman and the transition to the picture of her holding a young Bruce Wayne is still heartbreaking.
I think the maturity of the show is one of the reasons why it's holding up so well. It didn't pander to a "young" audience: the show told the stories it wanted to tell and you never outgrow good storytelling.
Later, of course, DC kept up with the show when it was reincarnated as The New Batman Adventures and created Batman: Gotham Adventures. It ran for 60 issues. Then they relaunched with Batman Adventures, which ran for 17 issues.
They did an amazing job with those books, being consistent with the tone of the series while still creating something independent of it. I *think* all of those issues can be acquired through comiXology to be read on a digital device. The Batman Adventures #1 is presently free and can be downloaded here.
I stopped keeping up with it some time near the end of The Batman & Robin Adventures and I missed all of Batman: Gotham Adventures, but that first run of The Batman Adventures rates as one of the best Batman comic book runs I've ever read. I'm actually about to go back through and re-read it in its entirety soon.
I only have two complaints about the show and neither are a big deal: first, the fact that it's been over 20 years since this show started makes me feel old; and second, I wish they would clean it up a bit and release it on blu.
#106
Re: 4th Annual August Animation Challenge - Discussion Thread
That version is the most consistent across the comics, but like Travis indicates all that really matters is the continuity of story. There have been several imposters and versions of "Two-Face" not all of which received the scarring via acid in the face.
EpGuides.com has a handy list of the series showing both production number and airdate.
What throws off the DVD sequencing is that the very first episode to air was "The Cat and the Claw, Part I"...on a Saturday. "On Leather Wings" aired on a Monday, and "The Cat and the Claw, Part II" didn't air until the Saturday after Part I. Ergo, the decision to be made when sequencing the DVDs was: which makes the most sense? They went with an amalgamation of production and airdate order. There may be some continuity issues in Volume One, since those were the lion's share of the first episodes and therefore introduced and established everyone, but to be honest I wouldn't sweat worrying about sequencing unless you're really just that determined.
What throws off the DVD sequencing is that the very first episode to air was "The Cat and the Claw, Part I"...on a Saturday. "On Leather Wings" aired on a Monday, and "The Cat and the Claw, Part II" didn't air until the Saturday after Part I. Ergo, the decision to be made when sequencing the DVDs was: which makes the most sense? They went with an amalgamation of production and airdate order. There may be some continuity issues in Volume One, since those were the lion's share of the first episodes and therefore introduced and established everyone, but to be honest I wouldn't sweat worrying about sequencing unless you're really just that determined.
One observation I made then that I will go ahead and repeat is how remarkable it was that for the first time in my generation, mainstream animation featured guns firing actual bullets. After a decade of laser blasts that only ever stunned people, these weapons were real guns. I wasn't very cognizant of how important that was at the time, but in retrospect it's one of the elements that makes it such a point of demarcation from the "cartoons" of my childhood to the "animated series" of my adolescence.
As I noted earlier in this thread (and I only repeat here because we've already had a lot of discussion and maybe you missed it, though it's just as likely you saw it and already commented on it and I've forgotten), but the reason for that was that the president of Filmation held out as long as he financially could to keep production in the United States rather than to outsource to cheaper foreign animators. He considered it worthwhile to recycle stock footage and keep American animators on the payroll.
#107
DVD Talk Hall of Fame
Re: 4th Annual August Animation Challenge - Discussion Thread
It occurs to me to ask, actually, what specific episodes bothered y'all about Robin appearing. The premise all along was that he was already Batman's partner, away at Gotham University when the show begins and we first meet everyone. There was no formal introductory episode for him. He did just kinda show up. "Robin's Reckoning" is his origin story, but it was never presented as his first appearance in the show.
#108
Re: 4th Annual August Animation Challenge - Discussion Thread
^Nothing for me. I'm about a half dozen episodes in and the only thing that is even remotely "off" so far is in one early episode the Police are hunting Batman as a criminal and the next they're all buddy-buddy. But that truly doesn't bother me like watching a continuing series out of order normally would. I think it's because I've been reading Batman stories for decades with the comics going back and forth seemingly at will. You know how it is, you'll read a "new" story that actually takes place in Batman's early years and the next arc will be the current timeline. That long comic history makes me comfortable with just about any order as long as multi-parters are in proper sequence.
#109
DVD Talk Hall of Fame
Re: 4th Annual August Animation Challenge - Discussion Thread
^Nothing for me. I'm about a half dozen episodes in and the only thing that is even remotely "off" so far is in one early episode the Police are hunting Batman as a criminal and the next they're all buddy-buddy. But that truly doesn't bother me like watching a continuing series out of order normally would. I think it's because I've been reading Batman stories for decades with the comics going back and forth seemingly at will. You know how it is, you'll read a "new" story that actually takes place in Batman's early years and the next arc will be the current timeline. That long comic history makes me comfortable with just about any order as long as multi-parters are in proper sequence.
#110
DVD Talk Special Edition
Re: 4th Annual August Animation Challenge - Discussion Thread
All this talk of Batman: TAS really makes me want to watch it. I was eight when the series aired and quickly became obsessed. My obsession with the show lead to a very short period where I would buy and read Batman comics, and in many ways, animated Batman is the Batman to me. I find myself scrutinizing all other adaptations against the animated series.
I've been rewatching Sealab 2021, a show that I'm a bit ashamed that I love so much. While a lot of the humor is very juvenile and nonsensical, there are very interesting episodes with very complex jokes and sequences that never fail to have me rolling on the floor. I haven't watched the show in years so it's been fun reacquainting myself with the show - makes me feel like I'm back in my crappy college apartment.
I've been rewatching Sealab 2021, a show that I'm a bit ashamed that I love so much. While a lot of the humor is very juvenile and nonsensical, there are very interesting episodes with very complex jokes and sequences that never fail to have me rolling on the floor. I haven't watched the show in years so it's been fun reacquainting myself with the show - makes me feel like I'm back in my crappy college apartment.
#111
DVD Talk Hall of Fame
Re: 4th Annual August Animation Challenge - Discussion Thread
All this talk of Batman: TAS really makes me want to watch it. I was eight when the series aired and quickly became obsessed. My obsession with the show lead to a very short period where I would buy and read Batman comics, and in many ways, animated Batman is the Batman to me. I find myself scrutinizing all other adaptations against the animated series.

(Your eight year-old self was right, by the way. That *is* the definitive take on the character and his mythology!)
#112
DVD Talk Platinum Edition
Re: 4th Annual August Animation Challenge - Discussion Thread
I just watched my first head scratcher of the challenge, "Street of Crocodiles." It used puppets. It was fairly dark and mysterious. And that's about all I understood. If I follow the music, I think it may have been a horror story? But I'm not sure. It's about 20 mins long and qualifies for both the ASIFA's Top 50 Animated Short Films and the puppet checkmark's if anyone else wants to try it.
#113
Re: 4th Annual August Animation Challenge - Discussion Thread
I watched Nightmare Before Christmas earlier today. I understand why my grandson doesn't care for it. It's mainly a musical! For that reason I, too, don't like it as much as I would if it were done without the music. The story is very good and the execution is excellent but I'm not a fan of musicals and generally avoid them. This one had some good songs but overall I'm still not too sure about it because it was done almost entirely in song. It will take another viewing or two to see if it grows on me enough to make the list of the handful of musicals I'll watch without someone else making the request. I frequently expected to hear Pink Floyd's "The Trial" (from "The Wall") to start playing as much of the music fit the feel of that particular piece.
Last edited by BobO'Link; 08-03-13 at 07:31 PM.
#114
Thread Starter
DVD Talk Hall of Fame
Re: 4th Annual August Animation Challenge - Discussion Thread
Now that I'm back home, I started my challenge. My first view of the challenge was also a first time view. I saw Planet 51 was the Saturday evening movie on Cartoon Network and since I had never seen it, decided to give it a try. I have to say it was quite an enjoyable movie.
#115
DVD Talk Platinum Edition
Re: 4th Annual August Animation Challenge - Discussion Thread
I watched Nightmare Before Christmas earlier today. I understand why my grandson doesn't care for it. It's mainly a musical! For that reason I, too, don't like it as much as I would if it were done without the music. The story is very good and the execution is excellent but I'm not a fan of musicals and generally avoid them. This one had some good songs but overall I'm still not too sure about it because it was done almost entirely in song. It will take another viewing or two to see if it grows on me enough to make the list of the handful of musicals I'll watch without someone else making the request. I frequently expected to hear Pink Floyd's "The Trial" (from "The Wall") to start playing as much of the music fit the feel of that particular piece.
#116
DVD Talk Hall of Fame
Re: 4th Annual August Animation Challenge - Discussion Thread
I watched Nightmare Before Christmas earlier today. I understand why my grandson doesn't care for it. It's mainly a musical! For that reason I, too, don't like it as much as I would if it were done without the music. The story is very good and the execution is excellent but I'm not a fan of musicals and generally avoid them.
#117
DVD Talk Hall of Fame
Re: 4th Annual August Animation Challenge - Discussion Thread
I'm pretty anti-musical, too. I had a similar, though lesser, reaction the first time I saw it. I've found in subsequent viewings that I really do enjoy that film. Incidentally, you'll find Corpse Bride is also a musical. Personally, I think its songs are a lot stronger, though admittedly it's been several years since I last saw it or heard anything from it. Bonejangles is pretty cool.
Very odd!
#118
DVD Talk Hall of Fame
Re: 4th Annual August Animation Challenge - Discussion Thread
The character first appeared in Detective Comics #66 (Aug. 1942) as "Harvey Kent" (later changed to Dent to avoid confusion with Clark Kent and people thinking they were related). A DA and former ally of Batman, Dent went insane after mob boss Sal Maroni threw acid at him during a trial, scarring the left side of his face. Dent became a criminal and adopted the "Two-Face" persona.
I've never seen a single episode of B:TAS. Read a lot of the comics, but I'm holding out for a good deal on the Complete DVD set (with book), and having a hard time finding one...
#119
DVD Talk Hall of Fame
Re: 4th Annual August Animation Challenge - Discussion Thread
I would definitely advise anyone interested to check out the original writer's bible, which someone has uploaded here. If you're looking for a nice book to add to your library, I highly endorse Batman Animated by Chip Kidd & Paul Dini. It's presently out of print. Some sellers are asking prohibitively high prices, but others are more reasonable.
#120
Re: 4th Annual August Animation Challenge - Discussion Thread
I can't help with online viewing of the Japanese categories (though I did enjoy "The Borrowers" and "Ponyo") but for the Russian ones, try "Hedgehog in the Fog." I found it on Youtube. I've also watched "Winnie the Pooh and a Busy Day." It's quite different than the Disney version. Also available on Youtube.
#121
Re: 4th Annual August Animation Challenge - Discussion Thread
You know, I never even thought to mention it had a lot of music in it? I guess I don't think of it as such. And I like musicals so it's not a big deal for me. But yeah, the music does have an integral role in the movie and helps the characters express themselves. I am glad you watched it though!
I picked up a copy of Corpse Bride cheap and watched it several months back (I thought for a challenge but can't find it listed). Like Nightmare... I didn't care for it much because of all the music but the story and animation work is good.
#122
Re: 4th Annual August Animation Challenge - Discussion Thread
For my first non-Japanese challenge entry, I pulled out THE MAGIC PONY, a Russian animated feature I used to watch with my daughter when she was little. I had picked up a legit VHS copy sometime since then and finally watched it. (The previous VHS copy was gray-market.) The film has a 1977 (c) date and the English dub was clearly done in the late 1970s, a determination I'm able to make thanks to the participation of Erin Moran (from "Happy Days"), although I'm not sure whose voice she dubs (probably that of the Magic Pony itself). The other name actors in the dub are Jim Backus and Hans Conried, both of whom did lots of animation voices.
But I come up with a mystery when trying to determine the origin of the film itself. There are two Soviet animated films listed with this title, one made in 1947 that was about an hour long and a remake by the same director made in 1975 that was a little longer. My copy is 74 min., so it's probably the 1975 remake. But the fluid animation is of such quality that I'm thinking it might be from 1947. It just doesn't look like 1970s Russian animation. IMDB says the 1975 remake was done because the 1947 version was in such bad shape it couldn't be restored. Yet, when I did a Google search, I found an image from a different animated version. And when I googled the 1947 version, I came up with images from the film I saw. Which doesn't confirm anything, of course. It just deepens the mystery. Here are some screen grabs from the VHS:


But I come up with a mystery when trying to determine the origin of the film itself. There are two Soviet animated films listed with this title, one made in 1947 that was about an hour long and a remake by the same director made in 1975 that was a little longer. My copy is 74 min., so it's probably the 1975 remake. But the fluid animation is of such quality that I'm thinking it might be from 1947. It just doesn't look like 1970s Russian animation. IMDB says the 1975 remake was done because the 1947 version was in such bad shape it couldn't be restored. Yet, when I did a Google search, I found an image from a different animated version. And when I googled the 1947 version, I came up with images from the film I saw. Which doesn't confirm anything, of course. It just deepens the mystery. Here are some screen grabs from the VHS:


#123
Re: 4th Annual August Animation Challenge - Discussion Thread
In spite of your mentioning this I'd forgotten which episode West was in so when he first speaks in "Beware the Gray Ghost" I said to my grandson, who was watching with me, "Wow! That's Adam West doing the voice of the Gray Ghost! He played Batman in the 1966 TV show!" He thought that was cool! My next thought was "I need to pull out Batman: The Movie for him to watch" followed by "The people holding up the release of that series on DVD need to get over their issues and sign the papers to allow the release."
#124
Thread Starter
DVD Talk Hall of Fame
Re: 4th Annual August Animation Challenge - Discussion Thread
Due to all of the talk of Batman: TAS, I thought I would post a little heads up for anyone interested. There is a CGI Batman cartoon, Beware the Batman on Cartoon Network on Sunday mornings, and possible Saturdays as well. It is part of their DC Nation lineup.
#125
Thread Starter
DVD Talk Hall of Fame
Re: 4th Annual August Animation Challenge - Discussion Thread
I just watched an episode of Harveytoons on KTV and saw something there I had forgotten, as I hadn't really watched Harveytoons since I was a kid. But after the two cartoons, there was a short that was actually educational, as this episode of Harveytoons showed cartoons set in Mexico, and the toon take was actually teaching kids about Mexico. Now that is good wholesome cartoons that they don't make anymore.



