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-   -   Bram Stoker's Dracula (Coppola) SE --> 10/2/07 (https://forum.dvdtalk.com/dvd-talk/507215-bram-stokers-dracula-coppola-se-10-2-07-a.html)

JOE29 10-03-07 10:18 AM

I just got back from Circut City in my home area and still no new Dracula dvd available. What's going on here? My local Wallmart, Best Buy and Circut City did not have it, unless it's sold out, but I don't expect that. Anyway, I'll have to take a road trip to Wallmart of a diffrent city first to see if they have it. $13 is too good to pass up. Somebody must have it, somewhere. And as for FYE, they do cost more than the other store's but they do have a better selection there and they do have sales there also. But you're right, they are more exoensive.

mike2 10-03-07 10:37 AM

I finally got it at walmart...i asked the manager because it just came out yesterday there's no way they'd be out of them already. He didn't really know what was going on but he went out back and came out with 3 so he exceeded my expectations!

Yavin 10-03-07 10:45 AM


Originally Posted by mike2
I finally got it at walmart...i asked the manager because it just came out yesterday there's no way they'd be out of them already. He didn't really know what was going on but he went out back and came out with 3 so he exceeded my expectations!

I never thought I'd see "walmart" and "exceeded my expectations" in the same paragraph!

mzupeman2 10-03-07 11:25 AM

Wal-Mart doesn't always have the goods but they do surprise on a regular basis with what they have in their DVD section. Take for example when Monster Squad came out, places sold out everywhere. But Wal-Mart had it... when I had a Best Buy in my area tell me they didn't even order any because 'it's an older film so it doesn't mean we'll carry it if we don't expect a high demand'. Shows you what people who actually work at these places know... yeesh.

ds6161 10-03-07 11:55 AM

Why does the new SE look so much better than the Superbit?
Is it just compression had improved that much over the years??

I have to get this now!!!!

Josh-da-man 10-03-07 02:57 PM


Originally Posted by Giles
what someone needs to do is post some screencaptures from the Criterion laserdisc which is Coppola approved transfer, supposedly it mirrors the new SE.

Review (w/screenshots) of the Criterion Dracula: http://www.horrordvds.com/modules.ph...article&id=224

GreenVulture 10-03-07 03:37 PM


Originally Posted by ReduxGuy
Should I take it back to Best Buy or boil Dracula for 2 min?

Water only works on wicked witches, not vampires, genius. -rolleyes-

(Unless you're also a priest...)

LorenzoL 10-03-07 04:30 PM

I'm also having a hard time finding this DVD in Canada. The Blu Ray version is available but the SD version is nowhere to be found.

mike2 10-03-07 04:58 PM


Originally Posted by Yavin
I never thought I'd see "walmart" and "exceeded my expectations" in the same paragraph!


I concur w/you 100% lol usually no one helps you and they're all clueless. He said he'd be back and he actually did come back lol..That right there was surprising! And of course the fact that he actually had it that sold me! $13 i'll take it.

dvduser6 10-03-07 05:12 PM

Struck gold at the Anaheim Walmart @ the 5 Fwy and Euclid. They had several copies placed in the horror section at the $13.72 price. If you're in the OC area, that seems to be your best bet. I had not luck at the Orange, CA store yesterday.

buckee1 10-03-07 05:55 PM


Originally Posted by GreenVulture
Water only works on wicked witches, not vampires, genius. -rolleyes-

(Unless you're also a priest...)

Running water will drown vampires. Just a very very nerdy moment. Now back to your regularly scheduled programming,

Steve Phillips 10-03-07 06:30 PM

Watch the end of DRACULA, PRINCE OF DARKNESS sometime!

wakwak007 10-03-07 07:01 PM

Hey RingMaster-
Thanks for giving me a "Heads Up" about Wal-mart's pricing. On my way to work this morning I stopped by a Wal-mart and picked up a copy.;)

baracine 10-03-07 07:38 PM

Everyone on the internet is linking to this DVDTalk - HD Talk discussion of the Blu-Ray disc for the screen captures: http://forum.dvdtalk.com/showthread.php?t=506506&page=2 and everybody seems to agree that the Blu-Ray transfer is a piece of utter crappola. What isn't clear yet is whether the Standard Disc is the same transfer and should be avoided like the plague. The DVDTalk review is no help as the reviewer admits to never having seen the film on DVD before.:(

My Superbit edition just went up in price.

Mr.Briggs 10-03-07 07:49 PM

My CC didn't have it on the shelf. The girl who runs the dept. said it was in the back & when she looked at it she said it had a large Do Not Sell until October 9 on it. I told her that it was a 10-2 release & to just check her website. She did & after a while agreed to sell me one. Problem was I wanted to pm Wal Mart who had it for $13.72 (I'd called) but when she called the video guy was in a meeting & the braindead girl in electronics couldn't find it to pm. So since they wanted $19.99 & I didn't want to go back I bought my F4 & Jungle Book & went to Wal Mart to buy it. Found it there in about 2 seconds. I bet all the CC stores probably had the same wrong shelf date for it.

baracine 10-03-07 08:06 PM

My favourite screen cap comparison is the following:

http://img516.imageshack.us/img516/7713/img2480wj3.jpg
(Superbit)

http://img516.imageshack.us/img516/1025/img2457ps4.jpg
(Blu-Ray)

The film has been drained of all colour and detail. What was visible before has been made invisible. It is truly supernatural!

Even the magnificent Gothic-Victorian subtitles for the Romanian speeches have been replaced by a cheap bargain basement modern font.

Jumpman 10-03-07 08:11 PM

The standard DVD version of the Special Edition doesn't look like that. I have no idea about the Blu-Ray version but I own the standard DVD and that screen cap doesn't represent the film at all. It's not even close.

canaryfarmer 10-03-07 09:19 PM

We've moved "beyond high defintion" so much that we've gone right back around to "steaming pile"!

ReduxGuy 10-03-07 10:58 PM


Originally Posted by Jumpman
The standard DVD version of the Special Edition doesn't look like that. I have no idea about the Blu-Ray version but I own the standard DVD and that screen cap doesn't represent the film at all. It's not even close.

Huh, so I guess everyone who bought the Superbit will be KEEPING the Superbit.

Yoda 10-04-07 02:54 AM


Originally Posted by Yavin
I really want to get this Dracula 2-disc, but the price of it here in Canada (~ $26 plus tax), the fact that I already own the Superbit, and the fact that I've run out of space on my dvd shelf (where am I going to put my FF:Rise of the Silver Surfer steelbook?) is forcing me to lean toward waiting till it drops in price a bit.

I have no more dvd space.....I have actually put dvd's into drawers in my nightstand lol.....At any rate the disc set is half the size of a normal dvd so you don't have any excuse! :P I actually didn't like the case but, I did really like the art used on the case.

baracine 10-04-07 05:08 AM


Originally Posted by Jumpman
The standard DVD version of the Special Edition doesn't look like that. I have no idea about the Blu-Ray version but I own the standard DVD and that screen cap doesn't represent the film at all. It's not even close.

To be fair, those screen caps appear to have been taken with a camera photographing a 4x3 TV set in "torch mode" but the fact remains that everyone agrees the new transfer is an abomination. From DVDTalk's HD review ( http://www.dvdtalk.com/reviews/read.php?ID=30820 ):


The Image:
I suppose there's no point beating around the bush. This AVC-encoded 1080p 1.85:1 transfer of Dracula looks dreadful. Simply terrible. There's almost no new detail distinguishable from the DVD versions. The picture is overly soft and often too dark. The drop off to black is outrageous. Details in shadow are practically not there. Now, to be fair, Dracula was shot soft, and a lot of the effects used don't help. But even then, there should be some sort of difference between a 480p transfer of the film and 1080p. In this case, the difference is almost negligible. I can't believe how bad this looks.

These are technical issues. They are the heart of the problems with this disc. However, there are aesthetic concerns that are worth mentioning as well. This transfer of Dracula was supervised by a representative of American Zoetrope, who relayed Francis Ford Coppola's wishes on how the film should look. The final product contains some major changes from the way the movie has looked previously. Dracula is a stylized film, and the colors used to reflect that: Vibrant tints of orange and blue gave the film an otherworldly look. Now, a good majority of the colors have been drained, at times making the film look almost black and white. Other changes, such as turning a light from white to green, have been made for no discernible reason. There is some debate as to how closely these changes reflect Coppola's actual desires. But until we get some kind of statement from Coppola denouncing this transfer, I can only assume that this is at least a reasonable approximation of what he would have done had he personally supervised it. I actually don't hate these new colors, but they are decidedly different and purists will want to pick up the Superbit DVD Sony released several years back. Nonetheless, these changes are not the true heart of the issue, and have no bearing on the low rating I'm giving the image on this disc. That is solely based on the poorly handled technical aspects, which is what people should be most up in arms about.
My personal theory is that, as usual, the colour-timing of the new transfer was done by a new breed of computer geeks who have spent so much time indoors playing with their machines and living in the virtual reality of their video games, that they have lost all touch with what the real world looks like and have no clue as to the look of the different times of day, real sunshine and natural lighting.

indy81 10-04-07 07:03 AM


Originally Posted by baracine
My personal theory is that, as usual, the colour-timing of the new transfer was done by a new breed of computer geeks who have spent so much time indoors playing with their machines and living in the virtual reality of their video games, that they have lost all touch with what the real world looks like and have no clue as to the look of the different times of day, real sunshine and natural lighting.

Why assume that this highly stylized film is supposed to look like "the real world"? I'm not saying the transfer wasn't bungled, but for all we know Coppola considered the earlier transfers too bright. I actually prefer some of the darker screencaps - they look scarier than the ones where you can see every detail of old Dracula's awful makeup. Just a thought.

baracine 10-04-07 08:24 AM


Originally Posted by indy81
Why assume that this highly stylized film is supposed to look like "the real world"? I'm not saying the transfer wasn't bungled, but for all we know Coppola considered the earlier transfers too bright. I actually prefer some of the darker screencaps - they look scarier than the ones where you can see every detail of old Dracula's awful makeup. Just a thought.

The whole film excels in giving various impressions of different times of the day - even in the studio-shot scenes. The final scene is a spectacular transition from a red sunset into night, hence the "orangy colours". To miss that is to miss the whole point of the scene. It could only have been done by (1) a machine or (2) a troglodyte (or cave-dweller) who has no idea what the outdoors and sunshine in particular look like.

Also, to obscure the film's award-winning costumes which everyone agrees are the real scenery of this film, and to transform them into an inky, undelineated mess, is tantamount to shooting oneself in the foot.

For more examples, I refer you to the DVDTalk - HD Talk discussion of the Blu-Ray edition.

Giles 10-04-07 08:31 AM


Originally Posted by baracine

Even the magnificent Gothic-Victorian subtitles for the Romanian speeches have been replaced by a cheap bargain basement modern font.

who's responsibility was that?! I'd send him/her to the guillotine.

baracine 10-04-07 08:45 AM

See our own Shannon Nutt's DVD review of the Blu-Ray disc on a rival site: ( http://www.dvdempire.com/Exec/v4_ite...or=1#topoftabs )


Overall Rating: 2.75 out of 5, including 1 review
In-House Review:
Dracula Will Make You Feel Blu...
2.75 out of 5.00 - Film: 3 Features: 3 Video: 1 Audio: 4 - 10/4/2007

See the title character shielding his eyes on the box cover for this Blu-ray release of Bram Stoker’s Dracula? That’s not because of the sunlight, that’s because he caught a glimpse of the horrible transfer Francis Ford Coppola’s movie has been given in high-def (and presumingly on the standard DVD special edition as well).

How bad is the video on this Blu-ray release? Well, if I hadn’t known going in, I would have swore I was watching a standard DVD...and a poor one at that. Not only is the picture “soft,” with tons of grain and little definition, but even the color that stood out in previous releases of Bram Stoker’s Dracula has been pulled back or removed all together for an earthier and muddier look.

The question here is, what exactly happened? Rumors are that Coppola’s American Zoetrope studio insisted on handling the current transfer themselves, and if that’s the case, let’s hope they don’t get their hands on Coppola’s Godfather trilogy or Apocalypse Now if and when those films come to hi-def. I’m not kidding, folks – of all the hi-def movies I own on both formats, Bram Stoker’s Dracula is far and away the worst looking of the lot.

I suppose it’s some consolation that the transfers of the movie don’t seep over to the bonus material. The extras that are presented in 1080i – consisting of a Coppola introduction to the movie (at the beginning of his feature-length commentary track), and some behind the scenes featurettes – are crisp and clear, and even offer some clips from the movie that are far sharper than the same footage from the movie transfer on this disc. Deleted scenes are also included on this release, but they are presented in standard resolution.

The audio doesn’t suffer the same fate as the video, as we get a nice uncompressed PCM 5.1 track here, in addition to a 5.1 Dolby Digital track. French, Hungarian, Czech and Polish 5.1 are also options, as is Russian 4.0.

How do the extras rank? Well Coppola’s commentary track is a mixed bag, offering insight at times, but also going on long rants describing the purpose of each scene...purposes that the typical film viewer doesn’t need explained if he or she is paying attention to the film. The behind the scenes featurettes are far more interesting, especially when covering the pre-production and preparation for the shoot. Here, we discover that Coppola had all the actors stay with him as they rehearsed scenes and went through a number of acting “exercises” that have to be seen to be believed. One of them involves the cast standing in a large circle and “throwing” sounds back and forth between each other. To see professional actors doing this kind of improvisation is funny. To see acting giants like Anthony Hopkins and Gary Oldman doing it is down right hilarious.

As for the movie itself? While much of it seems more like a stage play than an out-and-out horror movie, it remains one of the better Dracula movies to hit screens in recent years. Coppola is one of the few who have taken the character and made him sympathetic...Oldman’s Dracula is more tortured than evil.

Sadly, because of the awful transfer here, I can’t recommend picking up Bram Stoker’s Dracula, and that’s a shame. Here we have a title that would have looked great on Blu-ray and we get a release that barely looks good enough for DVD, let alone the hi-def format.

Prince Vlad must be rolling in his coffin....

Editor's Note:
Kim Aubrey, who works for ZAP Zoetrope Aubry Productions LLC and worked on the Blu-ray transfer of this title, took some issues with some of the statements in our Empire Review.

In the interest of "fair play" and making sure our customers had all the facts, we thought it fair to include his comments here:

If the electronic transfer of the film that you are seeing reveals grain structure...that is, if you are SEEING the film grain, then by definition, you are seeing all of the sharpness that was captured by the film camera. We can’t manufacture sharpness or definition in the telecine process. It is true that in the standard definition home video era, it was common to dial in some electronic edge enhancement to overcome the limitations of NTSC Video and television receivers of that era. And it was common in pre HD transfers to “filter out” the grain giving movies more of a “TV look” which was considered desirable at that time. But the “detail enhancement” they used in that era was erzatz definition....fake. An illusion of detail. Again, if you are seeing “tons of grain” then you are seeing a faithful reproduction of the film element.

American Zoetrope, Francis Coppola’s company does not own (and has never owned) the facilities to do feature film telecine mastering...aka the film transfer. The studio that OWNS the title (in this case Columbia-Sony) owns Dracula and they commissioned and paid for the new transfer in 1996 because they believed that the old one was wanting. I agreed with them. I was post production executive on the film in 1991-1992 and I always was horrified at what the home video and TV editions of Dracula looked like because they were so far from what Coppola and Ballhaus had done for the original release prints. So orange-y. So bright. Zoetrope’s role in the new transfer was to make sure that the transfer colorist had access to a pristine original “final answer print” to screen and refer to. A final answer print is a vaulted 35mm film print in Sony’s possession that bears a signature from the original production indicating that the director or director of photography was satisfied with the color timing and that this print was to be the gold standard...the reference for all 35mm release prints to be compared with and accepted/rejected. It was a controversial answer print at the time. It was dark. The soundtrack was considered very avant-garde. Coppola
was breaking rules. Some critics appreciated it, others did not.

- DVD Empire
by Shannon T. Nutt


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